They have put them in place, but it's not working so they're trying to modify it. Also, the reason the haven't been able to fully put them in place is due to player resistance, which makes total sense, the owner's shouldn't have full reign over how they pay the players. But if it's not working, it's not working, and the players need to be able to see that. I honestly believe a lot of players do, and this lockout is a result of pre-signed contracts being threatened, which only represents a small percentage of the 700 players as a whole. The rest will make their money and sign to very similar money they would've been making pre lockout.

In terms of escrow, I'm pretty sure the max they could still make would be whatever they were signed for, the check they get would only be to balance out the full value, but yes, it's different than a rollback. Like I said, ideally they should be honouring the contracts, but the way things are structured, if it goes to 50%, that can't happen so the players need to understand that.
- 13sundin13

The players made 104% of their salaries one Season during the last CBA due to escrow. The players are willing to work towards 50/50 and take a lesser percentage going forward. But they want something in return for it. But the League wants concessions on contract issues from the players also.

Molson Canadian is horrible. Moosehead is good.
- Feeling_Glucky

hmm. i wonder if i can find that in buffalo.

what are good beers?
- joshs

scottish heavy, by big rock. it's like 7% alcohol to start, add a little bit of hard liquor like a pimm's cup, or white rum.

Molson Canadian is horrible. Moosehead is good.
- Feeling_Glucky

Molson XXX. If they still make it.

Maybe I have too much hippie in me.

All this talk that it shouldnt matter if a player makes 5 million or 5 dollars, and how it shouldnt matter because nobody likes to have money taken away.

It does matter. A large problem with today's world is greed and not caring about those around you.

Tell me, how many inner city kids would have had the chance to play hockey with all the amount of money lost already?

But apparently thats not reality. Everyone should just accept how things are. I'd love for one of these players to live an "average" life. Then complain. All about perspective.

scottish heavy, by big rock. it's like 7% alcohol to start, add a little bit of hard liquor like a pimm's cup, or white rum.
- Thesource

I had my first beer in a year this week.

One corona, what I used to drink. Ive turned into a lightweight lets just say

Maybe I have too much hippie in me.

All this talk that it shouldnt matter if a player makes 5 million or 5 dollars, and how it shouldnt matter because nobody likes to have money taken away.

It does matter. A large problem with today's world is greed and not caring about those around you.

Tell me, how many inner city kids would have had the chance to play hockey with all the amount of money lost already?

But apparently thats not reality. Everyone should just accept how things are. I'd love for one of these players to live an "average" life. Then complain. All about perspective.
- flyer_nutter

whoa... slow down man... whatever you do don't suggest they donate to charity or anything like that ... that could result in you being called a communist beer league fear mongering self entitled dictator...

i have no idea why i drink such cheap beers lol.

Maybe I have too much hippie in me.

All this talk that it shouldnt matter if a player makes 5 million or 5 dollars, and how it shouldnt matter because nobody likes to have money taken away.

It does matter. A large problem with today's world is greed and not caring about those around you.

Tell me, how many inner city kids would have had the chance to play hockey with all the amount of money lost already?

But apparently thats not reality. Everyone should just accept how things are. I'd love for one of these players to live an "average" life. Then complain. All about perspective.
- flyer_nutter

Wanting to keep what is yours, and what you negotiated for in good faith, is not greed. Nor does it have anything to do with not caring about those around you. That is complete nonsense.

It seems to me that some have a problem with NHL players because they live above an average life. Well in today's World, you have the same opportunity as everyone else does to make something for yourself, and better yourself. And raise yourself above an average life. And if you don't, nobody to blame but yourself. NHL players haven't been handed anything. They earned what they have.

You can certainly make a good argument that the players aren't making the smartest business decision, no doubt. But it seems to me, and please correct me if I'm wrong. That you seem to think that the players should just take what they have and be happy with it. But where does it end? They had a lot taken away from them in the previous lockout. And they stand to lose more in this lockout. What indication is there that when the next CBA ends, it won't happen again. And they lose more? At some point, they have to fight back. I don't see how fighting for what is rightfully yours, is stupid. For putting principle in front of money. And I'm not about to call them stupid for it, while I'm sitting on the sidelines.
- MJL

I've been a union member in a trade union for over 20 years. Now I realize it's taboo to compare it with pro athlete unions, but blue collar trade or pro athlete, all unions pretty much operate under the same premise, and I can tell you from 20 years of experience, union members NEVER stop giving up benefits and being forced to give in to the corporation/owners. That's just the way it works in this day and age. The average CBA now days for any trade union is fight tooth and nail to hang on to anything that wasn't taken or reduced from the last CBA only to have wages frozen or cut and end up paying for a substantially larger portion of health costs while the company eliminates perks and decreases or eliminates pension plans and 401k matching offers.

