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Forums :: Blog World :: Bill Meltzer: Meltzer's Musings: Nothing Learned
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NickTheKid87
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 11.19.2010

Mar 8 @ 3:50 PM ET
Well that was an uplifting read
- mayorofangrytown


Best Bill Blog
Moose_15
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Rat Patrol, PA
Joined: 02.15.2013

Mar 8 @ 3:50 PM ET
I think we're close.

If we can get a big guy on D with a heavy shot, another two well-rounded forwards, and a speedster, we'll be right in the mix.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kXVFCfBWoQ
Marc D
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: best smile, 14 without fake tees
Joined: 03.28.2008

Mar 8 @ 3:57 PM ET
his numbers are mostly as a result of PP time. his even-strength numbers are meh, and he's not a very good defensive forward to boot.
- bradleyc4

I get that, but he has gumption, is good along the boards and to me embodies what it means to be a Flyer

overall he is a very good role player, the kind every team needs to win a Cup

as always if a trade fills a bigger need I could see it, but I like what Simmonds brings
section32
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Raleigh, NC
Joined: 02.15.2007

Mar 8 @ 3:58 PM ET
Giroux, Voracek, Couturier, B. Schenn, Simmonds, Read have the most trade value in that order IMO.
- NickTheKid87

Is this the same order that you think the league would value there talent. In other words, if they were all in the same draft who would go highest?
Marc D
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: best smile, 14 without fake tees
Joined: 03.28.2008

Mar 8 @ 3:58 PM ET
Well that was an uplifting read
- mayorofangrytown

better then the game last night?
strongsupporter
Joined: 10.07.2010

Mar 8 @ 4:00 PM ET
I get that, but he has gumption, is good along the boards and to me embodies what it means to be a Flyer

overall he is a very good role player, the kind every team needs to win a Cup

as always if a trade fills a bigger need I could see it, but I like what Simmonds brings

- Marc D

There isn't a team in the league that wouldn't take him. I don't understand why we want to give our players away. %The goal is what?
stveshdy
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 06.28.2010

Mar 8 @ 4:06 PM ET
Was everyone able to sleep off that loss last night? All should be good again!
BringBack25
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: deep lurk
Joined: 01.03.2007

Mar 8 @ 4:08 PM ET
I get that, but he has gumption, is good along the boards and to me embodies what it means to be a Flyer

overall he is a very good role player, the kind every team needs to win a Cup

as always if a trade fills a bigger need I could see it, but I like what Simmonds brings

- Marc D


I think his point is that Simmonds is maybe the one guy on the team other than Jake who is having the kind of season that might make someone overpay for him. So if he could find a deal that gives us a great return because someone is overvaluing him, then it might be one of our only chance to make a trade where we are not trading from a position of weakness.

If we try to move Briere for example, teams know we need to dump that salary, and Briere's numbers aren't that great. So we wouldn't have much leverage. If we dealt Simmonds, we could hold out for more, and be "justified", at least in the eyes of potential trade partners in doing so because they are overvaluing Simmonds.

That said, I wouldn't move him. I think he's a relative bargain at his salary and will continue to improve over the life of his deal. Plus, I think Brad correctly points out that if Holmgren trades another player so soon after inking him to a long term extension, it will be tough to get future players to extend and forgo free agency.
xShoot4WarAmpsx
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Hamilton, ON
Joined: 06.25.2010

Mar 8 @ 4:14 PM ET
Defensive coverage is brutal! Main reason we lose games, our guys are lost on defence even forwards. I think we need to shed cap space but Homer screwed that idea up. Timonen should not be back, like him but we need to purge the D core and get younger and faster. I can see Gervais and Foster leaving. We need Briere gone but his NMC prevents that. I'm not a big fan of Coburn, he takes dumb and lazy penalties constantly bobbles puck too much. I'd keep Schenn and Mezaros, think they can be a reliable 2nd pair if Mez can stay healthy and Grossman i don't know what to do with him, he can block shots and hit but a times his defesive ability scares me, but could be his partner...
LJF
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Jersey Baby Jersey
Joined: 04.17.2009

