He goes awol when teams play in their own end. Not only that becomes a liability when they forecheck, his 22 points the past two years against a leaking Miller and OHL Fleury mean little to me.
- JoeRussomanno

1) No denying the first point. Briere is subpar defensively. You can also accurately say that Simmonds and B. Schenn (although he's improved a lot, going from below average to average with, hopefully, further improvements to come) often go AWOL in the defensive zone. Hell, ditto Giroux and Voracek on a lot of nights this season.

2) Playing an instrumental role to two playoff series wins means little? I can't agree with that. That "leaky" Miller, BTW, shut out the Flyers twice in the series in 1-0 games, held them to 3 goals on 39 shots in another and only started to become leaky when the Flyers wore down his D. However, I agree that Fleury was pretty bad in the first round series last year. He'd be fine until the first goal got by him and then get rattled.

is everyone sippin' on Grandpa's medicine this afternoon?

is everyone sippin' on Grandpa's medicine this afternoon?
- KGBflyers10

Yep...still.

is everyone sippin' on Grandpa's medicine this afternoon?
- KGBflyers10

Papa's recipe

I sometimes feel bad for Bill on the level of maturity his readership lacks.

I sometimes feel bad for Bill on the level of maturity his readership lacks.
- KGBflyers10

I assure you I am quite old.

I assure you I am quite old.
- Scoob

You and me both, brother Scoob.

WIP? Let's see...Kimmo pushed for defensive pairings with LH and RH defensemen at the start of the season. I remember that the start of the season didn't start all that well for Luke. Then injuries took over as Meszaros, Coburn, and Grossman were lost. For the most part, the only two LH dmen that played together on a regular basis were Grossman and Coburn. Schenn is a young player and not in the same league as an aging Timonen or healthy Meszaros....

How much PP time did Schenn get prior to all the injuries? I know 93 and 24 were both on the PP from the point...

The Broad Street Bullies mentality from the 70's is almost 40 years old...there is more to the NHL and winning Stanley Cups than a hit first pass later defenseman in this league. Kimmo just brings more to the table than young Schenn.

Schenn is a good young player but not worth JVR and not the Flyers top blueliner. If he was, would they be shopping for a Number 1 this summer?
- puckhead7

it would take a whole lot more than jvr to get a #1 dman or weber would be wearing an orange jersey.

1) No denying the first point. Briere is subpar defensively. You can also accurately say that Simmonds and B. Schenn (although he's improved a lot, going from below average to average with, hopefully, further improvements to come) often go AWOL in the defensive zone. Hell, ditto Giroux and Voracek on a lot of nights this season.

2) Playing an instrumental role to two playoff series wins means little? I can't agree with that. That "leaky" Miller, BTW, shut out the Flyers twice in the series in 1-0 games, held them to 3 goals on 39 shots in another and only started to become leaky when the Flyers wore down his D. However, I agree that Fleury was pretty bad in the first round series last year. He'd be fine until the first goal got by him and then get rattled.
- bmeltzer

Bill,

if the flyers find a partner to trade a buyout candidate for briere , a 1 for 1, and the other team buys out briere.....can we sign him? I know if we buy him out we can't resign him for a year but our trash for your trash then each team can resign a player they may want to keep but b/c of cap hits can not afford not to amnesty. I think we would like briere and he wants to stay at a cap friendly #. What do you think?

Bill,

if the flyers find a partner to trade a buyout candidate for briere , a 1 for 1, and the other team buys out briere.....can we sign him? I know if we buy him out we can't resign him for a year but our trash for your trash then each team can resign a player they may want to keep but b/c of cap hits can not afford not to amnesty. I think we would like briere and he wants to stay at a cap friendly #. What do you think?
- huks99

I think the NHL might drop an anvil on us.
They can't stand it when Homer finds ways around the rules. Hell they included rules in this CBA specifically for Holmgren (i.e. no trade clauses kick in when contract is signed and not when it starts)....
I seriously doubt they'd let the above fly.

Bill,

if the flyers find a partner to trade a buyout candidate for briere , a 1 for 1, and the other team buys out briere.....can we sign him? I know if we buy him out we can't resign him for a year but our trash for your trash then each team can resign a player they may want to keep but b/c of cap hits can not afford not to amnesty. I think we would like briere and he wants to stay at a cap friendly #. What do you think?
- huks99

I would hope that is a loophole that does not exist in the CBA.

Bill,

if the flyers find a partner to trade a buyout candidate for briere , a 1 for 1, and the other team buys out briere.....can we sign him? I know if we buy him out we can't resign him for a year but our trash for your trash then each team can resign a player they may want to keep but b/c of cap hits can not afford not to amnesty. I think we would like briere and he wants to stay at a cap friendly #. What do you think?
- huks99

it does make you think that the amnesty provisions should have been broadened to include contract restructuring so that a player ould try to work out a new deal with the existing team. The team would continue to only have two in total.

1) No denying the first point. Briere is subpar defensively. You can also accurately say that Simmonds and B. Schenn (although he's improved a lot, going from below average to average with, hopefully, further improvements to come) often go AWOL in the defensive zone. Hell, ditto Giroux and Voracek on a lot of nights this season.