It's the same all over, only big difference is the PA constituents are millionaires and my union brothers are middle class blue collar tradesmen. No matter what, ownership holds all the cards and eventually gets their way. They lure the labor folks into a sense of apathy and fear, then they put forth their proposals usually conceding a few of the smaller but important to the union issues as window dressing in order to make the union members feel all warm and fuzzy and before anyone knows what's happened, the contract is ratified.

And this ladies and gentlemen, is what we have grown to accept in the flyers forum.
- flyer_nutter

It's a great time

I've been a union member in a trade union for over 20 years. Now I realize it's taboo to compare it with pro athlete unions, but blue collar trade or pro athlete, all unions pretty much operate under the same premise, and I can tell you from 20 years of experience, union members NEVER stop giving up benefits and being forced to give in to the corporation/owners. That's just the way it works in this day and age. The average CBA now days for any trade union is fight tooth and nail to hang on to anything that wasn't taken or reduced from the last CBA only to have wages frozen or cut and end up paying for a substantially larger portion of health costs while the company eliminates perks and decreases or eliminates pension plans and 401k matching offers.

It's the same all over, only big difference is the PA constituents are millionaires and my union brothers are middle class blue collar tradesmen. No matter what, ownership holds all the cards and eventually gets their way. They lure the labor folks into a sense of apathy and fear, then they put forth their proposals usually conceding a few of the smaller but important to the union issues as window dressing in order to make the union members feel all warm and fuzzy and before anyone knows what's happened, the contract is ratified.
- MnGump

Well I hope this "contract" is ratified soon.

Does your trade create Billions in revenue?

whoa... slow down man... whatever you do don't suggest they donate to charity or anything like that ... that could result in you being called a communist beer league fear mongering self entitled dictator...
- Thesource

Haha I have no problem ever being called a communist.

I am not one, but am not afraid of the word. I do believe in a better distribution of wealth and think its wrong for a CEO to have a private plane when one of his employees struggles to pay for diapers. However I also understand why some filthy rich idiot doesnt care if he steps over a homeless man on the way to his mansion.

You know what? I used to think the NHL was something better. That it was more than money.

The only thing that really frustrates me is people saying so what if the players make so much money, every other league has that. It's such a follow the sheep in front of you attitude. I'll ask anyone this, its been brought up that the players need to make a stand, that they cant be taken "advantage" of every 6 years.

Where is the stand from the fans? I will never in my life buy another jersey (I have two), or another NHL ticket. I've only gone to one game as it is, as I live in Winnipeg.

I will watch on tv, but so much of the problems the world is facing is because of people being sheep.

Molson XXX. If they still make it.
- MJL

never been a big seller in Canada. Molson Ex, Canadian and Coors light are their biggest sellers in Canada. Coors light is #2, Molson Canadian is #3 in Canada

Haha I have no problem ever being called a communist.

I am not one, but am not afraid of the word. I do believe in a better distribution of wealth and think its wrong for a CEO to have a private plane when one of his employees struggles to pay for diapers. However I also understand why some filthy rich idiot doesnt care if he steps over a homeless man on the way to his mansion.

You know what? I used to think the NHL was something better. That it was more than money.

The only thing that really frustrates me is people saying so what if the players make so much money, every other league has that. It's such a follow the sheep in front of you attitude. I'll ask anyone this, its been brought up that the players need to make a stand, that they cant be taken "advantage" of every 6 years.

Where is the stand from the fans? I will never in my life buy another jersey (I have two), or another NHL ticket. I've only gone to one game as it is, as I live in Winnipeg.

I will watch on tv, but so much of the problems the world is facing is because of people being sheep.
- flyer_nutter

It's not a follow the sheep attitude. It's reality. The players make the money they do, because they are the product that generates billions. And they have a unique skill set that has people willing to pay a lot of money to see them play. That's how the World works. The more revenue you can generate, the more you get paid. The more you're worth

Wanting to keep what is yours, and what you negotiated for in good faith, is not greed. Nor does it have anything to do with not caring about those around you. That is complete nonsense.

It seems to me that some have a problem with NHL players because they live above an average life. Well in today's World, you have the same opportunity as everyone else does to make something for yourself, and better yourself. And raise yourself above an average life. And if you don't, nobody to blame but yourself. NHL players haven't been handed anything. They earned what they have.
- MJL

I'll give you a little bit of factual information here son. As you think what I say is nonsense and you will never be banned for it as its just a way of being a "smart bumhole".

Not everyone can raise themselves up. If you are born into poverty, you often cannot get enough money to pay for higher education. Even with grants, scholarships or student loans. You may have the education money, but then not enough to survive.

I am currently going through this myself. Dont give me some rich person BS about how the world is what you make of it. These players have it good, and will always have it damn good. They need to realise it. Maybe one day as a nurse I will have the ability to wipe their ass, and they can tell me just how hard they have had it and how taken advantage of they were.

Wanting to keep what is yours, and what you negotiated for in good faith, is not greed. Nor does it have anything to do with not caring about those around you. That is complete nonsense.

