What's the mid age number you're talking about?
- MJL

26-30

I think we all agree that a coach can only do so much.

The following players and their performance are big problems this season: Talbot, Couts, Briere, Gus, Gervais, Coburn, and Feds.

How is a coach supposed to address that many problems, especially with as many injuries as the Flyers have had? Add on top of that the inconsistent performance of this team's "best" players and there are some major issues.
- wolfhounds

First of all, I don't agree that all of the players you list are big problems this Season. And secondly, part of the reason why some of those players look like problems, is due to the Coach. And some of it is due to issues beyond anyone's control.

Not the identity that you speak of. Playing well and playing the right way, along with talent, and Coaching, is what wins Cups.
- MJL

So the best teams in the league, the teams that are good for years do not have an identity.

If we disagree so be it. I see the lack of structure, identity and direction of management as a huge issue.

They panic year after year trying to be like the team that just beat them. Find an identity, a system, a coach you want to build around. Find a direction. Then find players that fit that mold.

Detriot for years has been a club that is all about puck possession.

Boston is a tough physical club, that will grind you down and their strength is from the net out.

Chicago is an up-tempo, aggressive, initiate the play club that requires speed.
- flyer_nutter

That's not an identity. That is a description of a style of play, and is systems related.

Detriot for years has been a club that is all about puck possession.

Boston is a tough physical club, that will grind you down and their strength is from the net out.

Chicago is an up-tempo, aggressive, initiate the play club that requires speed.
- flyer_nutter

Detroit is a good model for a consistent team even with changing parts.

Regarding Boston, they've got Chara. Take him away and it's a completely different team, and not nearly as good, imo. Similar to Brodeur in NJ (that team is about to sink like a rock unless they have a phenom goalie waiting to be brought up...)

Don't get me wrong, I agree totally. I'm just saying this team has more "inconsistent" players on the roster than the teams above them. Which is why they are where they are right now.
- the deaninator

Exactly. Nail meet head.

The Flyers as an organization need to do a much better job at identifying talent, that works hard, and is more consistent.

So the best teams in the league, the teams that are good for years do not have an identity.

If we disagree so be it. I see the lack of structure, identity and direction of management as a huge issue.

They panic year after year trying to be like the team that just beat them. Find an identity, a system, a coach you want to build around. Find a direction. Then find players that fit that mold.
- flyer_nutter

I understand what you're saying. They need to identify a course and direction and stick to it. And not keep trying to change based on who won the previous Season.

That's not an identity. That is a description of a style of play, and is systems related.
- MJL

A style of play directly relates to the identity and culture of a team.

What is the Flyers identity that has been set by management. That is where it should start.

Or has that structure and direction been sorely lacking for a long time now.

Don't get me wrong, I agree totally. I'm just saying this team has more "inconsistent" players on the roster than the teams above them. Which is why they are where they are right now.
- the deaninator

You have to identify why that is.

Detroit is a good model for a consistent team even with changing parts.

Regarding Boston, they've got Chara. Take him away and it's a completely different team, and not nearly as good, imo. Similar to Brodeur in NJ (that team is about to sink like a rock unless they have a phenom goalie waiting to be brought up...)
- wolfhounds

A #1 d-man changes a lot of things.

If for example however the Bruins lost Chara. Or were defeated by Chicago in the playoffs. Would they panic, change coaches, and the style they play?

Or would they, like the other top teams in the league, for the most part stick with their identity and continue to find players to fit the mold set my management.

I think the organization as a whole needs a cultural change. There has been way too much stagnation in this club, and what was once a honest mentality (flyers hockey) is now ancient history. The league passed this team, and what it takes to win has changed. They finally caught up to the idea of paying for a goaltender, but now there's a cap, and talent, and salary, needs to be balanced. You need to draft better, because veteran's cost too much now.

They need to learn how to draft other than forwards. They need to invest in player development in defense and goal. They need to stop going "all in" unless the core proves that they are, in fact, one piece away.

I want them to dump whatever they can, and get decent return. This team is not prepared for any kind of run, so mortgaging the future for this year is a waste of time.
- the deaninator

Exactly. Nail meet head.

The Flyers as an organization need to do a much better job at identifying talent, that works hard, and is more consistent.
- flyer_nutter

The life of a coach your great when you win and you stink when you lose.

The coach always takes the heat. Right now I keep seeing the same mistakes defensively. So if the players aren't following his direction then its time to go. If he can't make the adjustments and fix the problem or show improvement than its time to go.

The life of a coach your great when you win and you stink when you lose.

The coach always takes the heat. Right now I keep seeing the same mistakes defensively. So if the players aren't following his direction then its time to go. If he can't make the adjustments and fix the problem or show improvement than its time to go.
- stveshdy

My issue with firing is not so much as letting him go. He has his faults.

Its that you can just feel the Flyers going to become a d-first club. Which I would be fine with in the grand scheme of things. However it just screams to the bigger issue of continously changing the direction and structure of the team. No consistency from the top.

When was the last time lavi had a bag skate? Just curious?

The following players and their performance are big problems this season: Talbot, Couts, Briere, Gus, Gervais, Coburn, and Feds.

How is a coach supposed to address that many problems, especially with as many injuries as the Flyers have had? Add on top of that the inconsistent performance of this team's "best" players and there are some major issues.

- wolfhounds

First of all, I don't agree that all of the players you list are big problems this Season. And secondly, part of the reason why some of those players look like problems, is due to the Coach. And some of it is due to issues beyond anyone's control.
- MJL

You can agree or not, but stats don't lie. Couts will almost certainly be a dominant player in the league, but 2013 has been a big step back offensively and defensively from his "shut down Malkin" performance in the POs last year.

