Adding an elite talent like Nash certainly helps the Rangers on paper, but they did lose 2 quality glue guys in Dubinsky and Anisimov. Rangers will likely win the trade in long run, but it's still TBD.

Lundqvist pulled in the home opener. Ouch. I don't get the King nickname. Calling anyone "King" before they win a Championship is foolish.

I'm still of the opinion that it's too early to judge things, unless one is grading on a curve.

Guys who have been fighting the puck-Timonen, Coburn, hell even Giroux-haven't been playing or stopped playing weeks ago. They will get better and be OK, based on their histories.

The thing is, when the passing gets more crisp, and the conditioning gets back to where it needs to be, and there's more cohesion, then it can be fairly judged.

When a guy like Vanek gets a breakaway because two forwards try to score on a 5 on 3, it has nothing to do with the speed of the defense. When an ill-advised cross ice pass is picked off by an opposing player, who already has a head of steam, not many guys are going to catch him.

Even the penalties the defense took yesterday didn't seem to me to be a speed issue. They seemed more lazy or dumb than desperate.

Couts days are numbered.
- JoeRussomanno

unfortunately he is the trade chip that would bring back the biggest return in terms of D. I just cant see them trading B Schenn after getting Luke.

Unless we could package Read along with a prospect/pick???

???
- Pecafan Fan

We need a defenseman with pep in his step, and an abundance of centers. I think laughton's emergence makes it a lot easier Homers mind.

It's not what I think I'm seeing. It's what I know I'm seeing. He played well over the weekend. Made a few mistakes that you would expect from a young defenseman on a new team. But you can see the ability that he has. Most importantly, is that he is not a slow footed as many advertise him to be.
- MJL

youre reaching a level of assessment that is premature based on a very limited sample of ice time. let's wait till about midseason, when everyone is in shape and then we can make evaluations on a level playing field. this applies to positive conclusions every bit as much as negative ones.

Did you even see the fight Hartnell hit him once with a good punch that did not take him down. Hartnell got the "win" if your looking at it that way. But to see a guy that has not dropped the gloves in 3 years shows something. And for everyone crying about the goals being disallowed, those breaks happen for every team throughout the year. It just so happens they went that way for Buffalo.
- Dwight K. Schrute

Twice in one game doesn't happen all the time. How would you have felt if they took back the goal and said it was kicking motion? You wouldn't just say it happens all the time, you know it.

We need a defenseman with pep in his step, and an abundance of centers. I think laughton's emergence makes it a lot easier Homers mind.
- JoeRussomanno

I'd move Voracek before moving Couturier as I think Couturier will be better in the long run.

Actually, my thinking goes back to last year's playoff. I predicted that Ottawa was going to knock off the Rangers. I believe that Tortarella put in a smoke and mirrors system based on great team play, very hard work and he was able to convince his players that the team was deeper and more talented than it really was. Something he effectively did in Tampa as well. I thought they would be exposed in the playoffs as not being nearly as tough or as talented as their press clippings. I was actually surprised they got by Ottawa.

This year everyone is ready for the Tortalrella scam. Other teams will play them tough, they will wear down and the wheels will come off. As I said, I think they make the playoffs but I would rather be going into this season with Prust rather than Nash.
- spatso

There is a serious contradiction here. A smoke and mirror system based on great team play. How can great team play, be smoke and mirrors? LOL

Look at the team and what they actually have, rather then just making shot in the dark statements that the wheels will come off. Who would you rather be trying to add at the trade deadline to fill a need? A Prust or a Nash?

A beating? Watch the fight. One landed punch is not a beating.
- Dwight K. Schrute

Just watched it and looks like hartnell landed one real solid shot maybe two and 2-3 other grazing/helmet shots. Stafford didnt land a single blow.

Was a back and forth game. Buffalo controlled the majority of the first period. Philly came out on fire in the second. The teams literally switched roles. That late 5 on 3 goal hurt the Flyers. I think fatigue definitely cost you guys in the third period. The game opened up a little bit and those last 5 minutes Buffalo was just fresher.

On the fight, Stafford took a solid punch to the jaw, but other than that 1 punch, he didnt get his ass "thoroughly kicked". To me, getting your ass thoroughly kicked is eating at least 5 punches and getting knocked down without ever really having a chance. He was able to at least get some punches off and wasnt defending the entire time.

