It doesn't matter if you care or not. This is also a business. It's a waste of cap space for the Flyers not to make good on their investment. Meszaros just sitting around isn't an option and is a better player then Erik Gustafsson if healthy.
- dingo8urbaby

So you're cool with stunting Gustafsson's development in favor a player who won't be on the team ina year?

Think about what you just said.
- jmatchett383

I can't believe this is even a debate. Marc-Andre Bourdon is also an option as our 7th defenseman. The smart move is to get Meszaros off the books completely. It's a no brainer.

Meszaros and Read for Weber and Miller.
- jmatchett383

I woulda done Schenn+Couts+Coburn for Weber.

You have to let this go, for your own mental health.
- BiggE

I enjoy it man. Makes this off season more exciting.

So you're cool with stunting Gustafsson's development in favor a player who won't be on the team ina year?
- jmatchett383

If your properly following following what I'm saying, you wouldn't be asking me this question.

IF you end up keeping Meszaros, then you have the below starting roster.

Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Vincent Lecavalier ($4.500m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) / Adam Hall ($0.600m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Mark Streit ($5.250m)
Chris Pronger ($4.941m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Erik Gustafsson ($1.000m)
GOALTENDERS
Ray Emery ($1.650m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $66,609,356; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $490,644

If they can manage to go a few weeks without call-up then they should have enough cap space available without having to LTIR Pronger.
- youarewrong

Gotta add Wellwood, too.

IF you end up keeping Meszaros, then you have the below starting roster.

Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Vincent Lecavalier ($4.500m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) / Adam Hall ($0.600m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Mark Streit ($5.250m)
Chris Pronger ($4.941m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Erik Gustafsson ($1.000m)
GOALTENDERS
Ray Emery ($1.650m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $66,609,356; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $490,644

If they can manage to go a few weeks without call-up then they should have enough cap space available without having to LTIR Pronger.
- youarewrong

My bad, I was counting Laughton as making the team.

IF you end up keeping Meszaros, then you have the below starting roster.

Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Vincent Lecavalier ($4.500m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) / Adam Hall ($0.600m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Mark Streit ($5.250m)
Chris Pronger ($4.941m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Erik Gustafsson ($1.000m)
GOALTENDERS
Ray Emery ($1.650m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $66,609,356; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $490,644

If they can manage to go a few weeks without call-up then they should have enough cap space available without having to LTIR Pronger.
- youarewrong

Don't they also have to eat Wellwood's 612k?

If your properly following following what I'm saying, you wouldn't be asking me this question.
- dingo8urbaby

I'm just wondering how making your best young NHL-ready defenseman a healthy scratch is a good idea.

So you're cool with stunting Gustafsson's development in favor a player who won't be on the team ina year?
- jmatchett383

I'm in favor of putting the best available players on the ice. If Meszaros wins the roster battle, I will play him.

I woulda done Schenn+Couts+Coburn for Weber.
- Flyersgod

Dude only has 32 points in 174 games. No thanks!

I'm in favor of putting the best available players on the ice. If Meszaros wins the roster battle, I will play him.
- youarewrong

I am 100% against that. Not gonna turn me on this one.
This idea helps the team (possibly) this year, but takes a season's worth of development away from Gustafsson.

That would only net them about $500k of room under the cap... one injury and they'd be eating into LTIR anyway.

I'd almost rather keep Mez, send the kids down, and then hope the trade market for dmen expands once other teams either realize that their kids aren't ready and/or some significant injury compels a team to revisit trading for Mez. By then, the last outstanding UFA options will be off the market as well. Start the season in LTIR, then go off it after the trade. Same result, but you don't carry dead cap space.
- Tomahawk

That's not accurate. If they would make a retained salary trade, retaining about 1.5M with Meszaros. Along with some other moves that are inevitable. That would put them somewhere between 1.5M and 2M under the Cap. Which could be increased even further simply by choosing to keep a player like McGinn on the roster, and sending Laughton back to Juniors.

Dude only has 32 points in 174 games. No thanks!
- jmatchett383

Eh.. trollololol

While injuries can't be predicted, it is a fact that Gagne has not made it through an 82 game season without significant injuries in a long time. I think it's safe to say that chances are relatively slim, that at age 33-34, he will all of sudden stop breaking down.
- BiggE

Teemu Selanne also had injury issues in the middle of his career which threatened whether or not this guy was gonna be Hall of Fame worthy. After a lockout of rest and disappointing stints with the Sharks and Aves, he revive his career by signing with the Ducks and won a Cup. Saku Koivu the same thing but without the Cup. He couldn't stay healthy to save his life but now he can. Injuries are a possibility to overcome.

