Serious question... who do you think will be the better player?

Morin or Haag?
- jak521

I think Haag will. He dropped because he had a bad second half. Morin skyrocketed in the ranks this season. I think Haag will be a better all-around player that plays in the top-4 (maybe top-2), and that Morin will be a bigger, meaner defensive defenseman on the 2nd pairing. But hell, I've never seen either skate against NHL or AHL competition, so I'm not sure.

MDZ would be a good place to start. But really, it would have to be an overpayment to move him to NYR. Maybe MDZ, Hagelin, and JT Miller. Heck, short of one of Callahan/Lundqvist/McDonaugh coming back, I don't know if there is a package big enough.
- jmatchett383

the package with DZ you say i think is to much and a trade could always happen with holmgren as your gm

Growing up in Southern Alberta (and being old) my older brother and I used to have to be separated by our mother over fights over the Oil and Flames. I envy a fan of any team on the East coast, who has had passionate rivals, for so many decades. At first, your (package, for simmonds) proposal, looked like a pun.
- ruttager17

THis

Here's a question for CBA experts.

It is my understanding that the under-20 AHL rule is strictly between the CHL and AHL, not the AHL and NHL. So, would it be possible for an 18-year-old or 19-year-old to come to the NHL, play past his tryout (11 games, right?) and THEN be sent down to the AHL, since he's no longer a CHL player?

would be ok with that
- webleedblue

the flyers and rangers would never make a trade other than minor league players

Giroux for Lundqvist and either McDonaugh or Callahan would be hard to say no to.
- jmatchett383

If you're sure you have $9mill a year long term to commit to Lundqvist.

the package with DZ you say i think is to much and a trade could always happen with holmgren as your gm
- webleedblue

I think it's too much as well, but we're talking many smaller qualities for one larger quality. They say the team that gets the best player wins, and Simmonds is the best player in the deal. So, to get him from a division rival, it would be a stupid overpayment to get him. Even though it is an overpayment, I still don't think I'd do it.

would be ok with that
- webleedblue

Now like someone said earlier, him going to the Rag (in division) makes that + a BIG +.

Id really think about Del Zotto and JT Miller.. love that kid, and he is in the mold of a Flyer.

If you're sure you have $9mill a year long term to commit to Lundqvist.
- bodiva88

If you have Lundqvist, you create the $$ you need.

Here's a question for CBA experts.

It is my understanding that the under-20 AHL rule is strictly between the CHL and AHL, not the AHL and NHL. So, would it be possible for an 18-year-old or 19-year-old to come to the NHL, play past his tryout (11 games, right?) and THEN be sent down to the AHL, since he's no longer a CHL player?
- jmatchett383

Still attempting to play CHL eligible years in the AHL. The rule is in place so that the CHL can retain its younger talent. And the tryout is 9 games I believe, the 10th game it will count as a year towards the ELC.

Now like someone said earlier, him going to the Rag (in division) makes that + a BIG +.

Id really think about Del Zotto and JT Miller.. love that kid, and he is in the mold of a Flyer.
- jak521

Especially if Simmonds is going the other way, bringing in a bigger body would be nice. Even though Simmonds is average size at best, he plays 3 inches taller and 20 lbs heavier.

Still attempting to play CHL eligible years in the AHL. The rule is in place so that the CHL can retain its younger talent. And the tryout is 9 games I believe, the 10th game it will count as a year towards the ELC.
- GirouxForTheShow

And why would you want an underager playing in the AHL anyway?

You can't teach size.

Morin.
- johndewar

I agree, but Haag (6'2 210) isnt a small guy by any means.

EDIT: Scouting Report from Eliteprospects.com, who I consider to be among the best for European prospect.

A very all-round two-way defenseman. Hägg is capable of playing a pure defensive role, logging big minutes on the penalty kill, as well as contributing offensively and being valuable in power play situations. Furthermore, Hägg has good size and strength, very good vision, a heavy release and is also a mobile defenseman. Some consistency issues, although Hägg usually makes smarter plays while playing in the big league, rather than in the juniors. Lots of potential

And why would you want an underager playing in the AHL anyway?
- bodiva88

The Laughton argument (SHOULD be playing in the AHL, but can't) would be a way to get around it. Same for any player who looks AHL-ready but is too young.

