It just might not be as enjoyable for you as this is.

It's cool. I'd be enjoying it if the Flyers were in the Penguins position too. I cheered alot for the Hawks a few years ago so it's only fair.
- canadianpenfan

Right. It's just the nature of the Philly/Pitt rivalry.

And I'm not counting you guys out of it unless you lose Game 3.

That's just it, it's a classic chicken/egg conundrum.

You can't argue the Pens haven't been playing well, but you have to give some of the credit for that to the Bruins.

I wonder if it's a team chemistry issue?
- wolfhounds

I don't think its a chemistry issue when you win the presidents trophy errr....finish first in the east and advance to the conference finals. The Pens played pretty well in game 1 and probably deserved to win 3-1, but they got zero puck luck and stoned by Rask. It happens. Game 2, I have no explanation for, other than that the B's are played great and the Pens shat the bed in spectacular fashion....so everyone is panicking and trying to diagnose what is wrong with the team....Just like they were when they were struggling with the Islanders. Obviously the situation is a lot more dire today. The question is how do they respond to this mentally? They have the talent to go out and beat the B's 4 times in a row if need be, but I don't know if they have the mental makeup and patience needed to do so.

UMMM ... of the six goals Vokoun has surrendered in this series - how many of them is on him? ZERO. Fleury's two or three gift goals depending on how you perceive them had zero meaning toward last nights game. Goaltending is hardly the issue.

Bylsma deserves every bit of blame in this series. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a fool.
- Oneonta Penguin

you really cant say letting in 6 goals and none are on him is denial, sure the pens D has been bad, but still has to be great in some games and stop em, i agree tho, blysma is alot to blame, has way too much talent on that team and cant lay out a strategy of structure for them to follow, they got it easy first 2 rounds, but when they play a established team, this is what happens to them

That's just it, it's a classic chicken/egg conundrum.

You can't argue the Pens haven't been playing well, but you have to give some of the credit for that to the Bruins.

I wonder if it's a team chemistry issue?
- wolfhounds

i give credit to their defense. we knew going in that they are great in that aspect, but they suffocate the neutral zone. like i said, i can acknowledge and respect that. but i dont see a team being systematically dominant when they tap in a puck served to them on a platter by tanger.

the second marchant goal is not in any way symptomatic of a team being outplayed, same with the second goal overall. those are gifts.

even the first goal of the game, absolutely egregious errors by everyone wearing a pens sweater.

the third goal is where i can see the lines being blurred on credit and whatnot. yeah the defense was absolutely pathetic, but the bruins still demonstrated the skill to execute there. however, by and large the bruins dont even need to string that kind of stuff together.

i understand that largely it is just semantics, but you cant tell me that honestly it is more applicable that others. if the pens were playing smart, energetic hockey, but simply being ground into a pulp by the bruins relentless forecheck, then you tip the cap
- stayinthefnnet

I think the issue is that most here wouldn't accept this as a possibility. Does any Pens fan believe that the Pens playing at their best would lose a 7 game series to Boston ?

I don't think its a chemistry issue when you win the presidents trophy and advance to the conference finals. The Pens played pretty well in game 1 and probably deserved to win 3-1, but they got zero puck luck and stoned by Rask. It happens. Game 2, I have no explanation for, other than that the B's are played great and the Pens shat the bed in spectacular fashion....so everyone is panicking and trying to diagnose what is wrong with the team....Just like they were when they were struggling with the Islanders. Obviously the situation is a lot more dire today. The question is how do they respond to this mentally? They have the talent to go out and beat the B's 4 times in a row if need be, but I don't know if they have the mental makeup and patience needed to do so.
- Emperor Filonius

thats just it right there. im not one to defend bylsma too much, but what can you do? if you need your coach to fill you with fire to play in the eastern conference finals, then get the (frank) out of the league. its the guys on the ice, that have to have a sense of urgency and pride. when crosby and malkin were young, the team had guys like gonchar and guerin. now THEY need to be the guys. they are generational talents, but if they want to be in that rarefied air, then they need to demonstrate that they are winners. if not, then they can continue to collect art rosses instead of rings

