Teemu Selanne also had injury issues in the middle of his career which threatened whether or not this guy was gonna be Hall of Fame worthy. After a lockout of rest and disappointing stints with the Sharks and Aves, he revive his career by signing with the Ducks and won a Cup. Saku Koivu the same thing but without the Cup. He couldn't stay healthy to save his life but now he can. Injuries are a possibility to overcome.
- dingo8urbaby

Very true, I'm just not sure I'd want to risk a contract slot and valuable cap space on him when I think we are already ok at forward.

IF you end up keeping Meszaros, then you have the below starting roster.

Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Vincent Lecavalier ($4.500m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) / Adam Hall ($0.600m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Mark Streit ($5.250m)
Chris Pronger ($4.941m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Erik Gustafsson ($1.000m)
GOALTENDERS
Ray Emery ($1.650m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $66,609,356; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $490,644

If they can manage to go a few weeks without call-up then they should have enough cap space available without having to LTIR Pronger.
- youarewrong

How would going a few weeks without call ups, give them enough cap space available without having to LTIR Pronger. And there's a name that you omitted from that list.

Please inform me of the point then. That because Meszaros makes more, he plays? Really, inform me please.
- jmatchett383

If Meszaros is gonna be on the roster this upcoming season and take up cap space, he's gonna play. The Flyers shouldn't want this. They should want him off the books completely, which gives a chance for Gustafsson an opportunity to play every night. In the process of moving Meszaros, you gain a chance to sign Gagne. This has been a topic for well over a month. I'm shocked you haven't understood what I've been getting at.

Assuming everybody who's supposed to make the roster out of camp, does:

SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $66,675,022; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (24-man roster): $424,978
- Tomahawk

I think Laughton will go back to juniors for this season, which will give you an additional million.

Very true, I'm just not sure I'd want to risk a contract slot and valuable cap space on him when I think we are already ok at forward.
- BiggE

Signing Gagne at 2.5 or less is a low risk, high reward. Moving Meszaros in favour of Gagne is trading a contract slot for another.

Assuming everybody who's supposed to make the roster out of camp, does:


FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Vincent Lecavalier ($4.500m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m) / Adam Hall ($0.600m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m)
Eric Wellwood ($0.594m)

DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Erik Gustafsson ($1.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Mark Streit ($5.250m)
Chris Pronger ($4.941m) / Bruno Gervais ($0.825m)

GOALTENDERS
Ray Emery ($1.650m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)

OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
RETAINED SALARY TRANSACTIONS (2.364% of upper limit)
Andrej Meszaros ($1.500m—37.5%)


SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $66,675,022; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (24-man roster): $424,978
- Tomahawk

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Vincent Lecavalier ($4.500m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Adam Hall ($0.600m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Mark Streit ($5.250m)
Chris Pronger ($4.941m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Marc-Andre Bourdon ($0.613m) / Erik Gustafsson ($1.000m)
GOALTENDERS
Ray Emery ($1.650m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,328,522; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $2,771,478

Minus 1.5M for retained salary for Meszaros

I don't trust this statement. I want the best possible product on the ice to make this team better. Gagne vs. McGinn, Gagne is the better player making for a clear cut difference for the team.
- dingo8urbaby

Gagne isn't that much better to be willing to place the team in a bad Cap situation. And to force having to place Pronger on LTIR. To not bank Cap space. And to risk carry over Cap penalties for next Season.
They meay very well sign Gagne. But there are legitimate reasons not to. And I think those reasons are why they haven't to this point. I think you're overrating Gagne and what he'll bring to the team at this point.

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,328,522; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $2,771,478

Minus 1.5M for retained salary for Meszaros
- MJL

You forgot Wellwood.

Essentially the same roster I posted, but you netted $200k from swapping Bourdon for Gervais.

If Meszaros is gonna be on the roster this upcoming season and take up cap space, he's gonna play. The Flyers shouldn't want this. They should want him off the books completely, which gives a chance for Gustafsson an an opportunity to play every night. In the process of moving Meszaros, you gain a chance to sign Gagne. This has been a topic for well over a month. I'm shocked you haven't understood what I've been getting at.
- dingo8urbaby

I agree. To this point, they have (seemingly) been unable to move Meszaros, which precludes them from signing Gagne. All I've talked about is, if they are unable to move Meszaros, should he be the 6th/7th defenseman. I don't buy the "he takes up more cap space so he should play" because last year, Jody Shelley was on the roster and took up more space than Matt Read, yet Read played over Shelley.

You forgot Wellwood.

Essentially the same roster I posted, but you netted $200k from swapping Bourdon for Gervais.
- Tomahawk

Okay so add Wellwood. Subtract Laughton back to Juniors. And add McGinn. That's a wash. Still gives them significantly more then you stated. Many ways to skin a cat. And to put a roster together.

Gagne isn't that much better to be willing to place the team in a bad Cap situation. And to force having to place Pronger on LTIR. To not bank Cap space. And to risk carry over Cap penalties for next Season.
They meay very well sign Gagne. But there are legitimate reasons not to. And I think those reasons are why they haven't to this point. I think you're overrating Gagne and what he'll bring to the team at this point.
- MJL

I think a lot depends on Laughton. If they believe he's ready to come in and contribute now then they don't need Gagne.

The bankable cap space is a big deal though. It would allow the team to trade for most players at the deadline without worrying about their cap hit.

