G needs to step up not talk to the media about the team not showing up. He has the C now so he needs to lead this team. He needs to start with himself.

G needs to step up not talk to the media about the team not showing up. He has the C now so he needs to lead this team. He needs to start with himself.
- LJF

Talking about it, but not walking the walk, erodes credibility.

The big moves are exciting, but there's times I'd like to see less of it.

The biggest organizational issue with the Flyers is that they always seem to be chasing somebody else's approach. For years they tried to outmuscle the Devils, then post lockout, they tried to out speed the Sabres. then out tough the Bruins, now it seems they're trying to be the Devils again, based on what owner Ed Snider said before this season began.
- Jsaquella

Yea I can understand that you just wanna see the big trade sometimes when you know the only thing your team is going to do every deadline is add a depth defender for the playoffs the move im really looking this year is if we keep up the pace to get a pick in the top 10 for this years draft because we have to give up our first either this year or next because of the kovy signing i think it would go along way to solidifying our future with Lou probably not sticking around after Marty is done

I hate to say it but I think lavvy has to go. His teams here are consistently not ready to start game no matter the personnel.
- twotoekenn

I'd rather see Homer tinker with the makeup of this team just a bit before going back to the future with Terry Murray.

Lavy is a great coach, and there just aren't too many of them around.

And a point I want to make, is how fast things can change in this League. That wasn't that long ago. Don't like the defense now. Just wait a little bit. It's bound to change. Give Holmgren a chance. He's proven he can do it.
- MJL

My only worry is that we continue to lose and Homer has to deal from a place of weakness or panic. As you say, the whole thing can change quickly.

Yea I can understand that you just wanna see the big trade sometimes when you know the only thing your team is going to do every deadline is add a depth defender for the playoffs the move im really looking this year is if we keep up the pace to get a pick in the top 10 for this years draft because we have to give up our first either this year or next because of the kovy signing i think it would go along way to solidifying our future with Lou probably not sticking around after Marty is done
- blizzzard

I think that the first rounder they give up over the Kovalchuk deal will be 2014. the Devils hosting the draft this year, would be odd to not have that pick.

I was surprised they didn't void the 1st rounder in this past draft, being at 29.

I think that the first rounder they give up over the Kovalchuk deal will be 2014. the Devils hosting the draft this year, would be odd to not have that pick.

I was surprised they didn't void the 1st rounder in this past draft, being at 29.
- Jsaquella

Me too but Matteau has suprised me this year I think he could end up being a top six but I have only seen a small sample size and for someone who didn't even make the USA squad I am pretty impressed

My only worry is that we continue to lose and Homer has to deal from a place of weakness or panic. As you say, the whole thing can change quickly.
- Hextall271

Well, if he can get some vets to waive their NMC/NTC, he could be dealing from strength.

G needs to step up not talk to the media about the team not showing up. He has the C now so he needs to lead this team. He needs to start with himself.
- LJF

Agreed.. He's been invisible. He's not leading by example.

Me too but Matteau has suprised me this year I think he could end up being a top six but I have only seen a small sample size and for someone who didn't even make the USA squad I am pretty impressed
- blizzzard

He was a very good grab at 29. He's played well and his bloodlines are good

Well, if he can get some vets to waive their NMC/NTC, he could be dealing from strength.
- Jsaquella

Well the re-signing of Timonen takes away a piece that could've netted a valuable return at the deadline.

Agreed.. He's been invisible. He's not leading by example.
- Hextall271

Let's face it, none of the "leadership group" is stepping up. Briere, Coburn, Talbot...it's been invisible.

Well the re-signing of Timonen takes away a piece that could've netted a valuable return at the deadline.
- MJL

True. I'm still OK with re-signing him. There's nothing in the UFA market that interests me, and any team with a good, young puck moving defenseman isn't moving him for a rental.

True. I'm still OK with re-signing him. There's nothing in the UFA market that interests me, and any team with a good, young puck moving defenseman isn't moving him for a rental.
- Jsaquella

I'm basically okay with it. I have some doubts. I think there are mostly positives, but some negatives also.

I don't see 3.5M to 4.5M for defensive defenseman as overspending in today's market. And it's real easy to have that philosophy when you have Nik Lidstrom.
- MJL

They are paying a hefty price for a group of not so dynamic defenseman. That being said Im glad Carle isn't here on the contract he got.

They are paying a hefty price for a group of not so dynamic defenseman. That being said Im glad Carle isn't here on the contract he got.
- Just5

agreed ... I regret not having Jagr way more than not having Carle.

I'm basically okay with it. I have some doubts. I think there are mostly positives, but some negatives also.
- MJL

I hate the cap hit, but looking around there's not many other options. Can't see the UFA vets taking big pay cuts to come here, and probably they'd want an extra year added on the deal, which means less cash to re-sign Giroux, Couturier, Schenn & Read.

The RFA guys, you'd have to overpay in years and cash in an offer sheet, or trade valuable assets to acquire and then sign to big deals.

