This isn't really contributing anything. Either respond with words or don't respond at all.
- micah555

Okay

I love that you all think Luongo has no value because of his contract, but if Gillis had never stated they were moving forward with Schneider, Luongo would magically have been traded for a tonne of value already.

You also say he has no value, because of his contract, and yet apparently there were all these great offers a year or two ago for him (when he still had the contract, and there was even more time left on it) that Gillis just turned down because he wanted more.

Zero logic in your argument.
- KB3Point0

By announcing Cory as the starter he destroyed any leverage he had in any talks for Lu. Lu's contract is what makes him a must-trade b/c with Cory the starter that makes Lu the backup. And as I stated before no team in the NHL can afford to have their backup goaltender making $5.3M. It's all about leverage. I'm sure the offers Gillis received weren't great nor did I ever say they were. However, I'm willing to bet Gillis received offers and any of them are/were better than getting nothing. Lu is a very good goaltender, a little bit of a headcase under pressure but a very good goaltender nonetheless. However, his contract while reasonable at the cap hit for a #1 goes way too long and teams can't just focus on today they have to look at the future also. Lu's contract sucks for the future which is why if a team is willing to pick up that contract they aren't willing to give up good assets to get him b/c as I explained before the team trading for Lu is now doing a favor to the Nucks instead of trading for an excellent asset. The absence of leverage caused the bolded statement to be true, the announcement of Schneider as the starter removed any leverage the Nucks had

That seems to be the question of the day?
- Cptmjl

I'm beginning to feel like we won't get an answer.

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I never said that. You're never going to get great value for Luongo, because of his contract. Gillis further reduced that value by toying around and being indecisive. I'm not sure what's so hard to grasp there. I have no emotional involvement in the decision, so this is all coming from a neutral outsider. Everything comes back to Gillis. He signed him to the contract (which is fine if he remains your number one), he replaced him with a new goaltender, and he failed to trade him because he got greedy with his asking price. This isn't rocket science.

EDIT - Once Gillis signed Luongo's deal, a career commitment existed. Getting out of that commitment at full value was always going to be impossible.
- Michael_Stuart

What's so hard to understand here? He didn't get greedy with his asking price. He has not been offered anything he could take yet. This isn't rocket science.

What's so hard to understand here? He didn't get greedy with his asking price. He has not been offered anything he could take yet. This isn't rocket science.
- KB3Point0

Is that not the pure definition of greed?

GM 1: I'll give you a second round pick for Luongo
Gillis: No, I can't take that. I want more.

By announcing Cory as the starter he destroyed any leverage he had in any talks for Lu. Lu's contract is what makes him a must-trade b/c with Cory the starter that makes Lu the backup. And as I stated before no team in the NHL can afford to have their backup goaltender making $5.3M. It's all about leverage. I'm sure the offers Gillis received weren't great nor did I ever say they were. However, I'm willing to bet Gillis received offers and any of them are/were better than getting nothing. Lu is a very good goaltender, a little bit of a headcase under pressure but a very good goaltender nonetheless. However, his contract while reasonable at the cap hit for a #1 goes way too long and teams can't just focus on today they have to look at the future also. Lu's contract sucks for the future which is why if a team is willing to pick up that contract they aren't willing to give up good assets to get him b/c as I explained before the team trading for Lu is now doing a favor to the Nucks instead of trading for an excellent asset. The absence of leverage caused the bolded statement to be true, the announcement of Schneider as the starter removed any leverage the Nucks had
- uf1910

He did not receive any offers he could take (ie from teams Luongo was willing to waive his no trade clause for). That is the entire crux of your argument and you are assuming incorrectly.

I'm guessing that was a joke, hopefully?
- Cptmjl

Is it a joke that I'd think that NYI would accept that trade? Of course. If MG managed to pull that trade off - he gets a contract for life.

By announcing Cory as the starter he destroyed any leverage he had in any talks for Lu. Lu's contract is what makes him a must-trade b/c with Cory the starter that makes Lu the backup. And as I stated before no team in the NHL can afford to have their backup goaltender making $5.3M. It's all about leverage. I'm sure the offers Gillis received weren't great nor did I ever say they were. However, I'm willing to bet Gillis received offers and any of them are/were better than getting nothing. Lu is a very good goaltender, a little bit of a headcase under pressure but a very good goaltender nonetheless. However, his contract while reasonable at the cap hit for a #1 goes way too long and teams can't just focus on today they have to look at the future also. Lu's contract sucks for the future which is why if a team is willing to pick up that contract they aren't willing to give up good assets to get him b/c as I explained before the team trading for Lu is now doing a favor to the Nucks instead of trading for an excellent asset. The absence of leverage caused the bolded statement to be true, the announcement of Schneider as the starter removed any leverage the Nucks had
- uf1910

Good point. They should have just started Schneider without announcing it. Maybe nobody would have noticed.

Is that not the pure definition of greed?

GM 1: I'll give you a second round pick for Luongo
Gillis: No, I can't take that. I want more.
- Michael_Stuart

Catch up. He was not offered anything he could take because Luongo wouldn't waive his no trade clause to accept it. The only deal he was allegedly offered that Luongo would have waived his no trade for was to the Leafs at the trade deadline when Nonis asked for him to eat some of the contract (and cap hit) 20 minutes before the deadline. Eating cap hit to trade him defeats the point of trading him.

