CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Ryane Clowe ($4.000m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Tye McGinn ($0.775m) / Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Braydon Coburn ($4.500m) / Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m)
Erik Gustafsson ($1.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m)
Kent Huskins ($0.800m) / Bruno Gervais ($0.825m)
Chris Pronger ($4.941m) / Marc-Andre Bourdon ($0.613m)
GOALTENDERS
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
Ray Emery ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
Buyout: Ilya Bryzgalov ($0.000m)
Buyout: Danny Briere ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)

(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,045,595; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (25-man roster): $3,054,405

Compiled by TSN's Scott Cullen...actually works for me
- Jsaquella

This seems very realistic. I'm not overly excited about it but I am ready to support a team that looks just like this, because it is likely. Don't like the D staying the same, too many injury concerns.

OK, so a cash strapped team that is stuck with a bad contract is either going to pay that player full value of the contract or dump it on someone else. Example, Rick DiPietro. Now, no one is going to take on that contract. But there are other cases where the remaining years are not so bad that might work.

Also, what if they assets they are getting back justify paying 6 million (half) of Pronger's contract? For example, say the Flyers wanted Visnovsky, but would have a problem due to cap hit, even after buying out Briere. Islanders would also have a problem trading Visnovsky as they really need his cap hit. The Flyers could trade Pronger plus Read (or whoever gets it done), get Visnovsky for 2 years and then 2 "cap free" years at the backend where they would have had to pay Pronger but now are rid of him.

I agree though, most likely case is either next year or 2 years from now.
- TheGreat28

If Pronger is traded, it'll be in 2 years when he's owed $575,000 in salary per year the final 2 years of his contract. I don't think the Islanders would want to pay a guy $6 million over 4 years to not play when they could pay Visnovsky $3.5 million more over 2 years to actually produce.

You can speculate that was the intention all you want. The facts are that they buried him and removed all of the Cap hit. That's all that matters. And that's the whole reason they made the trade. To buy cap space. The Flyers weren't going to do that to Gagne.
- MJL

I am not speculating on intention. There are two separate transactions on the NHL transaction list, executed at different times.

1. Flyers acquire Matt Walker from Tampa Bay in exchange for Simone Gagne.
2. Flyers designate Matt Walker for assignment.

When they executed 1, they saved 1.8 million in cap room in 2011, but took on 1.7 million in 2012. The net is about the same, but they spread it out over two years. Oh, and they gave up the better player to do so. It was a salary dump.

You are in fact speculating that their intent from the very beginning was to bury Walker in the minors. If that was the case, they could have buried Gagne in the minors in 2011 and not had to play games with Walker in 2012.

I am going buy Holmgren's words at the time:

“This was a move to solidify our defense,” said Holmgren. “Matt Walker is a right shot defenseman that we like; he brings size, grit and toughness to our backend. Simon Gagne played 10 seasons for the Flyers and was not only a good player for us, but also handled himself in a first class manner on and off the ice.”

If Pronger is traded, it'll be in 2 years when he's owed $575,000 in salary per year the final 2 years of his contract. I don't think the Islanders would want to pay a guy $6 million over 4 years to not play when they could pay Visnovsky $3.5 million more over 2 years to actually produce.
- NickTheKid87

Who are the other buyout candidates? Anyone have a link to McKenzie or other's speculating?

Visnovsky was just an example. Obviously I picked a team that needed to get to the floor.

I agree, it is much more likely after salary drops significantly. But it could work sooner...the Flyers would have to give up more assets today then they will in 2 years. So in return, the player has to provide value back to them. Maybe there isn't such a player.

I am going buy Holmgren's words at the time:

“This was a move to solidify our defense,” said Holmgren. “Matt Walker is a right shot defenseman that we like; he brings size, grit and toughness to our backend. Simon Gagne played 10 seasons for the Flyers and was not only a good player for us, but also handled himself in a first class manner on and off the ice.”
- TheGreat28

You can. But it sounds better than:

"Well, we kinda backed ourselves into a cap corner, so we needed to trade Simon Gagne, who's done nothing but be a great player for us for 10 seasons, for a player who we expect to play for us here and there, in order to be cap compliant."

Who are the other buyout candidates? Anyone have a link to McKenzie or other's speculating?

Visnovsky was just an example. Obviously I picked a team that needed to get to the floor.

I agree, it is much more likely after salary drops significantly. But it could work sooner...the Flyers would have to give up more assets today then they will in 2 years. So in return, the player has to provide value back to them. Maybe there isn't such a player.
- TheGreat28

Ballard from Vancouver.
Most likely DiPietro

OK, so a cash strapped team that is stuck with a bad contract is either going to pay that player full value of the contract or dump it on someone else. Example, Rick DiPietro. Now, no one is going to take on that contract. But there are other cases where the remaining years are not so bad that might work.