It seems to me that some have a problem with NHL players because they live above an average life. Well in today's World, you have the same opportunity as everyone else does to make something for yourself, and better yourself. And raise yourself above an average life. And if you don't, nobody to blame but yourself. NHL players haven't been handed anything. They earned what they have.
- MJL

No actually

What percentage of the population can afford to have kids play hockey at levels trending to the NHL ?

I mean, in the broad sense, OK you can't afford hockey, but you could make millions designing video games or something like that ? but what if you're simply physically gifted and not intellectually gifted ... and poor

and there are lots of people to blame... we're influenced by others every day since birth

It's not a follow the sheep attitude. It's reality. The players make the money they do, because they are the product that generates billions. And they have a unique skill set that has people willing to pay a lot of money to see them play. That's how the World works. The more revenue you can generate, the more you get paid. The more you're worth
- MJL

The reality is the follow the sheep attitude?

You like seeing social programs cut nation wide and veterans struggling? While knowing these idiots making a minimum of 500k? Then seeing them complain?

I will never defend that. Or support it further with my money.

Haha I have no problem ever being called a communist.

I am not one, but am not afraid of the word. I do believe in a better distribution of wealth and think its wrong for a CEO to have a private plane when one of his employees struggles to pay for diapers. However I also understand why some filthy rich idiot doesnt care if he steps over a homeless man on the way to his mansion.

You know what? I used to think the NHL was something better. That it was more than money.

The only thing that really frustrates me is people saying so what if the players make so much money, every other league has that. It's such a follow the sheep in front of you attitude. I'll ask anyone this, its been brought up that the players need to make a stand, that they cant be taken "advantage" of every 6 years.

Where is the stand from the fans? I will never in my life buy another jersey (I have two), or another NHL ticket. I've only gone to one game as it is, as I live in Winnipeg.

I will watch on tv, but so much of the problems the world is facing is because of people being sheep.
- flyer_nutter

yeah its messed up. the rich are getting richer and everyone else are getting more poor. capitalism is living long enough to see itself fail. society needs a better system.

No actually

What percentage of the population can afford to have kids play hockey at levels trending to the NHL ?

I mean, in the broad sense, OK you can't afford hockey, but you could make millions designing video games or something like that ? but what if you're simply physically gifted and not intellectually gifted ... and poor

and there are lots of people to blame... we're influenced by others every day since birth
- Thesource

Yes actually. You make your own path in life. Anything else is just an excuse. Plenty of poor disadvantaged people have gone on to have very successful lives and made something for themselves. So many want to disparage NHL players because they make a lot of money. Well they earned that money.

The reality is the follow the sheep attitude?

You like seeing social programs cut nation wide and veterans struggling? While knowing these idiots making a minimum of 500k? Then seeing them complain?

I will never defend that. Or support it further with my money.
- flyer_nutter

NHL players have zero to do with social programs being cut, or veterans struggling. Blame the Government for that. Player's aren't complaining.

No actually

What percentage of the population can afford to have kids play hockey at levels trending to the NHL ?
I mean, in the broad sense, OK you can't afford hockey, but you could make millions designing video games or something like that ? but what if you're simply physically gifted and not intellectually gifted ... and poor

and there are lots of people to blame... we're influenced by others every day since birth
- Thesource

Dont tell those with fancy cars this.

I would have loved to play in the NHL. Unfortunately never was in a position to have the equiptment. Thats just the way it is I guess though eh?

I'll give those who think that a history lesson. French Revolution. When pushed hard enough, and with the middle class shrinking as it is and the big wigs just getting richer and richer, we will see.

Yes actually. You make your own path in life. Anything else is just an excuse. Plenty of poor disadvantaged people have gone on to have very successful lives and made something for themselves. So many want to disparage NHL players because they make a lot of money. Well they earned that money.
- MJL

I love the smugness.

You would have bought me my hockey equiptment eh?

NHL players have zero to do with social programs being cut, or veterans struggling. Blame the Government for that. Player's aren't complaining.
- MJL

If I am an NHL player making a minimum of 500k.

Knowing that information about how the rest of society is struggling.

I keep my mouth shut, and take the money. ENTITLED idiots. This has nothing to do with blaming anyone but the fans who think the players have a point here. Have Crosby it to a vet who is struggling.

I'll give you a little bit of factual information here son. As you think what I say is nonsense and you will never be banned for it as its just a way of being a "smart bumhole".

Not everyone can raise themselves up. If you are born into poverty, you often cannot get enough money to pay for higher education. Even with grants, scholarships or student loans. You may have the education money, but then not enough to survive.

I am currently going through this myself. Dont give me some rich person BS about how the world is what you make of it. These players have it good, and will always have it damn good. They need to realise it. Maybe one day as a nurse I will have the ability to wipe their ass, and they can tell me just how hard they have had it and how taken advantage of they were.
- flyer_nutter

You make your own path in life. Anything else is an excuse. Lots of poor people have raised above it. That's the real World son. It isn't rich person BS, it's reality. You don't think NHL players have come from poor families that struggled? You act like they've been handed what they have. They've earned every dime they have.