What's so hard to understand here? He didn't get greedy with his asking price. He has not been offered anything he could take yet. This isn't rocket science.
- KB3Point0

He's not going to get anything and that isn't rocket science. By having a backup goaltender at a $5.3M cap hit signed into his 40's he becomes a must-trade instead of a good asset. Announcing Cory as the starter just exacerbated the issue and announced that Lu had to go. The contract is a deterrent for other teams and everyone knows Vancouver has to trade Lu. Those conditions definitely bring back good value

Is it a joke that I'd think that NYI would accept that trade? Of course. If MG managed to pull that trade off - he gets a contract for life.
- Canuckleafer

I was referring to the trade proposal itself that you were commenting on. I do believe you would be right though. If only Milbury was still GM.

Gillis F'ed UP BIG time...LUO shoulda been gone ASAP......i cant stand gillis, why he puts the team through this..& LUO.......messed up season......yet again

Good point. They should have just started Schneider without announcing it. Maybe nobody would have noticed.

- hankthetank

Announcing it at a press conference doesn't add anything to it though does it?

He's not going to get anything and that isn't rocket science. By having a backup goaltender at a $5.3M cap hit signed into his 40's he becomes a must-trade instead of a good asset. Announcing Cory as the starter just exacerbated the issue and announced that Lu had to go. The contract is a deterrent for other teams and everyone knows Vancouver has to trade Lu. Those conditions definitely bring back good value
- uf1910

This is not a conversation about whether he'll get value. It's a conversation about whether Gillis should be fired for his handling of the Luongo situation. As he hasn't been offered a deal he could accept (due to Luongo's no trade clause) he hasn't turned down anything he could accept. Therefore, it's pretty hard to say he deserves to be fired for being indecisive and greedy.

Catch up. He was not offered anything he could take because Luongo wouldn't waive his no trade clause to accept it. The only deal he was allegedly offered that Luongo would have waived his no trade for was to the Leafs at the trade deadline when Nonis asked for him to eat some of the contract (and cap hit) 20 minutes before the deadline. Eating cap hit to trade him defeats the point of trading him.
- KB3Point0

This is a ridiculous assertion. Luongo would have waved to go to Florida, but the reports out of here (last summer) were that Gillis was asking way too much for Tallon to bite. That's the definition of greed. This is not a hard thing to figure out.

Announcing it at a press conference doesn't add anything to it though does it?
- Cptmjl

Considering teams are still trying to acquire Schneider, no, it doesn't.

This is a ridiculous assertion. Luongo would have waved to go to Florida, but the reports out of here (last summer) were that Gillis was asking way too much for Tallon to bite. That's the definition of greed. This is not a hard thing to figure out.
- Michael_Stuart

No, the reports are Tallon didn't want his contract and never actually offered anything.

Thank you! Even if Luongo was willing to waive his no trade to go to Toronto at that point, which he was not, no one actually knows what was offered. In fact, some reporters (Cox) have reported both that there was a substantial offer, and that there was no offer.
- KB3Point0

You don't know that.

Sorry.

And as for the offers, most seem to think that if (and it's a big if) Toronto made an inquiry, it was dependant on the Canucks eating some salary.

As per above, we will never know.

This is not a conversation about whether he'll get value. It's a conversation about whether Gillis should be fired for his handling of the Luongo situation. As he hasn't been offered a deal he could accept (due to Luongo's no trade clause) he hasn't turned down anything he could accept. Therefore, it's pretty hard to say he deserves to be fired for being indecisive and greedy.
- KB3Point0

He hasn't turned down anything he could accept because he's been asking for the world. Starting the conversation with Florida with Gudbranson, Huberdeau, etc. wasn't going to get Gillis anywhere. This is mismanagement.

This is a ridiculous assertion. Luongo would have waved to go to Florida, but the reports out of here (last summer) were that Gillis was asking way too much for Tallon to bite. That's the definition of greed. This is not a hard thing to figure out.
- Michael_Stuart

We know Tallon is greedy. What's your point?

He hasn't turned down anything he could accept because he's been asking for the world. Starting the conversation with Florida with Gudbranson, Huberdeau, etc. wasn't going to get Gillis anywhere. This is mismanagement.
- Michael_Stuart

Source?

Good point. They should have just started Schneider without announcing it. Maybe nobody would have noticed.

- hankthetank

Announcing a goaltender as the starter for the next season is not the same as having another tender fill in for a struggling tender (see Vokoun, MAF). I don't understand why this is so hard to understand.

By announcing to everyone in the world they were moving forward with Schneider, it basically made Lu and his contract a must-trade. Teams weren't lining up b/c of his contract, only a select few were even willing to consider it. And the ones that did weren't going to offer much b/c after announcing Cory as the #1 again Lu HAD TO BE TRADED. Leverage is a real thing people and Gillis removed any leverage he had in trade negotiations by effectively removing the other half of his leverage see-saw from the equation. If they didn't announce, he could "field" offers for Cory also. Use that as leverage in the talks with teams for Lu but meanwhile in reality the "talks" for Cory are just for show. Is that really difficult to see?

Source?
- hankthetank

Dale Tallon spoke at length about teams trying to raid the organization of Huberdeau and other star prospects. It's widely known that discussions were ongoing.

http://sports.nationalpos...price-for-roberto-luongo/

We're both hockey fans. What makes you more connected to the Islanders than me?
Islanders are desperate for a goalie. When Nabokov is you're number 1 goalie you know you're in need of an upgrade. Islanders are getting infamous for drafting the wrong player or their draft picks not reaching their potential. Raymond is a proven top 6 player and Luongo is still the best goalie in the NHL when he wants to be. It's actually a one sided deal for the Isles if you break it down but the Canucks need to get younger. Neither Nino or Dehaan is even ready for the NHL and might never be.
- hankthetank

Any reason why he currently doesn't want to be?