The referee made a discretionary call that is in the rule book for the first disallowed goal. Rule 78.5: Disallowed goals - (v) When an attacking player has interfered with a goalkeeper in his goal crease. Its not a goaltender interference penalty. Its an interference with the goalie to prevent him making a save. It wasnt necessarily a blown call, moreso than it was a weak call. Similar to a defenseman poke checking the puck by swinging his stick but then also clipping the opponents feet for tripping. By rule a tripping, but he clearly was going for the puck and got it first so should it be called? I've seen it go both ways.
- theblueandgold

The first no goal was terrible. The one view clearly shows Fedotenko skate by without making contact. The reason miller goes backwards is because he knew the puck was in the air and tried to go back to keep it out.. clear as day.. BUT, that stuff happens. Im not concerned with those calls right now. It may have made a difference, but its over and there are bigger issues that the team can adjust and fix.

As for the stafford fight.. two big punches landed, and a few of the normal fight punches did as well. Stafford did do a good job stepping up and wrestling him down, although it was Scott Hartnell (down).

We need a defenseman with pep in his step, and an abundance of centers. I think laughton's emergence makes it a lot easier Homers mind.
- JoeRussomanno

i'd sooner trade the schenn bros...to MTL of course, for you-know-who and a replacement forward to even out the deal

Adding an elite talent like Nash certainly helps the Rangers on paper, but they did lose 2 quality glue guys in Dubinsky and Anisimov. Rangers will likely win the trade in long run, but it's still TBD.

Lundqvist pulled in the home opener. Ouch. I don't get the King nickname. Calling anyone "King" before they win a Championship is foolish.
- PLindbergh31

Dont forget Prust.

I'm still of the opinion that it's too early to judge things, unless one is grading on a curve.

Guys who have been fighting the puck-Timonen, Coburn, hell even Giroux-haven't been playing or stopped playing weeks ago. They will get better and be OK, based on their histories.

The thing is, when the passing gets more crisp, and the conditioning gets back to where it needs to be, and there's more cohesion, then it can be fairly judged.

When a guy like Vanek gets a breakaway because two forwards try to score on a 5 on 3, it has nothing to do with the speed of the defense. When an ill-advised cross ice pass is picked off by an opposing player, who already has a head of steam, not many guys are going to catch him.

Even the penalties the defense took yesterday didn't seem to me to be a speed issue. They seemed more lazy or dumb than desperate.
- Jsaquella

You know I respect your opinion but on this one I think you might be wrong. Speed is measured in two ways. The actual physical speed that a player can execute and play the game. And, more important, the speed that a #1 Dman is able to think the game as it unfolds in front of him. In his day, Timonen had both the physical and mental capacity to play the #1 position. He has lost a step. I don't think there is anyone else on the team who has the ability to play and think the game at the speed a #1 needs to be able to play at. Without that you will have trouble getting the puck out of your own end and a real problem on the power play.

But, I think Holmgren will fix that in the next few weeks.

I'm still of the opinion that it's too early to judge things, unless one is grading on a curve.

Guys who have been fighting the puck-Timonen, Coburn, hell even Giroux-haven't been playing or stopped playing weeks ago. They will get better and be OK, based on their histories.

The thing is, when the passing gets more crisp, and the conditioning gets back to where it needs to be, and there's more cohesion, then it can be fairly judged.

When a guy like Vanek gets a breakaway because two forwards try to score on a 5 on 3, it has nothing to do with the speed of the defense. When an ill-advised cross ice pass is picked off by an opposing player, who already has a head of steam, not many guys are going to catch him.

Even the penalties the defense took yesterday didn't seem to me to be a speed issue. They seemed more lazy or dumb than desperate.
- Jsaquella

Agreed. 2 games isn't nearly a large enough sample size to make any long term prognosis. Especially since these guys had 6 days of camp and no exhibition games to build any cohesion.

Being that it's only a 48 game schedule and all games are conference games, teams that get off to slow starts are going to be fighting an uphill battle all year.

I'd move Voracek before moving Couturier as I think Couturier will be better in the long run.
- Pecafan Fan

I would too but who gets a better return?

youre reaching a level of assessment that is premature based on a very limited sample of ice time. let's wait till about midseason, when everyone is in shape and then we can make evaluations on a level playing field. this applies to positive conclusions every bit as much as negative ones.
- isaiah520

It's not premature at all. I'm not making a statement that I think Luke Schenn is a top defenseman, or has arrived, or anything to that level. I'm simply saying that first impressions of him are positive. And I like what I've seen so far. Nothing premature about that. I think it's obvious that you have a biased preconceived perception of the player. You've already labeled the trade a bad trade, before the Season started. Same as you've done previously for other moves Holmgren has made in the past. Before even seeing the player, play. I'm basing my initial impression on the player actually playing.

Dont forget Prust.
- Stinkfitz

Yup. Prust wasn't part of the Nash trade, but he was a quality player. Good PK guy. Losing him hurts them.