Mar 8 @ 4:17 PM ET
Great write up on the sad state of affairs that is the Flyers. Game plan vs Flyers just keep up the pressure because they will crack. This team is mentally very weak.
jak521
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Buckle Up.
Joined: 02.19.2008

Mar 8 @ 4:17 PM ET
Defensive coverage is brutal! Main reason we lose games, our guys are lost on defence even forwards. I think we need to shed cap space but Homer screwed that idea up. Timonen should not be back, like him but we need to purge the D core and get younger and faster. I can see Gervais and Foster leaving. We need Briere gone but his NMC prevents that. I'm not a big fan of Coburn, he takes dumb and lazy penalties constantly bobbles puck too much. I'd keep Schenn and Mezaros, think they can be a reliable 2nd pair if Mez can stay healthy and Grossman i don't know what to do with him, he can block shots and hit but a times his defesive ability scares me, but could be his partner...
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

Whaaaaaaaaaaa?
Marc D
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: best smile, 14 without fake tees
Joined: 03.28.2008

Mar 8 @ 4:18 PM ET
I think his point is that Simmonds is maybe the one guy on the team other than Jake who is having the kind of season that might make someone overpay for him. So if he could find a deal that gives us a great return because someone is overvaluing him, then it might be one of our only chance to make a trade where we are not trading from a position of weakness.

If we try to move Briere for example, teams know we need to dump that salary, and Briere's numbers aren't that great. So we wouldn't have much leverage. If we dealt Simmonds, we could hold out for more, and be "justified", at least in the eyes of potential trade partners in doing so because they are overvaluing Simmonds.

That said, I wouldn't move him. I think he's a relative bargain at his salary and will continue to improve over the life of his deal. Plus, I think Brad correctly points out that if Holmgren trades another player so soon after inking him to a long term extension, it will be tough to get future players to extend and forgo free agency.

- BringBack25


If they could get a top pairing youngish defenseman I could see it, even with Simmonds as part of a package. Its a huge need for the Flyers.
But I don't see any teams willing to trade that kind of guy.

Simmonds for a prospect possible top pairing young D man, like one of the Coyotes prospects, ie Brandon Gormley?

He may be untouchable from Phoenix standpoint. Maybe Rundblad? Bigger gamble.

Seems pretty unlikely.

stveshdy
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 06.28.2010

Mar 8 @ 4:20 PM ET
Defensive coverage is brutal! Main reason we lose games, our guys are lost on defence even forwards. I think we need to shed cap space but Homer screwed that idea up. Timonen should not be back, like him but we need to purge the D core and get younger and faster. I can see Gervais and Foster leaving. We need Briere gone but his NMC prevents that. I'm not a big fan of Coburn, he takes dumb and lazy penalties constantly bobbles puck too much. I'd keep Schenn and Mezaros, think they can be a reliable 2nd pair if Mez can stay healthy and Grossman i don't know what to do with him, he can block shots and hit but a times his defesive ability scares me, but could be his partner...
- xShoot4WarAmpsx


Grossmann has been their best defenseman this season. The Flyers need to make adjustments to their style of play or maybe look in another direction during the offseason.
BringBack25
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: deep lurk
Joined: 01.03.2007

Mar 8 @ 4:25 PM ET
If they could get a top pairing youngish defenseman I could see it, even with Simmonds as part of a package. Its a huge need for the Flyers.
But I don't see any teams willing to trade that kind of guy.

Simmonds for a prospect possible top pairing young D man, like one of the Coyotes prospects, ie Brandon Gormley?

He may be untouchable from Phoenix standpoint. Maybe Rundblad? Bigger gamble.

Seems pretty unlikely.

