We can expect an answer to their request in January. If a regular company conducted business they way these two sides are they wouldn't last long. It's a joke the way this has been handled from the start.
- canadianpenfan

How should've the NHL handled the lockout differently?

How should've the NHL handled the lockout differently?
- Flyers_01

For starters? Not selecting a lockout at the main negotiating tactic.

We can expect an answer to their request in January. If a regular company conducted business they way these two sides are they wouldn't last long. It's a joke the way this has been handled from the start.
- canadianpenfan

Clearly there isn't much motivation for either side to cave at this point. I fear we are in for a full season lock out again.

How should've the NHL handled the lockout differently?
- Flyers_01

Started negotiating earlier?

Negotiate more frequently?

Stop trying to win influence in the media and start trying to actually compromise?

Try figuring something out that would've prevented a lockout altogether?

Was that a serious question?

Clearly there isn't much motivation for either side to cave at this point. I fear we are in for a full season lock out again.
- funmaster18

That's just it, it's all about winning at this point. The damage has already been done.

the NHL needs contraction as much as the eagles need a new coach...

the NHL needs contraction as much as the eagles need a new coach...
- isaiah520

I don't think contraction is necessary. Relocation, on the other hand..

I don't think contraction is necessary. Relocation, on the other hand..
- funmaster18

I agree for now, but once this lockout is over contraction might be needed sadly.

I don't think contraction is necessary. Relocation, on the other hand..
- funmaster18

i dunno. this league seemingly has 3-4 financial sad sack franchises every yr.

i dunno. this league seemingly has 3-4 financial sad sack franchises every yr.
- isaiah520

...which could be moved to a more viable destination. It tends to be the same 3-4 teams each year, doesn't it?

So the NHL is now asking for a written statement of all of the desires of the NHLPA for the next CBA. I'm really glad to hear that they came up with this novel concept... In NOVEMBER.


http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=409837
- funmaster18

It's hard to put a fully written proposal on paper when Every written concept large or small is dismissed in it's entirety out of hand.

the NHL needs contraction as much as the eagles need a new coach...
- isaiah520

They're expanding... haven't you heard?

It's hard to put a fully written proposal on paper when Every written concept large or small is dismissed in it's entirety out of hand.
- mayorofangrytown

It's just a real good representation of where the talks are. In the middle of November they are still talking about what each side wants like this entire process and issue is foreign to them.

It's just a real good representation of where the talks are. In the middle of November they are still talking about what each side wants like this entire process and issue is foreign to them.
- funmaster18

Yeah, you know the NHL is talking and they're like, "So where do you think the players are with this CBA? Do you have the concepts they've tabled?"

"I didn't keep them. Didn't you?"

"Well, I didn't really think we'd need them."

"I think they want 65% this season, is that what you remember?"

"I thought they said they were willing to go to 50%."

"Sh!t!!! We better get this in writing."

It's hard to put a fully written proposal on paper when Every written concept large or small is dismissed in it's entirety out of hand.
- mayorofangrytown

I just don't understand how getting a checklist of the PA's desires is going to help. Is the NHL offering to submit their own list? What exactly will be done with this list? Will the NHLPA suddenly be restricted to only negotiating for things on that list? Or is it just a convenient way for to NHL to put together a list of demands they're rejected without actually doing the footwork?

Frankly, I don't see why the NHLPA would ever do this.

Started negotiating earlier?

Negotiate more frequently?

Stop trying to win influence in the media and start trying to actually compromise?

Try figuring something out that would've prevented a lockout altogether?

Was that a serious question?
- canadianpenfan

It was a serious question. Your answer, unfortunately was not.

It was the NHLPA who didn't want to start CBA negotiations early. You also have to realize that getting a new CBA done isn't simply a factor of X hours = NEW CBA. The NHL has never turned down an offer by the NHLPA to negotiate. The main problem is that Fehr has been stalling to put more pressure on the owners. From his showing up late to meetings to disappearing for 30 minutes at a time during negotiations. They have put in plenty of hours into negotiations, the problem is that Fehr seems determined to put as much pressure on the owners as possible before seriously negotiating.

The owners have compromised. They are contributing $211 million to the "make whole" idea the players are fighting over. While the players have agreed, in theory to a 50/50 split they have yet to accept or suggest a realistic method of it happening in the next year or 2.

There were only 3 ways to avoid the lockout : Keeping the status quo, the NHLPA not hiring Fehr, or the end of life on this planet. The owners decided the status quo wouldn't work anymore and the other 2 things didn't happen on their own so there was no way for the lockout not to happen.

It was a serious question. Your answer, unfortunately was not.