I don't think its a chemistry issue when you win the presidents trophy and advance to the conference finals. The Pens played pretty well in game 1 and probably deserved to win 3-1, but they got zero puck luck and stoned by Rask. It happens. Game 2, I have no explanation for, other than that the B's are played great and the Pens shat the bed in spectacular fashion....so everyone is panicking and trying to diagnose what is wrong with the team....Just like they were when they were struggling with the Islanders. Obviously the situation is a lot more dire today. The question is how do they respond to this mentally? They have the talent to go out and beat the B's 4 times in a row if need be, but I don't know if they have the mental makeup and patience needed to do so.
- Emperor Filonius

- canadianpenfan

Doh. Delusions of faux granduer on my part. Don't try to stop me, I was on a roll, like when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor.

I don't think its a chemistry issue when you win the presidents trophy and advance to the conference finals. The Pens played pretty well in game 1 and probably deserved to win 3-1, but they got zero puck luck and stoned by Rask. It happens. Game 2, I have no explanation for, other than that the B's are played great and the Pens shat the bed in spectacular fashion....so everyone is panicking and trying to diagnose what is wrong with the team....Just like they were when they were struggling with the Islanders. Obviously the situation is a lot more dire today. The question is how do they respond to this mentally? They have the talent to go out and beat the B's 4 times in a row if need be, but I don't know if they have the mental makeup and patience needed to do so.
- Emperor Filonius

I think the reality is/was that this was a 2 team conference this year (Pitt/Boston). I remember after picking myself up off the floor after the Caps melted down in Game 7 against the Rags saying that we would probably look back on the Wash/NYR series as two even, mediocre and ultimately irrelevant teams battling it out in the 1st round. The only real blip in the Eastern Conference playoffs has been the Bruins inexplicably allowing the Leafs back into that series and almost losing (which should be, BTW, the main source of hope for Pens fans) and the Pens struggling against the Isles. The Rags/Caps and Sens/Habs series simply eliminated two mediocre teams before the Pens/Bruins finished off the other ones.

The Islanders series, I agree. The Ottawa series, I totally disagree. Pittsburgh outplayed them terribly in every facet because Ottawa doesn't possess the skill pittsburgh has; the talent and the depth.

When a team allows eight of nine goals scored in two games directly off its own unforced errors, you tell me champ, who is more to blame? I don't think you have watched one minute of this series if you don't think Pittsburgh is more to blame than Boston.
- Oneonta Penguin

Boston is a solid squad, mostly intact from their Cup winning season. I don't think that can be under-stated.

When the Pens brought in Iginla, Morrow, and Murray, my first thought was oh (frank), but following quickly after was what will bringing in these vets - including 2 former captains - do to the Pens' team chemistry? Granted, it's an intangible that's difficult to measure, but perhaps it's having an impact.

And I've watched most of both games, and there's no way I would say Pitt's poor performance is more to blame than Boston's good performance. I'm just not clear how you separate one from the other.

I think the issue is that most here wouldn't accept this as a possibility. Does any Pens fan believe that the Pens playing at their best would lose a 7 game series to Boston ?
- MadCap2008

its most certainly a possibility. this boston team is no joke. i know the regular season isnt the best indicator, but those games were wars. that whole little get cute and run up the score poop doesnt fly against those guys. a pens team at its best has the ability to beat anyone, but then again so does this boston team. if this team was playing with passion and intelligence, and yet lucic just muscles his way in for a goal, or chara blasts one in, or bergeron displays his magnificence, it happens. its the playoffs against a formidable opponent. however, when the loss comes via repeated mental errors, and goaltending that allows marchants second goal to go in, its just pathetic to watch.

you really cant say letting in 6 goals and none are on him is denial, sure the pens D has been bad, but still has to be great in some games and stop em, i agree tho, blysma is alot to blame, has way too much talent on that team and cant lay out a strategy of structure for them to follow, they got it easy first 2 rounds, but when they play a established team, this is what happens to them
- Hawkeyes

You haven't watched one single minute of this series if you think more than one at most was on him.

