Frandsen's had a good year at AAA. I'm surprised he wasn't called up earlier, with the troubles Polanco's had and the poor fielding by his replacements.
- Jsaquella

I was surprised to see Frandsen has been hitting over .305 in his last 670+ ABs at Lehigh. That's pretty solid AAA numbers.

Zeid sucks if that's who you're referring to. He won't make their 40 man and won't be picked up. Rosin has much mor potential because he throws 93-96. Joseph is a top 10 catcher prospect and I believe a top 100 prospect. Cosart was bumped up to AAA despite having a horrendous 1.39 WHIP in AA. Small sample in AAA, but his WHIP is 1.759. He still a top prospect, but I think he's dropped from the top 100.
- jstross

No that's the not the player I'm referring to. I'm referring to the player who was overwhelmingly the best asset in the deal.

No that's the not the player I'm referring to. I'm referring to the player who was overwhelmingly the best asset in the deal.
- MJL

I listed Singleton, Cosart, Santana and Zeid so I must be smoking something, LOL. Who am I missing?

No that's the not the player I'm referring to. I'm referring to the player who was overwhelmingly the best asset in the deal.
- MJL

Do you think the Phillies make a change with the manager or keep him around for one more season?

I listed Singleton, Cosart, Santana and Zeid so I must be smoking something, LOL. Who am I missing?
- jstross

The best player in the deal, Pence!

The correct comparison is Pence to the prospects.

By the way, here is how Jim Salisbury who covers the team, described the deals

"On the whole, the talent package that the Phillies received for these two all-star-pedigree players was less than inspiring, especially when measured against what the Phils gave up to get Pence a year ago."

Do you think the Phillies make a change with the manager or keep him around for one more season?
- stveshdy

I think they keep him around.

The best player in the deal, Pence!

The correct comparison is Pence to the prospects.

By the way, here is how Jim Salisbury who covers the team, described the deals

"On the whole, the talent package that the Phillies received for these two all-star-pedigree players was less than inspiring, especially when measured against what the Phils gave up to get Pence a year ago."
- MJL

RAJ needs to step up his game.

The best player in the deal, Pence!

The correct comparison is Pence to the prospects.

By the way, here is how Jim Salisbury who covers the team, described the deals

"On the whole, the talent package that the Phillies received for these two all-star-pedigree players was less than inspiring, especially when measured against what the Phils gave up to get Pence a year ago."
- MJL

Getting other people's prospects is never as exciting or emotional as parting with their own. Seriously if the Phils could go back and Keep Travi D'arnaud and Taylor and send Brown to Toronto in the Halladay trade don't you think they'd do it?

Getting other people's prospects is never as exciting or emotional as parting with their own. Seriously if the Phils could go back and Keep Travi D'arnaud and Taylor and send Brown to Toronto in the Halladay trade don't you think they'd do it?
- jstross

No idea but really irrelevant. Can't make bad trades like the Pence deal.

Getting other people's prospects is never as exciting or emotional as parting with their own. Seriously if the Phils could go back and Keep Travi D'arnaud and Taylor and send Brown to Toronto in the Halladay trade don't you think they'd do it?
- jstross

Remember when they traded Marson, Carrassco, Knapp and Donald to Cleveland? Those guys were suppose to be really good an none turned into anything. Prospects can be tricky sometimes.

Remember when they trade Marson and Donald to Cleveland? Those two guys were suppose to be really good an neither turned into anything. Prospects can be tricky sometimes.
- stveshdy

Prospects the majority of time don't work out. Just the way it is. Let's hope that Dom Brown gets it together.

The best player in the deal, Pence!

The correct comparison is Pence to the prospects.

By the way, here is how Jim Salisbury who covers the team, described the deals

"On the whole, the talent package that the Phillies received for these two all-star-pedigree players was less than inspiring, especially when measured against what the Phils gave up to get Pence a year ago."
- MJL

The Phillies just got 2 of their 6 highest rated prospects and two starters(lindbalm is going to pitch the 7th) for their major league roster and saved $24.5 million in 2013 salary. salisbury is looking at these things in a vacuum which is not surprising.

The Phillies just got 2 of their 6 highest rated prospects and two starters(lindbalm is going to pitch the 7th) for their major league roster and saved $24.5 million in 2013 salary. salisbury is looking at th4se things in a vacuum which is not surprising.
- jstross

No, he's not looking at it a vacuum at all. Read his article. He talks about the financial aspects of the deal. You've vastly overrated the return that the Phillies got. The Pence deal was a financial deal. But a poor baseball deal. As Salisbury alluded to. But hey, maybe he doesn't follow the game that much either.

And I'd like to know how you got that 24.5M figure?

Prospects the majority of time don't work out. Just the way it is. Let's hope that Dom Brown gets it together.
- MJL

The Phillies really need Brown to pan out. They could use a younger player with great skills on this team.

