I guess this is my rationale for thinking about moving young picks for proven young players:
Shea Weber will be a premier, elite defenseman this year.
Shea Weber will be a premier, elite defenseman next year.
Shea Weber will be a premier, elite defenseman the following year.
Shea Weber will be a premier, elite defenseman the following year.
Shea Weber will be a premier, elite defenseman the following year.
Shea Weber will be a premier, elite defenseman the following year.
Shea Weber will be a premier, elite defenseman the following year.
barring a crazy unforseen injury

Seth Jones may never be able to adapt to the NHL.
Darnell Nurse may never be able to adapt to the NHL.
Any other unproven defenseman you draft may never be able to adapt to the NHL.
It is a whole lot easier to replace top-6 NHL forwards than it is top 2 NHL defensemen.
- jmatchett383

You aren't getting weber so forget that pipe dream

Lets be honest here, who would want Hartnell with the length of his deal. Honestly last season was really his only great breakout season other then that he has been a 2nd-3rd line guy. Plus he is one of are locker room leaders and with Briere's buyout and Timonen probably retireing you are leaving G without much vet help in that room
- nonpoint22

That strong leadership core, has failed time and time again. I respect a lot of what Timonen/Briere have brought, but there was a huge hole that was filled when Lappy/Pronger were brought in. It was lost when they departed.

Hartnell might wear an A, and keep the room loose or whatever, but you could send me in there to do that. Hartnell was supposed to be one of the players this season to help transition the kids, and be someone to look up to. He failed big time in both regards. A locker-room "leader" on this team, isnt much of a compliment to me, especially when talking about Hartnell.

/End rant

I think 28 teams would want Hartnell.
25 goals a year, good size, can play in front of the net, has a big personality.

His contract makes the return a bit tougher.

But the guy is a legit first line winger.

Look at the results of the lines he has been part of the last few years here.

Harts/Carter/Lupul
Harts/Briere/Leino
Harts/G/Jagr
- Marc D

In think your seeing him through orange colored glasses

I think 28 teams would want Hartnell.
25 goals a year, good size, can play in front of the net, has a big personality.

His contract makes the return a bit tougher.

But the guy is a legit first line winger.

Look at the results of the lines he has been part of the last few years here.

Harts/Carter/Lupul
Harts/Briere/Leino
Harts/G/Jagr
- Marc D

Are the Pens the team with no interest?

That strong leadership core, has failed time and time again. I respect a lot of what Timonen/Briere have brought, but there was a huge hole that was filled when Lappy/Pronger were brought in. It was lost when they departed.

Hartnell might wear an A, and keep the room loose or whatever, but you could send me in there to do that. Hartnell was supposed to be one of the players this season to help transition the kids, and be someone to look up to. He failed big time in both regards. A locker-room "leader" on this team, isnt much of a compliment to me, especially when talking about Hartnell.

/End rant
- flyer_nutter

Very valid point

You aren't getting weber so forget that pipe dream
- Philly1980

Oh, I know that ship has sailed. It was just to illustrate why, for a short list of specific players, I am willing to move unproven high-potential assets.

I think 28 teams would want Hartnell.
25 goals a year, good size, can play in front of the net, has a big personality.

His contract makes the return a bit tougher.

But the guy is a legit first line winger.

Look at the results of the lines he has been part of the last few years here.

Harts/Carter/Lupul
Harts/Briere/Leino
Harts/G/Jagr
- Marc D

When things go good, he is on fire. When they do not, he goes much like the way of the team. That doesnt cut it for me anymore. He needs to be a guy to initiate more, and help bring the team out of hard spots not just jump on the train when others have started to do it. He has chipped in goals but so did Zherdev. He provides a lot when he is on his game but the guy has been chronically inconsistent throughout his whole time here. The stupid penalties, and just stupidity all over the ice happen over and over again.

He has good times where everyone forgets about his shortcomings, but I am done with this team choosing to build around, and pay top money for players who you have no idea in hell how they will play a given night or year. If that means going through a little bit of a rough patch by losing Coburn/Hartnell (the team would get assests back), so be it.

You cannot build a proper culture, and identity of consistent hard work, and solid play with players like that being those you build around, and players like that sorrounding the kids. I strongly believe that. In time, I want that brand of inconsistent poop off the team. Especially when it is supposed to be a highly paid veteran.

Lets be honest here, who would want Hartnell with the length of his deal. Honestly last season was really his only great breakout season other then that he has been a 2nd-3rd line guy. Plus he is one of are locker room leaders and with Briere's buyout and Timonen probably retireing you are leaving G without much vet help in that room
- nonpoint22

6 20+ goal seasons, two of which were 30+ goal seasons...Couldn't disagree more. Thee type of players don't grow on trees people.

In think your seeing him through orange colored glasses
- nonpoint22

Maybe.
I don't think Hartnell alone would bring back the top pair defenseman.

But I do believe he has a lot of value and is regarded highly around the league.
I am throwing his name out there, because right now I'd rather keep the two young centers and Read for long term over Hartnell, especially if trading him brings back a guy to replace Kimmo. For the right defenseman I wouldn't be opposed to packaging Hartnell and a high pick in the 2014 draft.

The reason I am not opposed to trading him to fill a bigger need is I don't over value him. I think he got a fair payday, but the length was a bit long on his current deal.

Are the Pens the team with no interest?
- wilsonecho91

I think he'd be a hit in Pittsburgh too, but they have salary issues coming up.