I equate this series to a football game. Say the Steelers and Baltimore. Pittsburgh turns it over six times inside their own 20 yard line, all unforced. Its an automatic chip shot field goal for Baltimore even if it doesn't make one single yard.

Boston is a solid squad, mostly intact from their Cup winning season. I don't think that can be under-stated.

When the Pens brought in Iginla, Morrow, and Murray, my first thought was oh (frank), but following quickly after was what will bringing in these vets - including 2 former captains - do to the Pens' team chemistry? Granted, it's an intangible that's difficult to measure, but perhaps it's having an impact.

And I've watched most of both games, and there's no way I would say Pitt's poor performance is more to blame than Boston's good performance. I'm just not clear how you separate one from the other.
- wolfhounds

boston is a hell of a team. but then again, so are the pens. neither team should be running totally amok over the other barring a total lapse by the other side. if the pens were winning games 6 to 1 over the bruins, it would likely be due to some major flaw of their own doing. this isnt against ottawa, where the talent disparity is so great that one side can run away with simply of their own accord.

I think the issue is that most here wouldn't accept this as a possibility. Does any Pens fan believe that the Pens playing at their best would lose a 7 game series to Boston ?
- MadCap2008

Yes, Boston is good enough to beat Pittsburgh in a game seven when the Pens are playing their best. We have lost to worse teams in game seven's before. Anything happens in that game. Ask your Caps.

The crux of this is I will tip my cap to Boston and give it 100% credit when/if the Pens show up and play with heart, energy, urgency, conviction, and play a smart game. Last night, I can only give 45% credit, since I think the Pens didn't show any of that and handed Boston those goals on a silver platter.

I think the issue is that most here wouldn't accept this as a possibility. Does any Pens fan believe that the Pens playing at their best would lose a 7 game series to Boston ?
- MadCap2008

Lurking through the posts, sounds eerily similar to a certain west coast Canadian team's fanbase a few years ago.

Yes, Boston is good enough to beat Pittsburgh in a game seven when the Pens are playing their best. We have lost to worse teams in game seven's before. Anything happens in that game. Ask your Caps.

The crux of this is I will tip my cap to Boston and give it 100% credit when/if the Pens show up and play with heart, energy, urgency, conviction, and play a smart game. Last night, I can only give 45% credit, since I think the Pens didn't show any of that and handed Boston those goals on a silver platter.
- Oneonta Penguin

exactly. i think people are confusing the fact that we are largely blaming the pens as being synonymous with saying that the bruins are garbage. thats not it at all.

Boston is a solid squad, mostly intact from their Cup winning season. I don't think that can be under-stated.

When the Pens brought in Iginla, Morrow, and Murray, my first thought was oh (frank), but following quickly after was what will bringing in these vets - including 2 former captains - do to the Pens' team chemistry? Granted, it's an intangible that's difficult to measure, but perhaps it's having an impact.

And I've watched most of both games, and there's no way I would say Pitt's poor performance is more to blame than Boston's good performance. I'm just not clear how you separate one from the other.
- wolfhounds

First, I totally disagreed with Shero acquiring Iginla. He has shown me nothing.

As far as your last comment, from my vantage point, its very easy to separate one from the other in this instance. Boston can't play any better and Pittsburgh can't play any worse. When a team gives the opposition eight goals in two games handed to them, I'd say they are to blame moreso than the opposition. Agree to disagree. I personally don't care what you think to be honest. You are a Flyers fan.

Lurking through the posts, sounds eerily similar to a certain west coast Canadian team's fanbase a few years ago.
- Double_A

I can't speak for anyone else but I'm not shocked we're losing to Boston. I am however shocked that they don't even seem to be competing and are getting absolutely demolished in every facet of the game outside of hitting.