Depends. Many of us debated Simmonds for Edler during the latter stages of the playoffs when VanCity was looking to retool. So obviously a top defenseman would be the target. From NYR? Again, depending on other offers, it would take a lot more to pry a gritty power forward with above average hands from a division rival like the Flyers would be to the Rangers. He hits, he wins board battles, he scores goals and he's one of our more consistent forwards.

I have a huge hockey crush on Callahan though. So Simmonds for Callahan straight up.
- GirouxForTheShow

If they want Simmonds, first I'd ask for McDonaugh, followed by DelZotto.

And why would you want an underager playing in the AHL anyway?
- bodiva88

So say Morin progresses a ton this year, and he dominates Jrs. Next year (2014-2015 season) he makes a great showing at camp, but he just isn't ready for the big leagues, but you don't want to send him down to Jrs just to dominate against the same competition. So maybe you try to get into the AHL, where it'll be him against grown men, and the speed/lifestyle of the game can be eased into.

Just spitballing.


Happy birthday to Samuel Morin, btw. Wanted to check his birth date, and he turns 18 today

Yeah, next couple of seasons in Rimouski will be telling about Morin's offensive upside... if he stagnates/regresses, we might have to start worrying about whether he has the baseline aptitude to play in the NHL.
- Tomahawk

"Start worrying?" That began right after his name was uttered at the podium.

Weber was also only 190 lbs. when drafted. Really filled out, which helped him become the player he is today.
- bradleyc4

he wasn't that big then, but he ballooned up nicely. i'd say pound for pound, he's our finest canadian defenceman.

Thanks for the article, Bill.

Unfair expectations or no, clearly we're all hoping Morin develops into a true #1 and a lot of people believe he has the potential to do just that. Personally, so long as he develops into a solid and reliable top 4 shutdown d-man, I'm good with that because it would be nice to start to have some success with our defensive drafts.

Here's a question for CBA experts.

It is my understanding that the under-20 AHL rule is strictly between the CHL and AHL, not the AHL and NHL. So, would it be possible for an 18-year-old or 19-year-old to come to the NHL, play past his tryout (11 games, right?) and THEN be sent down to the AHL, since he's no longer a CHL player?
- jmatchett383

Nope, has to be returned to his Junior League.

I agree, but Haag (6'2 210) isnt a small guy by any means.

EDIT: Scouting Report from Eliteprospects.com, who I consider to be among the best for European prospect.

A very all-round two-way defenseman. Hägg is capable of playing a pure defensive role, logging big minutes on the penalty kill, as well as contributing offensively and being valuable in power play situations. Furthermore, Hägg has good size and strength, very good vision, a heavy release and is also a mobile defenseman. Some consistency issues, although Hägg usually makes smarter plays while playing in the big league, rather than in the juniors. Lots of potential
- jak521

No doubt.

We're lucky to have Hagg.

I think Hagg might be a bit more successful at the next level sooner than Morin, but I think if Morin develops the way scouts think he could, he could definitely surpass Hagg.

Serious question... who do you think will be the better player?

Morin or Haag?
- jak521

I haven't seen much of either but judging by what I read Hagg seems to be the more skilled player that brings a defensive element so I think Hagg will be. But have to see them play.

Nope, has to be returned to his Junior League.
- MJL

So, say you have an 18-year-old that makes an NHL team, and the following year, for whatever reason, he doesn't make the team. All you can do is make him a healthy scratch, correct? Or can he be returned to juniors after a full NHL season?

Comparing Morin to Pronger is unfair, and puts a lot of undo pressure on the kid. Let him be himself. I hope he's given ample time to develop, and not rushed to the NHL where he will be devoured if he's not ready by uneducated fans, and media alike.

If you look at things realistically, it's more likely (and by a significant margin) that Morin is Chris Therien, then he is Chris Pronger. Something in between would be just fine.
- PLindbergh31

there will be fans who kill him if he isnt in the NHL by the age of 20 (see JVR).

I haven't seen much of either but judging by what I read Hagg seems to be the more skilled player that brings a defensive element so I think Hagg will be. But have to see them play.
- JoeRussomanno

Agreed. Just to further that, I think Morin had a higher ceiling (possible Pronger-esque) than Hagg (Timonen-esque), but I think Hagg is more likely to come closer to reaching his ceiling than Morin.

And, lastly, Hagg is from Scandinavia, so he's more likely to carry a battleaxe onto the ice and behead people than Morin is.