2) Playing an instrumental role to two playoff series wins means little? I can't agree with that. That "leaky" Miller, BTW, shut out the Flyers twice in the series in 1-0 games, held them to 3 goals on 39 shots in another and only started to become leaky when the Flyers wore down his D. However, I agree that Fleury was pretty bad in the first round series last year. He'd be fine until the first goal got by him and then get rattled.
- bmeltzer

I knew you were gonna get on my ass about this

edit: long and short I find it odd that guys like Carter are bashed at will here while briere has been defended as if he's the messiah.

is everyone sippin' on Grandpa's medicine this afternoon?
- KGBflyers10

Pfft. Heck, no!

I gulped!

Bill,

if the flyers find a partner to trade a buyout candidate for briere , a 1 for 1, and the other team buys out briere.....can we sign him? I know if we buy him out we can't resign him for a year but our trash for your trash then each team can resign a player they may want to keep but b/c of cap hits can not afford not to amnesty. I think we would like briere and he wants to stay at a cap friendly #. What do you think?
- huks99

Technically, yes the Flyers could do that. However, I suspect the NHL would almost definitely investigate it, and then strike the blatantly pre-arranged re-signing down as "against the spirit of the (still-not-formally completed) CBA"."

Maybe not 'Briere Must Go' as I originally stated, but you did make your unhappiness with him known.

I'm not trying to start this up again, Joe, but I will take the full moon into account when appraising today's posts.
- tangent_man

okay look I don't like ripping players and I don't particularly being "right" here in that Briere has gone down hill. If it were up to me, he'd a potted double digit goals this year and been a major contributor. No denying he has been for the most part of his career here.

edit: oh wait, my own stupidity go ahead of me for a second... my avatar is from speak of the devil not bark at the moon so I thought your reference was to uh er maybe it was uh nevermind what the hell, stupid brain damage acting up again.

That's what your wife says?

- FlyersGrace

That's allright, the key to long marriage such as mine is *whispers*, not listening to what you all say.

I knew you were gonna get on my ass about this

edit: long and short I find it odd that guys like Carter are bashed at will here while briere has been defended as if he's the messiah.
- JoeRussomanno

Carter stole the hearts of significant others of many here on HB. Briere did not.

/itstheonlylogicalexplanation

okay look I don't like ripping players and I don't particularly being "right" here in that Briere has gone down hill. If it were up to me, he'd a potted double digit goals this year and been a major contributor. No denying he has been for the most part of his career here.

edit: oh wait, my own stupidity go ahead of me for a second... my avatar is from speak of the devil not bark at the moon so I thought your reference was to uh er maybe it was uh nevermind what the hell, stupid brain damage acting up again.
- JoeRussomanno

Time to switch to Tom Petty's first solo album cover, dude.

Carter stole the hearts of significant others of many here on HB. Briere did not.

/itstheonlylogicalexplanation
- Flyskippy

a face only a mother could love
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BIt3woNCMAA6K3h.jpg

Time to switch to Tom Petty's first solo album cover, dude.


- Flyskippy

I knew you were gonna get on my ass about this

edit: long and short I find it odd that guys like Carter are bashed at will here while briere has been defended as if he's the messiah.
- JoeRussomanno

. Will only add that one of those guys scored a lot of playoff goals and unfailingly created a lot of goodwill off the ice and the other had mostly tough playoffs and started to get a bad rep off the ice. So that tinged some people's perceptions that Carter was not as important to the team as Briere (when he absolutely was, IMO).

Briere and Carter are different sorts of players with one commonality in their offensive game: Both have tended toward pronounced hot and cold streaks in their careers. First-look and last-look impressions tend to be what stick in people's minds, and Briere frequently got out of the gates hot and finished strong in the stretch and playoffs, with his slumps coming in the middle. Carter tended to slump late, which advanced the perception that he wasn't a "clutch" player. In my view, his valleys were simply ill-timed and not a reflection of a lack of ability to produce in the postseason in future years.

a face only a mother could love
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BIt3woNCMAA6K3h.jpg
- wilsonecho91

I had heard about that, but didn't look it up. I have a similar smile without my bridge.

. Will only add that one of those guys scored a lot of playoff goals and unfailingly created a lot of goodwill off the ice and the other had mostly tough playoffs and started to get a bad rep off the ice. So that tinged some people's perceptions that Carter was not as important to the team as Briere (when he absolutely was, IMO).

Briere and Carter are different sorts of players with one commonality in their offensive game: Both have tended toward pronounced hot and cold streaks in their careers. First-look and last-look impressions tend to be what stick in people's minds, and Briere frequently got out of the gates hot and finished strong in the stretch and playoffs, with his slumps coming in the middle. Carter tended to slump late, which advanced the perception that he wasn't a "clutch" player. In my view, his valleys were simply ill-timed and not a reflection of a lack of ability to produce in the postseason in future years.
- bmeltzer

no doubt they were different with a common trait in their offense. As for the off ice drama, I'm trying to only worry about whether they break a law or not. Otherwise I think we could go through everyone's personal life and find something to whine about.

I too got on Carter, I know I came on board here after he and Richards left but i think that yes, most of that criticism was warranted those two got, however If I'm going to give them that flak as do others here I think it's only fair to apply it equally to those players who equally under perform. It's sports and I think we can all agree its about what have you done for me lately.

okay look I don't like ripping players and I don't particularly being "right" here in that Briere has gone down hill. If it were up to me, he'd a potted double digit goals this year and been a major contributor. No denying he has been for the most part of his career here.

edit: oh wait, my own stupidity go ahead of me for a second... my avatar is from speak of the devil not bark at the moon so I thought your reference was to uh er maybe it was uh nevermind what the hell, stupid brain damage acting up again.
- JoeRussomanno

Nah, I was talking Mother Nature.