Boston is a great team, but it would be foolish for anyone to think they've seen Pittsburgh's best to this point. And yes, alot of that has to do with how Boston is playing them.

exactly. i think people are confusing the fact that we are largely blaming the pens as being synonymous with saying that the bruins are garbage. thats not it at all.
- stayinthefnnet

exactly. They aren't garbage. But they certainly aren't eight goals better in two games either. When both teams play their best, this goes six or seven games and they are one goal games. One team has played as good as they can, while the other hasn't shown up in four of the six periods.

I don't think its a chemistry issue when you win the presidents trophy errr....finish first in the east and advance to the conference finals. The Pens played pretty well in game 1 and probably deserved to win 3-1, but they got zero puck luck and stoned by Rask. It happens. Game 2, I have no explanation for, other than that the B's are played great and the Pens shat the bed in spectacular fashion....so everyone is panicking and trying to diagnose what is wrong with the team....Just like they were when they were struggling with the Islanders. Obviously the situation is a lot more dire today. The question is how do they respond to this mentally? They have the talent to go out and beat the B's 4 times in a row if need be, but I don't know if they have the mental makeup and patience needed to do so.
- Emperor Filonius

Yup. Probably not. But to be fair, the Pens were rolling through the competition before they made any trades, which is part of the reason I found them (the trades) curious.

No doubt the Pens have the talent, but something isn't in gear for your team. It just seems that the Pens' strength, offense, is running into the Bruins' strength, defense, and the Bruins are winning the battle. On top of that, it seems the Pens are getting exposed defensively and aren't giving their goalie the proper support.

Still, win Game 3 and this series looks radically different heading into Game 4.

You haven't watched one single minute of this series if you think more than one at most was on him.

I equate this series to a football game. Say the Steelers and Baltimore. Pittsburgh turns it over six times inside their own 20 yard line, all unforced. Its an automatic chip shot field goal for Baltimore even if it doesn't make one single yard.
- Oneonta Penguin

I would say that Vokoun has not been the problem and that most of the goals he has given up would have required a miraculous save. Here's the dilemma for the Pens, though - the guy who can make that miraculous save that they often need due to their style of play is Fleury, but at the moment his confidence appears to be shot.

I would say that Vokoun has not been the problem and that most of the goals he has given up would have required a miraculous save. Here's the dilemma for the Pens, though - the guy who can make that miraculous save that they often need due to their style of play is Fleury, but at the moment his confidence appears to be shot.
- MadCap2008

Fleury and Letang are two peas in a pod right now. Million dollar play potential, nick and dime plays consistently being screwed up.

Lurking through the posts, sounds eerily similar to a certain west coast Canadian team's fanbase a few years ago.
- Double_A

No, the difference is some of us aren't shocked to be down in the series. Boston is very good. After all, why do you think Shero acquire Iggy, Murray and Morrow. It was for this reason - this series - not Ottawa, or NY.

It's the fact we have rolled over and died. Pittsburgh has only played with heart, emotion and conviction two of the six periods. We have been a no show most of the time. If we showed up and played with urgency, heart and conviction, it would be easier to take and you would be given full credit. Sorry, you don't get full credit for beating a team that hasn't shown up to play 67% of the series.

Vancouver didn't have near the talent we had or have at the time they played you.

boston is a hell of a team. but then again, so are the pens. neither team should be running totally amok over the other barring a total lapse by the other side. if the pens were winning games 6 to 1 over the bruins, it would likely be due to some major flaw of their own doing. this isnt against ottawa, where the talent disparity is so great that one side can run away with simply of their own accord.
- stayinthefnnet

yup, fair point, stayinthefnnet.

Fleury and Letang are two peas in a pod right now. Million dollar play potential, nick and dime plays consistently being screwed up.
- Gunner Staal

I actually feel bad for Fleury, seems like a decent guy and just appears shell-shocked. Letang's struggles make me happy, though