I know, that's why I added "right?" at the end. Sort of an allusion to the whole Weber ordeal.
- NickTheKid87

I think it starts with 30th and then upward, going through all 28 other teams.

The Flyers simply don't need a defenseman bad enough for me (so far from what I see this year) to be willing to part with Couts. Unless of course blows me away. Couts goes nowhere.

Did you read the part about Briere being on the ice for many more goals against in the playoffs over the last 2 years? I realize you are a big Briere fan but these are just facts.
- Just5

But do you know what's not a fact, and why sometimes those "facts" have to be taken with a grain of salt. How many of those goals were Briere's fault. There are 5 players plus a goaltender on the ice.

Brewer was picking up his jock after the play, too...it was an awful bit of work by both Lightning defenders.
- Jsaquella

Brewer's turnover is much more agregious than Carle being on the receiving end of an unreal move by NeckBolt

But do you know what's not a fact, and why sometimes those "facts" have to be taken with a grain of salt. How many of those goals were Briere's fault. There are 5 players plus a goaltender on the ice.
- MJL

What hurts Briere though, is that he was being put in positions to succeed offensively but was still a burden defensively. You're right that the goals may not have been his fault and we'd have to go back and watch the games to really know, but these advanced stats certainly don't help his case.

But do you know what's not a fact, and why sometimes those "facts" have to be taken with a grain of salt. How many of those goals were Briere's fault. There are 5 players plus a goaltender on the ice.
- MJL

More like 4 players and a goalie when Briere is in the defensive zone

We've beaten this topic to death. I've been on his case for awhile now because of what I watch. Fact or not.

Brewer's turnover is much more agregious than Carle being on the receiving end of an unreal move by NeckBolt
- KINGKENZO

I still think it was Carter's high and wide wrister coming off the wing that triggered the breakout that led to the goal.
Also, I have yet to see the play, just an assumption.

More like 4 players and a goalie when Briere is in the defensive zone
- Just5

Nobody is doubting Briere's lack of defensive ability.

I still think it was Carter's high and wide wrister coming off the wing that triggered the breakout that led to the goal.
Also, I have yet to see the play, just an assumption.
- jmatchett

Who was first?
- NickTheKid87

I was curious the day of so I checked and it was Columbus. So yeah they would have claimed him.

No, I'm just stating my views on Briere, I haven't looked at his stats. I know his best days are behind him, but he was probably our top forward the year we went to the SCF in 2010, and that was the only SCF I was able to attend. So yes, part of it is having the blinders on and remembering that season as well as the 2008 playoffs. Still, I think the only way he agrees to waive is if they come out and tell him they'll amnesty him.
- jmatchett

I think the Flyers and Briere both know they will buy him out if he isn't traded. Otherwise he'll be taking up 10% of the cap next year.

20% on him and Timonen.

What hurts Briere though, is that he was being put in positions to succeed offensively but was still a burden defensively. You're right that the goals may not have been his fault and we'd have to go back and watch the games to really know, but these advanced stats certainly don't help his case.
- NickTheKid87

No they don't. But they also don't tell us something we already know. Briere's impact in the playoffs can't be dismissed.

No they don't. But they also don't tell us something we already know. Briere's impact in the playoffs can't be dismissed.
- MJL

I agree. He's a big time playoff performer, there's not doubt about it. He inspires the team as well which can't be measured by any statistic.

I think the Flyers and Briere both know they will buy him out if he isn't traded. Otherwise he'll be taking up 10% of the cap next year.

20% on him and Timonen.
- Feanor

I have no problem with Timonen for another year at 6 mil. I know at times he needs to be duct taped together and thrown out there, but this team needs him badly and it takes broken bones to keep him out. I dont think his bones break anyway.

I have no problem with Timonen for another year at 6 mil. I know at times he needs to be duct taped together and thrown out there, but this team needs him badly and it takes broken bones to keep him out. I dont think his bones break anyway.
- Just5

You just friggin jinxed the Ironman... sigh...

Also I don't believe the door is completely shut on Weber

A lot of RFAs out there. If we gave OEL $6 million a year for 7 years, there's no way Phoenix would match, right?
- NickTheKid87

Since there is no owner to that team, i doubt bettman fronts the money.

Also I don't believe the door is completely shut on Weber
- Just5

Absolutely not. All we need to do is acquire Crosby and then flip him to Nashville.

I have no problem with Timonen for another year at 6 mil. I know at times he needs to be duct taped together and thrown out there, but this team needs him badly and it takes broken bones to keep him out. I dont think his bones break anyway.
- Just5

Was another team going to offer him more than that, though? $6m seems excessive given his age, and his injuries, and the brutal turnovers he's made this season.

Absolutely not. All we need to do is acquire Crosby and then flip him to Nashville.
- jmatchett

I think it's fair to say that all the dman he listed could be had in a package in Couturier. Obviously, you'd have to pay more for some (i.e. Pietrangelo, who I agree is going nowhere unless the Blues are blown away).

But you also have to take into account team needs. The Coyotes have a plethora of young, talented dman (Yandle, OEL, Rundblad, Gormley, etc) making one of them expendable. What they don't have is a good forward prospect or at least not one of Couturier's potential. I could easily seeing a "hockey trade" between these teams happening.
- NickTheKid87

Everyone is available, even Giroux, depending the package but the question is at what cost. Nashville wanted B.Schenn and Couturier and ++ for Weber. That's what Phoenix wanted for Yandle, who is a better version of Carle, so imagine the price for OEL. So now you would be left with 2nd tier guys. Is trading Couturier for Rundblad and Gormely a smart hockey trade when neither have established themselves at the NHL level?

I know the Flyers need a #1 defensemen but those players almost never move. The only one I an think of in their prime to be traded was Pronger. And the cost of Pronger to Anahiem was two top 10 prospects and two 1st rd picks, so in other words B.Schenn and Couturier and ++. Is that the price who want to pay?

I just read Dustin Leed's piece from the weekend. Incredibly thought provoking and it sort of changed my mind in a way. Before, I didn't want to move Couturier at all but with Schenn putting up offensive numbers and Laughton having looked solid as a shutdown guy, maybe dealing Couts for a top young dman isn't so bad after all.

Here's the article if you haven't read it and would like to: http://thehockeyguys.net/...-at-the-forward-position/
- NickTheKid87

This article is so well laid out in the direction of trading Couturier that it made my stomach hurt thinking of him not being here because it makes so much sense.

Since there is no owner to that team, i doubt bettman fronts the money.
- Philly1980

Wait, after all he's done to keep that team in that location (despite hemorrhaging money) he's suddenly not going to foot the bill? Not likely.

Was another team going to offer him more than that, though? $6m seems excessive given his age, and his injuries, and the brutal turnovers he's made this season.
- Feanor

I think Timo for a 1 yr deal could have gotten that or more on the free agency market. If it was 2 or 3 the price would have dropped. But for 1 yr? He's still super solid.

Also I don't believe the door is completely shut on Weber
- Just5