Other than that, who would you argue is having a good year in that list?

And I'm not sure Talbot's 1 goal or Briere's 5 (2 more than Rinaldo) for the season can be laid on the coaching staff.

All of their top players are playing in 3rd gear?
- MJL

Those top players who you've cut PP time from have to be replaced by somebody.

My issue with firing is not so much as letting him go. He has his faults.

Its that you can just feel the Flyers going to become a d-first club. Which I would be fine with in the grand scheme of things. However it just screams to the bigger issue of continously changing the direction and structure of the team. No consistency from the top.
- flyer_nutter

I think they need to add a coach who can adjust his system or style of play. That would solve a lot of issues.

When was the last time lavi had a bag skate? Just curious?
- SMS4016

In this crazy schedule season I dont know if I would advise that under any coach.

To answer your question, none of us know. We are not there. Thats what makes this all crazy at the end of it. None of us have any idea, we are just farting in the wind.

A #1 d-man changes a lot of things.

If for example however the Bruins lost Chara. Or were defeated by Chicago in the playoffs. Would they panic, change coaches, and the style they play?

Or would they, like the other top teams in the league, for the most part stick with their identity and continue to find players to fit the mold set my management.
- flyer_nutter

Right, they'd likely stick with what they've built.

I get what you're saying, and there's no doubt the Flyers are lacking an identity right now after trading Richards, Carter, JVR, Carle, etc.

I don't doubt one of the problems is player leadership. Who is the veteran presence the younger guys look up and listen to? Briere? Seems unlikely. Timonen? Again, unlikely. The void left by Pronger - a void of many facets - has yet to be filled, and that plays into the team's identity and performance issues.

I don't disagree. But the D is as bad as the forwards are good. They are slow.
...

Players cannot consistently perform above their skill set. As it becomes more apparent to opponents that there is a problem, the more they will take advantage of it. It is not just a coaching issue that the Flyers have trouble getting the puck out of their own end. It is also about speed and skill.
- spatso

The Flyers D isn't that bad at getting the puck out of their own end. Grossman has displayed surprisingly strong abilities in this area, and guys like Schenn, Gervais Gustafsson, Coburn and Timonen are quite capable of moving the puck up the ice (the occasional mistake notwithstanding). Sure, the D aren't burners, but they aren't particularly immobile or slow (at their size) either. The issue isn't so much with the D corps (though they do need could surely use a bona-fide #1 should one become available in the right deal). Yes, there will be those times when the team has some trouble and teams with a strong forecheck get some extended time in the attack zone, but pretty much every team has those moments to some extent at some points in a game. The problem as I see it has more to do with how the Flyers backcheck as a team. While surely there are times when the forwards don't get back to support defensively but even when they do actually get back, the players tend to overpursue the puck holder, sending 2,3,4 guys to "help" win a puck battle against one or two guys at the expense of leaving open men in the slot/dangerous areas. It can work sometimes, but a certain percentage of those times, the puck will be lost to the other team, who, if quick/capable enough, can take advantage of the vacated areas of the ice to get scoring chances. The Flyers have to be more disciplined in the defensive zone in minding their slot coverage, boxing out, clearing crease and closely marking open guys...keep things out on the perimeter and don't send three or four guys in to battle one opposing player with the puck.

I don't know if this is Laviolette's "fault" for not recognizing or not coaching on this point, but it's one of the primary reasons I see for defensive brekadowns leading to goals against imo.

I understand what you're saying. They need to identify a course and direction and stick to it. And not keep trying to change based on who won the previous Season.
- MJL

Absolutely.

And one more thing. Draft better. The farm system is horrendous. There is no depth because of the horrific drafting over the past years.

Only one home grown D-man on the ice, and he has been less than promising. And one top six forward on the team at the present moment was drafted - and that was because the Rags screwed up and selected Sanguinetti.

I don't want to start on the goaltending.

Absolutely.

And one more thing. Draft better. The farm system is horrendous. There is no depth because of the horrific drafting over the past years.

Only one home grown D-man on the ice, and he has been less than promising. And one top six forward on the team at the present moment was drafted - and that was because the Rags screwed up and selected Sanguinetti.

I don't want to start on the goaltending.


- 77rams

Trade Briere. Buyout Bryz. Bring in new coach. Add some players.

Trade Briere. Buyout Bryz. Bring in new coach. Add some players.
- stveshdy

Im pretting "meh" on Lava lately. I suppose what happens, happens.

You are right though. Sending out Bryzgalov, Briere, Gervais, Foster, Leighton, Boucher, Lilja, Walker, Fedetenko and Knuble you have a real ability to finally start putting in place a culture of consistent hard workers, first and foremost.

Outlook isn't bleak, and they do have pieces as well as cap space to bring in better players.

In this crazy schedule season I dont know if I would advise that under any coach.

To answer your question, none of us know. We are not there. Thats what makes this all crazy at the end of it. None of us have any idea, we are just farting in the wind.
- flyer_nutter

I would have bag skated them this morning. At least they would have an excuse to play another game like the Boston game.

In this crazy schedule season I dont know if I would advise that under any coach.

To answer your question, none of us know. We are not there. Thats what makes this all crazy at the end of it. None of us have any idea, we are just farting in the wind.
- flyer_nutter

They don't even have the time to have regular practices, from what the beat writers tweet. That's probably a factor, too.