Maybe.
I don't think Hartnell alone would bring back the top pair defenseman.

But I do believe he has a lot of value and is regarded highly around the league.
I am throwing his name out there, because right now I'd rather keep the two young centers and Read for long term over Hartnell, especially if trading him brings back a guy to replace Kimmo. For the right defenseman I wouldn't be opposed to packaging Hartnell and a high pick in the 2014 draft.

The reason I am not opposed to trading him to fill a bigger need is I don't over value him. I think he got a fair payday, but the length was a bit long on his current deal.
- Marc D

Hartnell could bring in a decent return to the right team who wants him bad enough. But what that return would be could vary.

6 20+ goal seasons, two of which were 30+ goal seasons...Couldn't disagree more. Thee type of players don't grow on trees people.
- flyers20032002

He definitely has his shortcomings, but I agree there are 29 other teams out there who would love him (Pittsburgh is actually the #1 team, having to play against him so much). It's also true that his age and contract would be a bit much for some. But if they trade him, he's not easily replaceable. Then again, if we're going to do a true rebuild and are willing to be cellar-dwellers for 2-3 years, then I'd prefer to get a return for him.

Plus the last time I went on a trade Hartnell rant, he scored two goals, that day.

If I keep this poop up, he might get a hat trick today.

Hartnell could bring in a decent return to the right team who wants him bad enough. But what that return would be could vary.
- ob18

I only do the trade for the right guy.

Someone to replace what Kimmo gives them when he leaves after next year.

Plus the last time I went on a trade Hartnell rant, he scored two goals, that day.

If I keep this poop up, he might get a hat trick today.
- Marc D

Inconsistency is a killer. Your top players need to be your top players consistently. They need to help the kids transition, be role models, and not be chronically stupid.

I would not surpise me one bit for him to get a hat trick. It also wouldnt suprise me to see him go completely cold in the stanley cup finals for example. Thats the issue for me. Who knows how the hell he will play? At this point same goes for Coburn, and it has been for his whole career also.

I only do the trade for the right guy.

Someone to replace what Kimmo gives them when he leaves after next year.
- Marc D

Would you trade him straight-up for Seidenberg?

That strong leadership core, has failed time and time again. I respect a lot of what Timonen/Briere have brought, but there was a huge hole that was filled when Lappy/Pronger were brought in. It was lost when they departed.

Hartnell might wear an A, and keep the room loose or whatever, but you could send me in there to do that. Hartnell was supposed to be one of the players this season to help transition the kids, and be someone to look up to. He failed big time in both regards. A locker-room "leader" on this team, isnt much of a compliment to me, especially when talking about Hartnell.

/End rant
- flyer_nutter

Not disagreeing with all of that, but to be fair his broken foot hurt him trying to lead by example this year.

Plenty of streakiness and stupid when he is healthy, I totally see that and agree.

Would you trade him straight-up for Seidenberg?
- jmatchett383

I'm leary only because of his age.

I would consider it.

Not disagreeing with all of that, but to be fair his broken foot hurt him trying to lead by example this year.

Plenty of streakiness and stupid when he is healthy, I totally see that and agree.
- Marc D

I get it hurt some of his play, but it shouldnt effect his head. Its also not the first time/season his inconsistency has been brought up.

Just to throw a name out there. If you could somehow get a package of Giordano + a 1st for Hartnell (and maybe other pieces) I would be all in.

Inconsistency is a killer. Your top players need to be your top players consistently. They need to help the kids transition, be role models, and not be chronically stupid.

I would not surpise me one bit for him to get a hat trick. It also wouldnt suprise me to see him go completely cold in the stanley cup finals for example. Thats the issue for me. Who knows how the hell he will play? At this point same goes for Coburn, and it has been for his whole career also.
- flyer_nutter

I was joking with this post.
I do get your point about the inconsistency.

It happens with nearly all of the players.

Even Crosby and Toews have off nights (and Hartnell has way more, I'm not trying to compare them).

I'm leary only because of his age.

I would consider it.
- Marc D

This and you have to factor in Chara

I get it hurt some of his play, but it shouldnt effect his head. Its also not the first time/season his inconsistency has been brought up.

Just to throw a name out there. If you could somehow get a package of Giordano + a 1st for Hartnell (and maybe other pieces) I would be all in.
- flyer_nutter

Gio is solid. They might want Hartnell + first for him.

Tobias Enstrom, Alex Edler, Voynov.
Lots of guys out west I like.

I was joking with this post.
I do get your point about the inconsistency.

It happens with nearly all of the players.

Even Crosby and Toews have off nights (and Hartnell has way more, I'm not trying to compare them).
- Marc D

It does definately. My line of thinking is that the best teams, are usually the teams that show the most consistency. Starting with their best players.

Its why, a team like Vancouver or San Jose imo, has always come up short.

It does definately. My line of thinking is that the best teams, are usually the teams that show the most consistency. Starting with their best players.

Its why, a team like Vancouver or San Jose imo, has always come up short.
- flyer_nutter

Agree.

Find guys for up and down the line up that play every shift like Rinaldo has this season.

Gio is solid. They might want Hartnell + first for him.

Tobias Enstrom, Alex Edler, Voynov.
Lots of guys out west I like.
- Marc D

I wouldnt do Hartnell and a 1st for Giordano, but I bring up Calgary because of Feaster.

Holmgren should be on the phone trying to rape this guy.