I feel people posting "Let the kids play" is the new fab of the summer. The ultimate goal is to win a Stanley Cup every season. A 33 year old Simon Gagne with a history of injuries is better then anything we have coming up. He makes us better. Injuries cannot be predicted. To say Gagne is unlikely to be healthy by April, there is no way of knowing this. If we sign Gagne he gets into the way of McGinn but if we keep Meszaros, he gets in the way of Gustafsson playing who's even more deserving of a roster spot. It's simple. Trust me, we need Gagne back.
- dingo8urbaby

I think this is about emotion more then needing Gagne back. They really don't need him back. It would be nice to have him back. He does make the team better. But trust me, Gagne is not the difference between this team winning the Cup, or not winning it. Part of becoming a Cup team is letting some of the kids play and develop.

I'm just wondering how making your best young NHL-ready defenseman a healthy scratch is a good idea.
- jmatchett383

Again you've totally missed the point. You've ran so far in the wrong direction you're clearly lost.

Teemu Selanne also had injury issues in the middle of his career which threatened whether or not this guy was gonna be Hall of Fame worthy. After a lockout of rest and disappointing stints with the Sharks and Aves, he revive his career by signing with the Ducks and won a Cup. Saku Koivu the same thing but without the Cup. He couldn't stay healthy to save his life but now he can. Injuries are a possibility to overcome.
- dingo8urbaby

And I'm cool with having Mez around in case injuries occur. But I'm not in favor of him playing over Gustafsson.

That is 100% untrue. Gustafsson (barring injury/craziness) is a top-6, Meszaros would be the #7.
- jmatchett383

That's unknown also. If Meszaros stays, and he outplays Gustafsson in Camp and Pre Season. Maybe it's the other way around.

Again you've totally missed the point. You've ran so far in the wrong direction you're clearly lost.
- dingo8urbaby

Please inform me of the point then. That because Meszaros makes more, he plays? Really, inform me please.

I think that's the window that's only available to teams w/ arbitration cases... I could be wrong.
- Tomahawk

I'm not 100% sure. But I beleive that to be the case. It sounds familiar from reading the CBA.

That's not accurate. If they would make a retained salary trade, retaining about 1.5M with Meszaros. Along with some other moves that are inevitable. That would put them somewhere between 1.5M and 2M under the Cap. Which could be increased even further simply by choosing to keep a player like McGinn on the roster, and sending Laughton back to Juniors.
- MJL

Assuming everybody who's supposed to make the roster out of camp, does:


FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Vincent Lecavalier ($4.500m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m) / Adam Hall ($0.600m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m)
Eric Wellwood ($0.594m)

DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Erik Gustafsson ($1.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Mark Streit ($5.250m)
Chris Pronger ($4.941m) / Bruno Gervais ($0.825m)

GOALTENDERS
Ray Emery ($1.650m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)

OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
RETAINED SALARY TRANSACTIONS (2.364% of upper limit)
Andrej Meszaros ($1.500m—37.5%)


SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $66,675,022; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (24-man roster): $424,978

I think this is about emotion more then needing Gagne back. They really don't need him back. It would be nice to have him back. He does make the team better. But trust me, Gagne is not the difference between this team winning the Cup, or not winning it. Part of becoming a Cup team is letting some of the kids play and develop.
- MJL

I don't trust this statement. I want the best possible product on the ice to make this team better. Gagne vs. McGinn, Gagne is the better player making for a clear cut difference for the team.

I am 100% against that. Not gonna turn me on this one.
This idea helps the team (possibly) this year, but takes a season's worth of development away from Gustafsson.
- jmatchett383

No-body is taking anything away from Gustefsson. There will be injuries this year. Gus will get playing time IF Meszaros wins the job IF he stays. Maybe he doesnt get 82 games, but with injuries he gets 60... That will not slow his development.

Not sure that the margin between Mez and guys like Whitney, Gilbert, Hainsey White and Kuba is really that wide, if there is a margin at all.

And I think teams are aware of Mez's history of performing much better as a 3rd-pairing guy playing sheltered minutes. He tends to get exposed in unfavorable matchups.
- Tomahawk

If Meszaros is healthy, then the gap betweem him and those players is substantial. All but the top defenseman get exposed in unfavorable matchups.