If Meszaros is gonna be on the roster this upcoming season and take up cap space, he's gonna play. The Flyers shouldn't want this. They should want him off the books completely, which gives a chance for Gustafsson an opportunity to play every night. In the process of moving Meszaros, you gain a chance to sign Gagne. This has been a topic for well over a month. I'm shocked you haven't understood what I've been getting at.
- dingo8urbaby

Nobody disagrees with this, but I think the point we've been discussing ad nauseum is how?

No more CBO's, likelihood of trade without taking/retaining salary is debatable.... that leaves us with, what, waivers?

Please inform me of the point then. That because Meszaros makes more, he plays? Really, inform me please.
- jmatchett383

Sounds like Ruben Amaro's philosophy.

Okay so add Wellwood. Subtract Laughton back to Juniors. And add McGinn. That's a wash. Still gives them significantly more then you stated. Many ways to skin a cat. And to put a roster together.
- MJL

But then you'd find yourself having to make roster decisions based on having retained 40% of Mez's cap hit.... hardly an ideal scenario, right? If Laughton and Gervais outplay McGinn and Bourdon, where does that leave you? Likely eating in LTIR, that's where.

Nobody disagrees with this, but I think the point we've been discussing ad nauseum is how?

No more CBO's, likelihood of trade without taking/retaining salary is debatable.... that leaves us with, what, waivers?
- Tomahawk

Waivers wouldn't be a bad idea to try. Not likely to work, but worth a shot.

Gagne isn't that much better to be willing to place the team in a bad Cap situation. And to force having to place Pronger on LTIR. To not bank Cap space. And to risk carry over Cap penalties for next Season.
They meay very well sign Gagne. But there are legitimate reasons not to. And I think those reasons are why they haven't to this point. I think you're overrating Gagne and what he'll bring to the team at this point.
- MJL

You can think whatever you want. I'm not asking for Gagne to play on the top line with Giroux or be the focus on the Power Play. I expect Gagne to play the third line and fill in on special teams in case of slump or injury, the same as I expect to have Talbot on the 4th line and slide into the third line due to possible injuries to the top nine. It's a fact that Gagne is better then anything we have in our system. Bill pretty much wrote about it in his blog a matter of days ago.

Gagne isn't that much better to be willing to place the team in a bad Cap situation. And to force having to place Pronger on LTIR. To not bank Cap space. And to risk carry over Cap penalties for next Season.
They meay very well sign Gagne. But there are legitimate reasons not to. And I think those reasons are why they haven't to this point. I think you're overrating Gagne and what he'll bring to the team at this point.
- MJL

This isn't 2004 and Simon Gagne isn't the same player as he used to be.

I like Gagne and would love to see him on the team. But he's not a top 6 forward anymore and to continue to debate his usefulness is pointless. He's eminently replaceable at this point of his career.

Waivers wouldn't be a bad idea to try. Not likely to work, but worth a shot.
- MJL

Wouldn't we be on the hook for $2M though, if he gets picked up?

I agree. To this point, they have (seemingly) been unable to move Meszaros, which precludes them from signing Gagne. All I've talked about is, if they are unable to move Meszaros, should he be the 6th/7th defenseman. I don't buy the "he takes up more cap space so he should play" because last year, Jody Shelley was on the roster and took up more space than Matt Read, yet Read played over Shelley.
- jmatchett383

Thats because Read was the better player. If Shelly was the better player, then they would be playing him.

Really you both are wrong. You dont sit Meszaros because your afraid of stunting the growth of Gustefsson. You also dont play Meszaros because of the money he makes. You give both guys a shot at the roster spot in camp, and whoever wins it wins it.

But then you'd find yourself having to make roster decisions based on having retained 40% of Mez's cap hit.... hardly an ideal scenario, right? If Laughton and Gervais outplay McGinn and Bourdon, where does that leave you? Eating in LTIR, that's where.
- Tomahawk

Gervaise makes a few hundred grand difference. They can make that change there. They can send McGinn down and just go with 12 forwards for a while. There's a whole host of maneuvers that they can make. The Flyers are a Cap team, and always will be. Choices have to be made. And it's not always going to be ideal. That's the reality in a Cap environment. Like I said, lots of ways to skin a cat.

This isn't 2004 and Simon Gagne isn't the same player as he used to be.

I like Gagne and would love to see him on the team. But he's not a top 6 forward anymore and to continue to debate his usefulness is pointless. He's eminently replaceable at this point of his career.
- johndewar

Where do these assumptions come from?

Wouldn't we be on the hook for $2M though, if he gets picked up?
- jmatchett383

Why would they be on the hook?

Thats because Read was the better player. If Shelly was the better player, then they would be playing him.

Really you both are wrong. You dont sit Meszaros because your afraid of stunting the growth of Gustefsson. You also dont play Meszaros because of the money he makes. You give both guys a shot at the roster spot in camp, and whoever wins it wins it.
- youarewrong

Fair enough. Would you be in favor of a 47/35 type of split between then two, barring injury?

Really you both are wrong. You dont sit Meszaros because your afraid of stunting the growth of Gustefsson. You also dont play Meszaros because of the money he makes. You give both guys a shot at the roster spot in camp, and whoever wins it wins it.
- youarewrong

youareright (for once)

Why would they be on the hook?
- MJL

I thought a player's cap hit was split between the team putting him on waivers and the team claiming him.