Also, what if they assets they are getting back justify paying 6 million (half) of Pronger's contract? For example, say the Flyers wanted Visnovsky, but would have a problem due to cap hit, even after buying out Briere. Islanders would also have a problem trading Visnovsky as they really need his cap hit. The Flyers could trade Pronger plus Read (or whoever gets it done), get Visnovsky for 2 years and then 2 "cap free" years at the backend where they would have had to pay Pronger but now are rid of him.

I agree though, most likely case is either next year or 2 years from now.
- TheGreat28

MY head is spinning trying to interpret all this. I'm also trying to find the rules for retaining salary/cap hit in the CBA, so that might be influencing it.

I now have a decent grip on Article 27 though.

You can. But it sounds better than:

"Well, we kinda backed ourselves into a cap corner, so we needed to trade Simon Gagne, who's done nothing but be a great player for us for 10 seasons, for a player who we expect to play for us here and there, in order to be cap compliant."
- jmatchett383

Or:

"Well, we like Gagne, so we didn't want to bury him in the minors just to fit under the cap. So we traded him for this Walker guy, we really don't mind ending his NHL career."

Ballard from Vancouver.
Most likely DiPietro
- jmatchett383

Someone threw Dany Heatley's name out there. I thought so too until I noticed he only has one more year on his contract. He would be a good fit here right now. He's slowed down a bit but we could use him.

You can. But it sounds better than:

"Well, we kinda backed ourselves into a cap corner, so we needed to trade Simon Gagne, who's done nothing but be a great player for us for 10 seasons, for a player who we expect to play for us here and there, in order to be cap compliant."
- jmatchett383

I knew someone was gonna comment about Holmgren double-speak

But look at the training camp roster for that year...Walker was originally thought to be a 6th/7th dman. He just sucked.

jagr looks like he still has gas in the tank because of the shortened season, no jagr next yearr plz ty

My roster:

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Nathan Horton ($4.500m)
Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Simon Gagne ($2.500m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m) / Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) / Tye McGinn ($0.775m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Braydon Coburn ($4.500m) / Erik Gustafsson ($0.851m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m)
Bruno Gervais ($0.825m) / Marc-Andre Bourdon ($0.613m)
Chris Pronger ($4.941m) /
GOALTENDERS
Ray Emery ($2.500m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
Buyout: Danny Briere ($0.000m)
Buyout: Ilya Bryzgalov ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $67,096,095; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (25-man roster): $3,905

I am not speculating on intention. There are two separate transactions on the NHL transaction list, executed at different times.

1. Flyers acquire Matt Walker from Tampa Bay in exchange for Simone Gagne.
2. Flyers designate Matt Walker for assignment.

When they executed 1, they saved 1.8 million in cap room in 2011, but took on 1.7 million in 2012. The net is about the same, but they spread it out over two years. Oh, and they gave up the better player to do so. It was a salary dump.

You are in fact speculating that their intent from the very beginning was to bury Walker in the minors. If that was the case, they could have buried Gagne in the minors in 2011 and not had to play games with Walker in 2012.

I am going buy Holmgren's words at the time:

“This was a move to solidify our defense,” said Holmgren. “Matt Walker is a right shot defenseman that we like; he brings size, grit and toughness to our backend. Simon Gagne played 10 seasons for the Flyers and was not only a good player for us, but also handled himself in a first class manner on and off the ice.”
- TheGreat28

Nice PR there by Holmgren. They liked him so much, that he played 8 games in a Flyers uniform in 3 Seasons. The Flyers were not going to bury Simon Gagne in the minors. They would not do that to a player who has handled himself in a first class manor, and has been a Flyer his whole career to that point. The two separate transactions is irrelevant. Walker was not waiver exempt, so they could not directly assign him to the Phantoms. He had to be waived and then demoted. It wasn't a salary dump. It was a Cap space move. The Flyers needed to clear Cap space, not salary. If it wasn't for the Cap space, Gagne possibly would have remained a Flyer.

Someone threw Dany Heatley's name out there. I thought so too until I noticed he only has one more year on his contract. He would be a good fit here right now. He's slowed down a bit but we could use him.
- dingo8urbaby

If Minnesota was struggling to get to floor, Heatley would have been the PERFECT example.

Pronger owed 12 million, flyers can pay up to 6 million of that. Heatley is owed 5 million. So the net "cost" to Minn would be 1 million dollars. But they get a 4.9 million cap hit until 2017.