- Marc D


Agreed. Teams may overvalue him, but probably not to the point of giving up a top pairing d-man. If someone does, then you probably have to take that deal. But I agree that it's unlikely. I also agree with your earlier comments that he's a great role player - the kind that every team needs. And while he does have some holes in his game, he also does a lot of things that don't always show up on the stat sheet.
stveshdy
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 06.28.2010

Mar 8 @ 4:28 PM ET
Ryan Getzlaf's new deal with the Anaheim Ducks is worth $66 million over eight seasons. That gives Getzlaf a cap hit of $8.25 million. That might sound absurdly high and before the lockout it might have been. After all, it's only marginally below Sidney Crosby's cap hit. However, the new CBA has limited team's abilities to lower the cap hit by heavily frontloading contracts and tacking on cheap years at the end of massively long deals. The new CBA will cause the cap hit of the best players to rise and Getzlaf's new deal is reflective of that. It will, however, make it that much harder for Anaheim to re-sign Corey Perry before he becomes an unrestricted free agent this summer and then Bobby Ryan before his deal expires following the 2014-15 campaign.
Source: Pierre LeBrun on Twitter

Probably late but thats a tough cap hit to swallow.
Flyskippy
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Ignoreland, GA
Joined: 11.04.2005

Mar 8 @ 4:29 PM ET
I just got home from work. Did the Flyers name Jsaq GM and MOAT coach yet?
Marc D
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: best smile, 14 without fake tees
Joined: 03.28.2008

Mar 8 @ 4:30 PM ET
Agreed. Teams may overvalue him, but probably not to the point of giving up a top pairing d-man. If someone does, then you probably have to take that deal. But I agree that it's unlikely. I also agree with your earlier comments that he's a great role player - the kind that every team needs. And while he does have some holes in his game, he also does a lot of things that don't always show up on the stat sheet.
- BringBack25

he is one of my favorites right now

G, Voracek, Simmonds, Grossmann

(although I am hoping for more from G)
Marc D
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: best smile, 14 without fake tees
Joined: 03.28.2008

Mar 8 @ 4:30 PM ET
I just got home from work. Did the Flyers name Jsaq GM and MOAT coach yet?
- Flyskippy

yes and MJL to manage the cap for them

you are in charge of entertainment at the arena
bradleyc4
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: the jewelry is still out
Joined: 01.16.2007

Mar 8 @ 4:32 PM ET
he is one of my favorites right now

G, Voracek, Simmonds, Grossmann

(although I am hoping for more from G)

- Marc D


Even though Simmonds is not a good possession player, he still brings a lot to the team (like you stated). Have no problem with them keeping him.
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Mar 8 @ 4:34 PM ET
his numbers are mostly as a result of PP time. his even-strength numbers are meh, and he's not a very good defensive forward to boot.
- bradleyc4



I thought at first you were being sarcastic.
stveshdy
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 06.28.2010

Mar 8 @ 4:34 PM ET
I just got home from work. Did the Flyers name Jsaq GM and MOAT coach yet?
- Flyskippy

MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Mar 8 @ 4:34 PM ET
I guess I should rephrase saying that I would look to deal Simmonds to an organization that thinks he's having a breakout season (when he's not in actuality).
- bradleyc4



I'd be interested to hear exactly why he's not having a breakout season.
Jsaquella
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Bringing Hexy Back
Joined: 06.16.2006

Mar 8 @ 4:36 PM ET
I just got home from work. Did the Flyers name Jsaq GM and MOAT coach yet?
- Flyskippy


Yeah, but I fired MoAT and hired Butsy for a case of Molson and a box of Timbits
jeffherrm
Joined: 05.05.2007

Mar 8 @ 4:45 PM ET
I'd be interested to hear exactly why he's not having a breakout season.
- MJL


Just to jump in......I see a lot of improvements from Simmonds this year, especially on the power play. His 5 on 5 play, especially putting pucks in deep, needs improvement. Still too early to classify as a "breakout" season. The line he is playing on currently (Schenn & Briere) is not helping.
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Mar 8 @ 4:48 PM ET
Just to jump in......I see a lot of improvements from Simmonds this year, especially on the power play. His 5 on 5 play, especially putting pucks in deep, needs improvement. Still too early to classify as a "breakout" season. The line he is playing on currently (Schenn & Briere) is not helping.
- jeffherrm



Of course he has areas of his game that needs to be improved. That goes for most of the players on this team. But his current numbers translate to 37 goals and 33 assists for 70 pts over an 82 game Season. That is a breakout Season.
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