If read keeps on his tear and someone is willing to pony up a mid to late first rounder at the deadline. Should flyers do it? Tough call

Bill,

When does someone come out and say that in order for the team as it is made up is not good enough. Even with Hartnell and Mez, the blue line is too thin, there is not enough consistent board work by the wings and frankly...there is too little desire to go into the dirty places.

It is just beyond frustrating...the more you look, the more glaring issues become and the harder to see a way out.
- wbon22

I don't entirely buy that. There is a lot of parity in the NHL, especially when you are talking about roughly 6th to 12th place in the regular season.

Even some of the best teams may not have eye-popping rosters on paper but they manage to be more than the sum of their parts. They have an identity. They have cohesion. The Devils are the ultimate example.

Have you looked at New Jersey's roster? How deep is their blueline on paper? How many high-end puck movers do they have? Apart from Kovalchuk, how many genuine "superstar" forwards -- not just good ones, but franchise caliber ones -- do they have? How good has Martin Brodeur looked each of the last two seasons when he's actually been tested?

What they DO have is a relentless forecheck, a good mix of veterans and young players, outstanding coaching, and above all a teamwide commitment to two-way hockey. The roster is set up to play a certain way, Pete DeBoer reinforces it through his system and the players execute it. No more and no less.

Let's say you could put David Clarkson on the Flyers. I bet you he wouldn't have 10 goals right now, even though he'd be on Giroux's line. He might have a couple more than Simmonds (let's say six or seven) doing the same role, but the team's record would not be markedly better.

Conversely, let's say we swapped all six of New Jersey's starting defenseman for all six of the Flyers' (Meszaros injury included). Might the team have a win or two fewer right now? Maybe, maybe not. But they wouldn't be markedly worse; I feel very confident in saying that.

Now where would the Flyers be if they had NJ's entire D corps? They'd probably still be 6-9-1 and people would be saying "you can't win with this defense!"

So it's NOT just the personnel here. It's also the assembly of said personnel and the usage of it. What is this year's team's "winning hockey identity"?

Are they a skating team? A wear-down-the-opposition cycling team? Are they a club that is comfortable in low-scoring games? Are they are a team that should be high-scoring (ala last season)? Really, they've been none of the above.

Peter Laviolette wants the team to play one way, although his blueline really isn't built to do it and they don't have blazing speed up front. Meanwhile, upper management made VERY clear they want the team to play grind-it-out, two-way hockey but the forward corps on the whole is a little undersized to do it and too many of the "scoring forwards" (Briere, Simmonds, Brayden Schenn come to mind) have some defensive deficiencies.

So this year's Flyers have kind of tried to be a hybrid team, and it hasn't really worked.

They are paying a hefty price for a group of not so dynamic defenseman. That being said Im glad Carle isn't here on the contract he got.
- Just5

If the circumstances were different, and the Flyers didn't need a #1 defenseman, I would have been fine with Carle and the contract he got. And one of the biggest reasons why the Flyers are paying that hefty price as you put it, is because of letting Carle walk. He would make the defense more"dynamic".

Let's face it, none of the "leadership group" is stepping up. Briere, Coburn, Talbot...it's been invisible.
- Jsaquella

True but G wears the C he needs to step up. We also might be seeing just how important Hartnell is to this team.

The following is a repeat of what I posted yesterday, with a few minor changes. I think it bears repeating.


Please don't make a panic move Homer!! The Flyer's struggles are a combo of growing pains for the young forwards and injuries and lack of depth on the D.

They will struggle this year, and may very well miss the playoffs. It's not the end of the world!! They have their 1st round pick this year, it will most likely be somewhere between 8-16 and they should be able to get a very good player with that pick.
While most seem to want them to grab a defenseman, I would rather see them take the best available forward. Before you all freak out on me, lets look at some facts. First their track record at picking forwards in the 1st round over the last dozen years or so is excellent: Gagne, Williams, Carter,Richards, Giroux, JVR are all pretty damn good players and Couturier and Laughton look they will be pretty good too.

However the organization has never drafted well on D and any scout will tell you it is much harder to judge the upside of an 18 year old Dman than an 18 year old forward.

Coburn, Timonen, Schenn and Grossmann is not a bad start to your top 6. To me most of Coburns struggles are due to being paired with a journeyman like Gervais while being asked to match up against other teams top lines. Trade Mez along with perhaps 2014's first and a prospect for a better more durable defenseman and buyout Briere so you can afford to sign a decent free agent defenseman and you will have a very solid top 6.

Add that to a one year older group of very good forwards with a healthy Hartnell and a relaxed and solid Bryz and there is no reason the Flyers can't contend next year. Also if they are out of it at the deadline, I would consider moving the following players for draft choices:
Talbot - should get them a late 2nd from a contender
Fedotenko- should get them a late 3rd from a contender
Gervais-should get them a 4th or 5th from a team looking to add defensive depth for a playoff run.

Thoughts anyone?

I don't entirely buy that. There is a lot of parity in the NHL, especially when you are talking about roughly 6th to 12th place in the regular season.