Now, they lose Heatley for a year. Flyers need some offense, and maybe he buys you one year until next offseason. So what is that worth to Flyers and Minnesota?

Cousins? Laughton? McGinn?

EDIT: bold comment above

Or:

"Well, we like Gagne, so we didn't want to bury him in the minors just to fit under the cap. So we traded him for this Walker guy, we really don't mind ending his NHL career."

- BulliesPhan87

Exactly! We have no loyalty to Matt Walker. Life's a female dog for Matt.

jagr looks like he still has gas in the tank because of the shortened season, no jagr next yearr plz ty
- Don'tForgetTocchet

agreed, he is slowwwwwwing down. If it is cheap, on a 1 yr deal, and one of only a few options available then fine but not as a target IMHO.

jagr looks like he still has gas in the tank because of the shortened season, no jagr next yearr plz ty
- Don'tForgetTocchet

He'd be great for 40 games or so, then Akeson gets his shot.

I'm joking.
I appreciate what Jagr did here last year but they did the right thing moving on.

If Minnesota was cap-strapped, Heatley would have been the PERFECT example.

Pronger owed 12 million, flyers can pay up to 6 million of that. Heatley is owed 5 million. So the net "cost" to Minn would be 1 million dollars. But they get a 4.9 million cap hit until 2017.

Now, they lose Heatley for a year. Flyers need some offense, and maybe he buys you one year until next offseason. So what is that worth to Flyers and Minnesota?

Cousins? Laughton? McGinn?
- TheGreat28

So the Cap strapped team is going to take on more money? And be stuck with a player who won't play for them. Taking up a contract slot?

Exactly! We have no loyalty to Matt Walker. Life's a female dog for Matt.
- MJL

Of course, for ~$1.7 I definitely wouldn't mind a hockey vacation to Adirondack.

Nice PR there by Holmgren. They liked him so much, that he played 8 games in a Flyers uniform in 3 Seasons. The Flyers were not going to bury Simon Gagne in the minors. They would not do that to a player who has handled himself in a first class manor, and has been a Flyer his whole career to that point. The two separate transactions is irrelevant. Walker was not waiver exempt, so they could not directly assign him to the Phantoms. He had to be waived and then demoted. It wasn't a salary dump. It was a Cap space move. The Flyers needed to clear Cap space, not salary. If it wasn't for the Cap space, Gagne possibly would have remained a Flyer.
- MJL

It was absolutely a cap space move. I believe they originally thought Walker could play a role on the team; you believe they never thought that and planned to send him to the minors when they traded for him. We'll agree to disagree.

I do agree they would NEVER have actually put Gagne in the minors for the reasons you stated.

So the Cap strapped team is going to take on more money? And be stuck with a player who won't play for them. Taking up a contract slot?
- MJL

Sorry, meant team struggling to get to Floor.

jagr looks like he still has gas in the tank because of the shortened season, no jagr next yearr plz ty
- Don'tForgetTocchet

Agreed. If we had another short season coming up, though? I'd love to have him back.

Nice PR there by Holmgren. They liked him so much, that he played 8 games in a Flyers uniform in 3 Seasons. The Flyers were not going to bury Simon Gagne in the minors. They would not do that to a player who has handled himself in a first class manor, and has been a Flyer his whole career to that point. The two separate transactions is irrelevant. Walker was not waiver exempt, so they could not directly assign him to the Phantoms. He had to be waived and then demoted. It wasn't a salary dump. It was a Cap space move. The Flyers needed to clear Cap space, not salary. If it wasn't for the Cap space, Gagne possibly would have remained a Flyer.
- MJL

Yep.

Agreed. If we had another short season coming up, though? I'd love to have him back.
- BulliesPhan87

If they signed Jagr to start playing in January, it might work out fine.

My roster:

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Nathan Horton ($4.500m)
Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Simon Gagne ($2.500m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m) / Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) / Tye McGinn ($0.775m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Braydon Coburn ($4.500m) / Erik Gustafsson ($0.851m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m)
Bruno Gervais ($0.825m) / Marc-Andre Bourdon ($0.613m)
Chris Pronger ($4.941m) /
GOALTENDERS
Ray Emery ($2.500m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
Buyout: Danny Briere ($0.000m)
Buyout: Ilya Bryzgalov ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $67,096,095; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (25-man roster): $3,905
- NickTheKid87

I'd be cool with this if:

1.) Nathan Horton didn't seem so redundant on a line with Scott Hartnell.

2.) Nathan Horton wasn't made of Canadian glass.