Remember when they traded Marson, Carrassco, Knapp and Donald to Cleveland? Those guys were suppose to be really good an none turned into anything. Prospects can be tricky sometimes.
- stveshdy

Exactly. Schierholtz isn't sexy, but he's a gaurenteed major league player. Just like Lindbalm(sp). Phils got a proven major league player in each deal and a very highly rated prospect in each deal. and more. That's not a bad return.

No, he's not looking at it a vacuum at all. Read his article. He talks about the financial aspects of the deal. You've vastly overrated the return that the Phillies got. The Pence deal was a financial deal. But a poor baseball deal. As Salisbury alluded to. But hey, maybe he doesn't follow the game that much either.
- MJL

Does it amaze you that the Phillies give away all their top prospects when trading for good players but when its their turn they get back decent value and not outstanding value.

No, he's not looking at it a vacuum at all. Read his article. He talks about the financial aspects of the deal. You've vastly overrated the return that the Phillies got. The Pence deal was a financial deal. But a poor baseball deal. As Salisbury alluded to. But hey, maybe he doesn't follow the game that much either.
- MJL

You didn't provide a link so I foolishy assumed you quoted the meat of the article. My bad.

Exactly. Schierholtz isn't sexy, but he's a gaurenteed major league player. Just like Lindbalm(sp). Phils got a proven major league player in each deal and a very highly rated prospect in each deal. and more. That's not a bad return.
- jstross

The return on Victorino was solid.
The return on Pence was average. Getting a C was important though.

I still like what the Phillies did today because they need a change. Doesn't hurt to get some prospects back into the system either.

Does it amaze you that the Phillies give away all their top prospects when trading for good players but when its their turn they get back decent value and not outstanding value.
- stveshdy

I'm okay with the Victorino deal. He's a pending UFA. So they got a decent return for him in that situation. The Pence deal is unacceptable as a fan, in my opinion.

The best player in the deal, Pence!

The correct comparison is Pence to the prospects.

By the way, here is how Jim Salisbury who covers the team, described the deals

"On the whole, the talent package that the Phillies received for these two all-star-pedigree players was less than inspiring, especially when measured against what the Phils gave up to get Pence a year ago."
- MJL

Rube has shown a propensity to buy high and sell low.

He gave Houston our top two prospects for Pence, then replaced him with a catching need he created when he moved Travis d'Arnaud in another buy high/sell low deal in the Halladay/Lee fiasco.

I guess they're not as high on Sebastian Valle as I thought they were.

Does it amaze you that the Phillies give away all their top prospects when trading for good players but when its their turn they get back decent value and not outstanding value.
- stveshdy

It's human nature. The prospects traded always look better than the prospects received. Drabek top 20 is on his 2nd TJ surgery. T. D'Arnaud is the top rated cacthing prospect now. Michael Taylor a top 50 prospect got called up twice and struck out 36% of the time. If you get a ML starter he's worth a lot more than all but a few elite players.

It's human nature. The prospects traded always look better than the prospects received. Drabek top 20 is on his 2nd TJ surgery. T. D'Arnaud is the top rated cacthing prospect now. Michael Taylor a top 50 prospect got called up twice and struck out 36% of the time. If you get a ML starter he's worth a lot more than all but a few elite players.
- jstross

I don't disagree. However, I still rather take my chances getting back top tier prospects and having them fail b/c atleast we got back what others around the league rated high.

Rube has shown a propensity to buy high and sell low.

He gave Houston our top two prospects for Pence, then replaced him with a catching need he created when he moved Travis d'Arnaud in another buy high/sell low deal in the Halladay/Lee fiasco.

I guess they're not as high on Sebastian Valle as I thought they were.
- 77rams

Look at one of Valle or Joseph to be moved to acquire a 3b at some point. You have to hope Valle can get his plate dicsipline under control or he'll be a bust. The power is there.

It's human nature. The prospects traded always look better than the prospects received. Drabek top 20 is on his 2nd TJ surgery. T. D'Arnaud is the top rated cacthing prospect now. Michael Taylor a top 50 prospect got called up twice and struck out 36% of the time. If you get a ML starter he's worth a lot more than all but a few elite players.
- jstross

It's nothing to do with human nature. It's about baseball. And it's now about a huge RH hole in the lineup, again! So how much does it cost to get a 25 HR, 90 RBI RH bat?

Rube has shown a propensity to buy high and sell low.

He gave Houston our top two prospects for Pence, then replaced him with a catching need he created when he moved Travis d'Arnaud in another buy high/sell low deal in the Halladay/Lee fiasco.

I guess they're not as high on Sebastian Valle as I thought they were.
- 77rams

When he traded Lee to Seattle for that garbage return that was just mind boggling.