Even some of the best teams may not have eye-popping rosters on paper but they manage to be more than the sum of their parts. They have an identity. They have cohesion. The Devils are the ultimate example.

Have you looked at New Jersey's roster? How deep is their blueline on paper? How many high-end puck movers do they have? Apart from Kovalchuk, how many genuine "superstar" forwards -- not just good ones, but franchise caliber ones -- do they have? How good has Martin Brodeur looked each of the last two seasons when he's actually been tested?

What they DO have is a relentless forecheck, a good mix of veterans and young players, outstanding coaching, and above all a teamwide commitment to two-way hockey. The roster is set up to play a certain way, Pete DeBoer reinforces it through his system and the players execute it. No more and no less.

Let's say you could put David Clarkson on the Flyers. I bet you he wouldn't have 10 goals right now, even though he'd be on Giroux's line. He might have a couple more than Simmonds (let's say six or seven) doing the same role, but the team's record would not be markedly better.

Conversely, let's say we swapped all six of New Jersey's starting defenseman for all six of the Flyers' (Meszaros injury included). Might the team have a win or two fewer right now? Maybe, maybe not. But they wouldn't be markedly worse; I feel very confident in saying that.

Now where would the Flyers be if they had NJ's entire D corps? They'd probably still be 6-9-1 and people would be saying "you can't win with this defense!"

So it's NOT just the personnel here. It's also the assembly of said personnel and the usage of it. What is this year's team's "winning hockey identity"?

Are they a skating team? A wear-down-the-opposition cycling team? Are they a club that is comfortable in low-scoring games? Are they are a team that should be high-scoring (ala last season)? Really, they've been none of the above.

Peter Laviolette wants the team to play one way, although his blueline really isn't built to do it and they don't have blazing speed up front. Meanwhile, upper management made VERY clear they want the team to play grind-it-out, two-way hockey but the forward corps on the whole is a little undersized to do it and too many of the "scoring forwards" (Briere, Simmonds, Brayden Schenn come to mind) have some defensive deficiencies.

So this year's Flyers have kind of tried to be a hybrid team, and it hasn't really worked.
- bmeltzer

Very well thought out, and all of that is true. Especially the 4th paragraph.But here's the kicker, if you want the Flyers to play the way the Devils do. There is one choice to be made. Fire Laviolette, and bring in another Coach. He is not going to play that way. And if that happens. I'm putting that on Holmgren's head.

True but G wears the C he needs to step up. We also might be seeing just how important Hartnell is to this team.
- LJF

No doubt Hartnell is important. I think too much is made of that stupid C. Especially since he's a younger guy & first time captain, Giroux needs the other members of the leadership group to step up as well. Part of the reason Briere and Timonen are so highly paid is to bring leadership.

I don't entirely buy that. There is a lot of parity in the NHL, especially when you are talking about roughly 6th to 12th place in the regular season.

Even some of the best teams may not have eye-popping rosters on paper but they manage to be more than the sum of their parts. They have an identity. They have cohesion. The Devils are the ultimate example.

Have you looked at New Jersey's roster? How deep is their blueline on paper? How many high-end puck movers do they have? Apart from Kovalchuk, how many genuine "superstar" forwards -- not just good ones, but franchise caliber ones -- do they have? How good has Martin Brodeur looked each of the last two seasons when he's actually been tested?

What they DO have is a relentless forecheck, a good mix of veterans and young players, outstanding coaching, and above all a teamwide commitment to two-way hockey. The roster is set up to play a certain way, Pete DeBoer reinforces it through his system and the players execute it. No more and no less.

Let's say you could put David Clarkson on the Flyers. I bet you he wouldn't have 10 goals right now, even though he'd be on Giroux's line. He might have a couple more than Simmonds (let's say six or seven) doing the same role, but the team's record would not be markedly better.

Conversely, let's say we swapped all six of New Jersey's starting defenseman for all six of the Flyers' (Meszaros injury included). Might the team have a win or two fewer right now? Maybe, maybe not. But they wouldn't be markedly worse; I feel very confident in saying that.

Now where would the Flyers be if they had NJ's entire D corps? They'd probably still be 6-9-1 and people would be saying "you can't win with this defense!"

So it's NOT just the personnel here. It's also the assembly of said personnel and the usage of it. What is this year's team's "winning hockey identity"?

Are they a skating team? A wear-down-the-opposition cycling team? Are they a club that is comfortable in low-scoring games? Are they are a team that should be high-scoring (ala last season)? Really, they've been none of the above.

Peter Laviolette wants the team to play one way, although his blueline really isn't built to do it and they don't have blazing speed up front. Meanwhile, upper management made VERY clear they want the team to play grind-it-out, two-way hockey but the forward corps on the whole is a little undersized to do it and too many of the "scoring forwards" (Briere, Simmonds, Brayden Schenn come to mind) have some defensive deficiencies.

So this year's Flyers have kind of tried to be a hybrid team, and it hasn't really worked.
- bmeltzer

It seems to me that if the Flyers want a grinding 2 way team they need both some more size up front and most likely a new coach.