You know I love the flyers but I will be the first to tell you their management team seem dumber that dog poop. Hot Lava's on ice system must change or we will never be a contender. Take Bobrovsky for example, he would never have got a Vezina in Philly, as our system is not goalie friendly,lol
- flyerdude17

Ya, cause Lavi's system sure didn't work for us when we made it to the 2nd round 2 years ago Just cause it's not goalie friendly doesn't necessarily make it a bad system. I do hope he keeps the system that let us win 11 of our last 15 games, but he's not a bad coach at all. And Homer is actually a genius GM, imo.

The Flyers have drafted small players with high offensive upside in the third round of the last two drafts - Shayne Gostisbehere and Nick Cousins.

There's no need to do that every year.

The Flyers have drafted small players with high offensive upside in the third round of the last two drafts - Shayne Gostisbehere and Nick Cousins.

There's no need to do that every year.
- Coburns_Nose

better that than three mathers imo

pretty sure other flyers scouts were watching him as well
- Don'tForgetTocchet

I am sure they were but the Flyers drafting is a lot like watching the Calgary Flames at the draft table. Both of these teams continually pass on high ranked players to take guys way down the list. Let's face it the flyers drafting has not been great and the one great one (Giroux) Bobby Clarke could not remember his name when he went to announce the selection, hillarious but thank god somebody jogged his memory, lol.

Ya, cause Lavi's system sure didn't work for us when we made it to the 2nd round 2 years ago Just cause it's not goalie friendly doesn't necessarily make it a bad system. I do hope he keeps the system that let us win 11 of our last 15 games, but he's not a bad coach at all. And Homer is actually a genius GM, imo.
- JAKEw1234

I was actually thinking lavi's system has already won a cup in Carolina.

I am sure they were but the Flyers drafting is a lot like watching the Calgary Flames at the draft table. Both of these teams continually pass on high ranked players to take guys way down the list. Let's face it the flyers drafting has not been great and the one great one (Giroux) Bobby Clarke could not remember his name when he went to announce the selection, hillarious but thank god somebody jogged his memory, lol.
- flyerdude17

i guess
i for one am thrilled with the top two, and how can i not like a guy named ghoul

we'll see in a few years

Ya, cause Lavi's system sure didn't work for us when we made it to the 2nd round 2 years ago Just cause it's not goalie friendly doesn't necessarily make it a bad system. I do hope he keeps the system that let us win 11 of our last 15 games, but he's not a bad coach at all. And Homer is actually a genius GM, imo.
- JAKEw1234

My response to this is that I believe Lava is a great coach short term but he is not as effective after a couple years for some reason. Homer, despite the negative I have said I still love the guy. He knows what he wants, right or wrong, and he makes it happen. I think they overpay at times but if you don't gamble once in awhile you are not doing your job. High risk, high reward. I think with the addtion of Streit and the continued growth of Luke Schenn and others we may be all right this year. I would like to retain Coburn but if anyone has to go I hope it is Messy.

I was actually thinking lavi's system has already won a cup in Carolina.
- moylander

No disrespect for Lava, I am just saying that for some reason he could not stop his team from taking selfish penalties and keep being rewarded with ice time, ie Briere, Hartnell come to mind a couple years ago. Goalies get hung out to dry and save percentage is not a true reflection of their play. Our goalies have always had to stand on their heads at times. Let us hope Lava, Homer and our players all have learned from previous mistakes and become better at what they do in 2013-14.

No disrespect for Lava, I am just saying that for some reason he could not stop his team from taking selfish penalties and keep being rewarded with ice time, ie Briere, Hartnell come to mind a couple years ago. Goalies get hung out to dry and save percentage is not a true reflection of their play. Our goalies have always had to stand on their heads at times. Let us hope Lava, Homer and our players all have learned from previous mistakes and become better at what they do in 2013-14.
- flyerdude17

If he can just sustain the team defense we were playing with at the end of last season we'll do great. He does punish bad penalties, though. Off the top of my head I can refer to Hartnell taking a very dumb roughing penalty last season and being demoted to the 4th line for the rest of the game.

That cheeses me off! If they were so high on him Pronger should have been sent to watch this kid in action and to have some sort of dialogue with him. I can watch you tube videos too but that is not good enough. Sounds like the Flyers could have done more to be certain of this pick. Geesh.
- flyerdude17

would pronger have even gotten on a plane? concussion issues and all. not saying he wouldn't, but do we even know that he would do that?

Takes 2 to tango. You say that assuming Homer didn't try to move down.
- JAKEw1234

I say that seeing Edmonton trade down 4 different times.

I am sure they were but the Flyers drafting is a lot like watching the Calgary Flames at the draft table. Both of these teams continually pass on high ranked players to take guys way down the list. Let's face it the flyers drafting has not been great and the one great one (Giroux) Bobby Clarke could not remember his name when he went to announce the selection, hillarious but thank god somebody jogged his memory, lol.
- flyerdude17

gonna have to disagree. how many first round busts have the flyers picked in recent memory? and it's not like they're picking high every draft. particularly when it comes to forwards, i think the flyers have drafted pretty damn well

He frequented the Draft War Room a lot before the draft, was at the drafting table during the draft, went up on stage with Homer and Ed to make the pick... he was really involved.
- JAKEw1234

Pronger said at the draft that he never saw Morin play live, so not really sure how involved he was in scouting him.

