Giroux is MOST DEFINITELY not above average defensively. He is average on his best nights, and below average in most nights. He tends to lose his men in the defensive zone and rarely busts his ass getting deep on the defensive zone back check. He will improve, and he has over the course of his career, but overall he is NOT anything more than an average defender.
- MBFlyerfan

Do you watch him play defense on a good defensive night for him? When he wants to be he is a monster on defense.

That proves that he's a contributor to an already existing team with talent, not a leading player that you build around to become that team.

The Flyers had 102 points the season after Richards and Carter were gone. They don't miss them. They miss Chris Pronger, who is truly a difference-maker.
- AllInForFlyers

I would say Pronger was more than a difference maker. And I think the Flyers' 102 point season had more to do with how well those trades worked out, rather than 17 & 18 being negligible.

Pronger wasn't around for most of those 102 points, so I don't quite follow the difference maker logic.

Backstrom gets 3 year deal from Minnesota.

Minnesota Wild ‏@mnwild 9m

BREAKING: #mnwild has agreed to terms with goalie Niklas Backstrom on a three-year contract. MORE:
- Jsaquella

Lou it is

Which one?

The Wilkes-Barre/Scranton dressing room?
- johndewar

And they lost in the first round in the playoffs. Are you really going to argue that the Flyers didnt take a step back as a team in the short term by making those trades? They went from a Cup team to what? And Pronger getting injured was certanly a factor there. I think you're giving Carter and Richards less credit then the deserve in what they did for LA.
- MJL

No, the Flyers made it to the second round of the playoffs without Carter and Richards, beating Pittsburgh in six in the first round.

That was as far as the Flyers got in 2011, after beating Buffalo in the first round.

And I would argue that the Flyers are not worse off in the short term for trading Richards and Carter. They're worse off from losing Chris Pronger -- that's the loss that can't be quantified or replaced.

He prefers the title Cameraman and US distributor
- Jsaquella

He just collects the money

And they lost in the first round in the playoffs. Are you really going to argue that the Flyers didnt take a step back as a team in the short term by making those trades? They went from a Cup team to what? And Pronger getting injured was certanly a factor there. I think you're giving Carter and Richards less credit then the deserve in what they did for LA.
- MJL

They should have kept Richards and traded Carter. Then you have Giroux and Richards as 1A and 1B centers.

Lou it is
- aosplayo

Well, there's a couple of viable goaltending alternatives off the market. It's looking more and more like Bryz stays unless Lu gets bought out and we can get him here..

Do you watch him play defense on a good defensive night for him? When he wants to be he is a monster on defense.
- JAKEw1234

He does have nights where he plays very well, but those are VASTLY out numbered by bad nights.

He is a decent defensive forward... nothing special at all.

Now, I also think some of his deficiencies could be attributed to his coach.

What is he doing?
- MJL

trying to get his client out of philly

Matt Walker invited to flyers camp on tryout basis
- funmaster18

This is a joke, right? RIGHT?

They should have kept Richards and traded Carter. Then you have Giroux and Richards as 1A and 1B centers.
- Feanor

The Carter trade, I fully understood when it was made.

The Richards trade, at the time, was way more of a surprise to me.

I would say Pronger was more than a difference maker. And I think the Flyers' 102 point season had more to do with how well those trades worked out, rather than 17 & 18 being negligible.

Pronger wasn't around for most of those 102 points, so I don't quite follow the difference maker logic.
- BulliesPhan87

There was an article written a couple of years ago about "The Pronger Effect" that explains what happens to teams the season after he leaves. Every single team that he has played for and left has experienced the same dropoff in defensive play that the Flyers experienced in the season after he was gone.

You can cover for greatness in the short term. You can't fake it forever.

Backstrom gets 3 year deal from Minnesota.

Minnesota Wild ‏@mnwild 9m

BREAKING: #mnwild has agreed to terms with goalie Niklas Backstrom on a three-year contract. MORE:
- Jsaquella

# of teams in the mkt for a starting goalie is dwindling. it's musical chairs for goalies...

Do you watch him play defense on a good defensive night for him? When he wants to be he is a monster on defense.
- JAKEw1234

I have seen him play very well defensively. But not consistently. And it seems that when he makes his MONSTER defensive plays, it is usually because he has a bug up his ass after making a terrible defensive play that leads to a goal or good scoring chance.

Fans view the Richards and Carter Cup win the same way they view the Bob Vezina or Patrick Sharp's Cup win. After the fact complaining. You could make the argument people were more upset about the Patrick Sharp Cup in over the Richards and Carter Cup Win.
- dingo8urbaby

I don't. I view the Bobrovsky thing as a huge Lavi (frank)up. Always have, always will.

Beyond that...meh.

I have seen him play very well defensively. But not consistently. And it seems that when he makes his MONSTER defensive plays, it is usually because he has a bug up his ass after making a terrible defensive play that leads to a goal or good scoring chance.
- MBFlyerfan

2tru

There was an article written a couple of years ago about "The Pronger Effect" that explains what happens to teams the season after he leaves. Every single team that he has played for and left has experienced the same dropoff in defensive play that the Flyers experienced in the season after he was gone.

You can cover for greatness in the short term. You can't fake it forever.
- AllInForFlyers

I'm not trying to downplay Pronger. He was a big part of this team moving forward, prior to the injury business.

He does have nights where he plays very well, but those are VASTLY out numbered by bad nights.

He is a decent defensive forward... nothing special at all.

Now, I also think some of his deficiencies could be attributed to his coach.
- jak521

That would be a priority for me if I was the coach. If Giroux could harness and use his full defensive potential on a nightly basis, he could definitely compete for a selke (not joking ). If they could just improve his consistency on defense he would be their best forward on defense, too.

# of teams in the mkt for a starting goalie is dwindling. it's musical chairs for goalies...
- isaiah520

It removes a viable option for them to pursue, but it also means less bidders for a trade or other free agent.

I'm not trying to downplay Pronger. He was a big part of this team moving forward, prior to the injury business.
- BulliesPhan87

I always thought he was a wise guy.

Pittsburgh Penguins ‏@penguins 1m

NEWS ALERT: The #Pens have acquired forward Harry Zolnierczyk from the Anaheim Ducks in exchange for Alex Grant
- Jsaquella

Someone help me pick up the pieces of the Earth because it just shattered.

That would be a priority for me if I was the coach. If Giroux could harness and use his full defensive potential on a nightly basis, he could definitely compete for a selke (not joking :lol. If they could just improve his consistency on defense he would be their best forward on defense, too.
- JAKEw1234

I think that is a bit of a jump... I dont know if he will ever be even worthy of Selke talk.. I havent seen anything that would suggest that. I do think he could be much better, but also nothing to suggest he would be the best on the team.

Do you watch him play defense on a good defensive night for him? When he wants to be he is a monster on defense.
- JAKEw1234

He's no Manny Malhotra, but for a top-10 offensive forward in the league, he's well above average. His two-way game is still a work in progress, but I wouldn't discount his persistent desire to always get better, as we've seen with his consistent improvement at the dot.

Crosby, Datsyuk, Toews... none of them entered the league as completely polished defensive players. G's only entering his 5th year in the league... I don't really see any reason why he can't improve to the point where his defensive game is a real asset.

Someone help me pick up the pieces of the Earth because it just shattered.
- NickTheKid87

leave it to the hippy to destroy earth