Couts days are numbered.
- JoeRussomanno

Couturier is going nowhere. The quality of defensemen necessary to get him is just not available. Look for a trade along the lines of Matt Carle from Tampa Bay; a talented but struggling player on possibly a high priced contract.

i'd sooner trade the schenn bros...to MTL of course, for you-know-who and a replacement forward to even out the deal
- isaiah520

Yea but who do you think Montreal wants?

I would too but who gets a better return?
- JoeRussomanno

Depends on who you're dealing with.
A team desperate for immediate help may want to pay quite a bit for Voracek.
He can come on a team and play on the top 6 from day 1.

Pretty good value imho.

There is a serious contradiction here. A smoke and mirror system based on great team play. How can great team play, be smoke and mirrors? LOL

Look at the team and what they actually have, rather then just making shot in the dark statements that the wheels will come off. Who would you rather be trying to add at the trade deadline to fill a need? A Prust or a Nash?
- MJL

Armies have won great victories having been convinced by a good tactical commander that they were stronger than they really were. Short teerm it is possible, long term it is called smoke and mirrors. The evidence will be in the scoreboard and I have no doubt you will remind me if the Rangers come close to the Pens.

You know I respect your opinion but on this one I think you might be wrong. Speed is measured in two ways. The actual physical speed that a player can execute and play the game. And, more important, the speed that a #1 Dman is able to think the game as it unfolds in front of him. In his day, Timonen had both the physical and mental capacity to play the #1 position. He has lost a step. I don't think there is anyone else on the team who has the ability to play and think the game at the speed a #1 needs to be able to play at. Without that you will have trouble getting the puck out of your own end and a real problem on the power play.

But, I think Holmgren will fix that in the next few weeks.
- spatso

You honestly believe that there is going to be a player made available in the next few weeks that fits the description you give here on a #1 defenseman? Any players you want to name that are a possibility?

Armies have won great victories having been convinced by a good tactical commander that they were stronger than they really were. Short teerm it is possible, long term it is called smoke and mirrors. The evidence will be in the scoreboard and I have no doubt you will remind me if the Rangers come close to the Pens.
- spatso

So what the Rangers actually have in their lineup, doesn't factor in? You're going to go with Patton or Sun Tzu?

You know I respect your opinion but on this one I think you might be wrong. Speed is measured in two ways. The actual physical speed that a player can execute and play the game. And, more important, the speed that a #1 Dman is able to think the game as it unfolds in front of him. In his day, Timonen had both the physical and mental capacity to play the #1 position. He has lost a step. I don't think there is anyone else on the team who has the ability to play and think the game at the speed a #1 needs to be able to play at. Without that you will have trouble getting the puck out of your own end and a real problem on the power play.

But, I think Holmgren will fix that in the next few weeks.
- spatso

Timonen is playing his first games since May, and had off season back surgery. I think expecting him to step back in after nearly 7 months and immediately play to his normal standards is being unrealistic.

I do agree if Timonen doesn't make strides to get back, Holmgren will act, because that is what Holmgren does. I'm simply saying that I feel once the overall play becomes more crisp, as guys get their feel back and shake off the rust, we can better see exactly where the issues lie.

Excuse or not, I've seen at least 3 pucks roll off the stick of Claude Giroux this weekend. That doesn't happen if he's not a bit rusty-and he actually played during the lockout. Guys like Timonen, Coburn, Hartnell and Luke Schenn did not. That has to be a factor in the assessment of the team.

Timonen is playing his first games since May, and had off season back surgery. I think expecting him to step back in after nearly 7 months and immediately play to his normal standards is being unrealistic.

I do agree if Timonen doesn't make strides to get back, Holmgren will act, because that is what Holmgren does. I'm simply saying that I feel once the overall play becomes more crisp, as guys get their feel back and shake off the rust, we can better see exactly where the issues lie.

Excuse or not, I've seen at least 3 pucks roll off the stick of Claude Giroux this weekend. That doesn't happen if he's not a bit rusty-and he actually played during the lockout. Guys like Timonen, Coburn, Hartnell and Luke Schenn did not. That has to be a factor in the assessment of the team.
- Jsaquella

There is no question that the Flyers haven't been sharp. It seems as though other teams have been sharper. All teams are in the same situation, so I don't know why that is different. Just look at the defense. Neither Timonen or Coburn is playing at the level they can play at. Meszaros understandably kept his game simple and didn't push his play. But he looked very encouraging out there. As he get's more and more comfortable, he will exert himself more on the offensive side of the puck, and look to join the rush more.
Some of the young players aren't paying as well as they can.