Gotta love Ek. Double Dion to the Devils. There are 28 other teams in the league that can make a better offer than anything the Devils have.

Pronger said at the draft that he never saw Morin play live, so not really sure how involved he was in scouting him.
- Jsaquella

He watched a lot of video on him. I don't know what else Pronger would be doing but giving his advice on Dmen in all that time he spent with the draft team, prior to and during the draft.

Pronger said at the draft that he never saw Morin play live, so not really sure how involved he was in scouting him.
- Jsaquella

Thank you for pointing this out. Not likely he had any input in my opinion. Just having at the draft is no indication he made any decisions on who they were picking.

He watched a lot of video on him. I don't know what else Pronger would be doing but giving his advice on Dmen in all that time he spent with the draft team, prior to and during the draft.
- JAKEw1234

How much time did he spend? He did part time scouting. He wasn't constantly on the road. He helped out and offered opinions on various guys.

Thank you for pointing this out. Not likely he had any input in my opinion. Just having at the draft is no indication he made any decisions on who they were picking.
- flyerdude17

Not that he had zero input, but I think people are really overstating Pronger's influence in who they drafted. I know he did some scouting, and saw several prospects live, because he said he did. I know he looked at film, because he and Holmgren said he did.

Being a star player doesn't make a guy a great coach, GM or scout. Look at Phil Esposito. Awesome player, fair to middling GM

gonna have to disagree. how many first round busts have the flyers picked in recent memory? and it's not like they're picking high every draft. particularly when it comes to forwards, i think the flyers have drafted pretty damn well
- FlyerMike18

Couturier was a no brainer picking at number 8 considering some had him in the top three and he slipped. Giroux was a dandy at 23 I believe but other than that there is not one other player on the team that was drafted by the Flyers in any round in the last 10 years. Gagne was previous and if you want to count Carter, RIchards they obviouly did not work out either because you don't trade players that work out.

better that than three mathers imo
- Don'tForgetTocchet

Yeah I agree. I guess my point is that you need some measure of balance, so not a pile of Golbournes, and not a pile of Gostisbeheres.

How much time did he spend? He did part time scouting. He wasn't constantly on the road. He helped out and offered opinions on various guys.
- Jsaquella

Yup he was still in the war room before the draft and represented the team at the draft, so he was pretty involved. I don't think he necessarily looked at a lot of different players and said this is your guy. I do think they got a lot of advice on their different options from Pronger.

Couturier was a no brainer picking at number 8 considering some had him in the top three and he slipped. Giroux was a dandy at 23 I believe but other than that there is not one other player on the team that was drafted by the Flyers in any round in the last 10 years. Gagne was previous and if you want to count Carter, RIchards they obviouly did not work out either because you don't trade players that work out.
- flyerdude17

They took us to a cup final, and they're really good players, but they aren't meant to be the #1 and #2 players on a team. Remember that NHL.com still voted Richards to be the best 24th pick of all time.

Ya, cause Lavi's system sure didn't work for us when we made it to the 2nd round 2 years ago Just cause it's not goalie friendly doesn't necessarily make it a bad system. I do hope he keeps the system that let us win 11 of our last 15 games, but he's not a bad coach at all. And Homer is actually a genius GM, imo.
- JAKEw1234

The issue with the system, or rather the coach, is that it was not adjusted properly to fit the players on hand.

You can't play Gretzky Era Oilers style when you have the 1995 New Jersey Devils roster.

Laviolette didn't have defensemen that could carry the puck or make long outlet passes, and didn't adjust so the gapping between the forwards and the defense was less, so the defense wasn't forced to make plays they really are not capable of making on a regular basis .

When Laviolette finally simplified the system at the end of the season, the puck support, the gapping, the team defense, the transition game...it all improved a great deal. They Flyers went 11-5 in their last 16 games, beating 9 playoff teams.

That all happened after Laviolette simplified the system.

So it's not "The System" it's the coach's ability and willingness to adapt the system to the players on hand.

Couturier was a no brainer picking at number 8 considering some had him in the top three and he slipped. Giroux was a dandy at 23 I believe but other than that there is not one other player on the team that was drafted by the Flyers in any round in the last 10 years. Gagne was previous and if you want to count Carter, RIchards they obviouly did not work out either because you don't trade players that work out.
- flyerdude17

so richards and carter and justin williams are all examples of bad drafting because they're no longer on the team? that doesn't really make much sense to me

Yup he was still in the war room before the draft and represented the team at the draft, so he was pretty involved. I don't think he necessarily looked at a lot of different players and said this is your guy. I do think they got a lot of advice on their different options from Pronger.
- JAKEw1234

Yes, he was in the war room. So was Peter Luukko. Not sure how involved he was, but he was on the stage, too.