It was the NHLPA who didn't want to start CBA negotiations early. You also have to realize that getting a new CBA done isn't simply a factor of X hours = NEW CBA. The NHL has never turned down an offer by the NHLPA to negotiate. The main problem is that Fehr has been stalling to put more pressure on the owners. From his showing up late to meetings to disappearing for 30 minutes at a time during negotiations. They have put in plenty of hours into negotiations, the problem is that Fehr seems determined to put as much pressure on the owners as possible before seriously negotiating.

The owners have compromised. They are contributing $211 million to the "make whole" idea the players are fighting over. While the players have agreed, in theory to a 50/50 split they have yet to accept or suggest a realistic method of it happening in the next year or 2.

There were only 3 ways to avoid the lockout : Keeping the status quo, the NHLPA not hiring Fehr, or the end of life on this planet. The owners decided the status quo wouldn't work anymore and the other 2 things didn't happen on their own so there was no way for the lockout not to happen.
- Flyers_01

My initial response was directed at both parties. I in no way support the NHLPA, just think both parties have done a piss poor job "negotiating".

I just don't understand how getting a checklist of the PA's desires is going to help. Is the NHL offering to submit their own list? What exactly will be done with this list? Will the NHLPA suddenly be restricted to only negotiating for things on that list? Or is it just a convenient way for to NHL to put together a list of demands they're rejected without actually doing the footwork?

Frankly, I don't see why the NHLPA would ever do this.
- BulliesPhan87

I was thinking that both sides should already have a good idea of the other's desires. If they don't, then it's no wonder why we are going nowhere in he middle of November.

It was a serious question. Your answer, unfortunately was not.

It was the NHLPA who didn't want to start CBA negotiations early. You also have to realize that getting a new CBA done isn't simply a factor of X hours = NEW CBA. The NHL has never turned down an offer by the NHLPA to negotiate. The main problem is that Fehr has been stalling to put more pressure on the owners. From his showing up late to meetings to disappearing for 30 minutes at a time during negotiations. They have put in plenty of hours into negotiations, the problem is that Fehr seems determined to put as much pressure on the owners as possible before seriously negotiating.

The owners have compromised. They are contributing $211 million to the "make whole" idea the players are fighting over. While the players have agreed, in theory to a 50/50 split they have yet to accept or suggest a realistic method of it happening in the next year or 2.

There were only 3 ways to avoid the lockout : Keeping the status quo, the NHLPA not hiring Fehr, or the end of life on this planet. The owners decided the status quo wouldn't work anymore and the other 2 things didn't happen on their own so there was no way for the lockout not to happen.
- Flyers_01

I couldn't disagree with this more.

Saying the owners have compromised is like saying the kidnappers compromised by only cutting the fingers off of one hand.

Hopefully he will be fine, I would hate to see Couturier or Schenn take his place. I would like to see Couturier move to wing with G and Hartnell.

I was thinking that both sides should already have a good idea of the other's desires. If they don't, then it's no wonder why we are going nowhere in he middle of November.
- funmaster18

It's all cash. The easy solution would be to work their way to 50%. That's what the owners want and the players have said numerous times they are okay with that split. The problem is the owners want it all now and the players want to see it develop through future revenue growth or another function that freezes salaries until they can get there.

It's all cash. The easy solution would be to work their way to 50%. That's what the owners want and the players have said numerous times they are okay with that split. The problem is the owners want it all now and the players want to see it develop through future revenue growth or another function that freezes salaries until they can get there.
- mayorofangrytown

Right, and both sides know this. So is this another stall tactic by the NHL? One has to wonder what the hell the two sides discuss for days on end on the rare occasion they do meet.

There were only 3 ways to avoid the lockout : Keeping the status quo, the NHLPA not hiring Fehr, or the end of life on this planet.

I don't think keeping the status quo was ever an option. After all, the players are locked out; not on strike. The owners clearly want something in this negotiation.

And by "something", I mean "money".

As for the NHLPA....well, you don't hire a guy like Donald Fehr because you think labor negotiations are going to go smoothly. This is a hire you make because you want to dig your heels in.

Both sides are complicit in this lock out. It's a question of who blinks first.

I was thinking that both sides should already have a good idea of the other's desires. If they don't, then it's no wonder why we are going nowhere in he middle of November.
- funmaster18

I think they're each quite aware of what the other wants. It's just a silly request in an already silly negotiation, just days after the silly suggestion that, "Hey, maybe we should put these already-delayed negotiations off a couple weeks. Y'know, for fun." It's sad, because I don't think the two sides are THAT far off.

Right, and both sides know this. So is this another stall tactic by the NHL? One has to wonder what the hell the two sides discuss for days on end on the rare occasion they do meet.
- funmaster18

You know I have to think they just talk semantics. They are probably arguing like my wife and I where we start with a real problem and end up arguing over whether I said "Our House" or "My house" in the middle of making a point.