Fair points. Well they have a fresh voice now. The issue with that is there isn't a track record for Berube at the NHL level. So, if the team sputters the rest of the season is it not on the GM then for not putting together the right mix of players?
- PLindbergh31

It might be on the GM. But that doesn't mean he'll be fired.

I think Snider was heavily involved in the Bryzgalov decision. So Holmgren gets a mulligan there. Other than that I think Holmgren has had the green light to do what he has wanted. Not to mention an ownership that allows him to spend to the cap every year.
- PLindbergh31

And other than that move, there aren't tons of bad things he's done. Most organizations go through a lousy year once in a while. This year itself is obviously far from over.

You like to point out how long it's been since they've won a cup. If it's a results based business and all that, then why is Holmgren still here now? If you view Holmgren as the same regime as Clarke, it's been in place for a long time now.

Fair points. Well they have a fresh voice now. The issue with that is there isn't a track record for Berube at the NHL level. So, if the team sputters the rest of the season is it not on the GM then for not putting together the right mix of players?
- PLindbergh31

there is no GM in this league who has played a higher stakes game than homer and it's not even close. and in the end, we are the loser because we are moving backward and the org is shelling out multi millions for plyrs who aren't here any more for one reason or another. we have no answer on d besides making a questionable trade for schenn and overspending for streit when we had carle. the bryz fiasco, ad infinitum...if anyone deserves to get canned after a 2nd non-plyoff season, it's homer- hands down.

At least we're one step closer to fixing the issues at hand. If need be we can start trading guys. Seems to me the 3 people that have been here through out all of this lazy crap play has been Hartnell, Timonen, and Coburn. Just saying.

I agree schenn is capable, but I'm trying to lower the expectations in my mind. If he can score 15-18 goals at 22 and trend upwards in his development, thats a successful season in my eyes. And couts wasn't a 20 goal scorer under lavys system, maybe berube will put him in a better offensive position.
- fecondo

So if Giroux, Hartnell, Simmonds, Voracek, and Read all score 20 goals or better. And Schenn adds 18 and Couturier 12. Along with 8-10 for Talbot. I think that's plenty of offense from the forwards to be a playoff team.

Guys,

Wow, gotta be hard following this team. Always interesting, tough on the health I'm sure.
- walshy66

watching this team over the last 50+ gms is like watching your pet suffer and not being able to put him to sleep- agony.

there is no GM in this league who has played a higher stakes game than homer and it's not even close. and in the end, we are the loser because we are moving backward and the org is shelling out multi millions for plyrs who aren't here any more for one reason or another. we have no answer on d besides making a questionable trade for schenn and overspending for streit when we had carle. the bryz fiasco, ad infinitum...if anyone deserves to get canned after a 2nd non-plyoff season, it's homer- hands down.
- isaiah520

The only thing that could be considered high stakes was the Richards and Carter trades. And everyone, including you, was fine with those deals. Correct me if I'm wrong. I don't see how the Schenn trade was questionable. That's a good Hockey trade that has helped both teams. Just because you don't like it, doesn't make it questionable. In hindsight, I'd rather have Carle then Streit. But I was fine with the reasons of why Carle left, so I'm not going to go back on that now. And they've also built a fine stable of defensive prospects.

there is no GM in this league who has played a higher stakes game than homer and it's not even close. and in the end, we are the loser because we are moving backward and the org is shelling out multi millions for plyrs who aren't here any more for one reason or another. we have no answer on d besides making a questionable trade for schenn and overspending for streit when we had carle. the bryz fiasco, ad infinitum...if anyone deserves to get canned after a 2nd non-plyoff season, it's homer- hands down.
- isaiah520

If they miss the playoffs I believe Holmgren is as good as gone. I don't blame him for the Bryzgalov disaster, I think that was mostly Snider. Holmgren has made some very strong moves, and some moves that haven't worked out.
In a large market you don't get two consecutive years of missing the playoffs.

At least we're one step closer to fixing the issues at hand. If need be we can start trading guys. Seems to me the 3 people that have been here through out all of this lazy crap play has been Hartnell, Timonen, and Coburn. Just saying.
- Flyersgod

really are you saying Kimmo is to blame

And other than that move, there aren't tons of bad things he's done. Most organizations go through a lousy year once in a while. This year itself is obviously far from over.

You like to point out how long it's been since they've won a cup. If it's a results based business and all that, then why is Holmgren still here now? If you view Holmgren as the same regime as Clarke, it's been in place for a long time now.
- eayost

He's still here because he's made some good moves as well. He took over a roster that was in complete shambles, and made it competitive very quickly. That gives him some currency.

That said, two straight years out of the playoffs in this market, and that's about it.

He's still here because he's made some good moves as well. He took over a roster that was in complete shambles, and made it competitive very quickly. That gives him some currency.

That said, two straight years out of the playoffs in this market, and that's about it.
- PLindbergh31

We'll see. I'm not saying your assessment here is wrong... I'm just not sure the owner/GM relationship here is 'normal' compared to how it is other places. Maybe having Hextall here would make it easier for Snider to move on from Holmgren though

with this team there shouldn't be two straight years out of the playoffs and that is why Homer had to make the change now. This wasn't getting better and no need to waste time. But I agree if they don't Homer is out. I like what he has done, he has really tried to address all of the teams issues hasn't always landed the player. Hextall wasn't brought in just to add another pretty face.

Playing better defensively, which means shortening gaps and have all 5 skaters commit to defense will lead to crisper breakouts. Crisp breakouts and smarter decisions with puck when entering the offensive zone will lead to more even strength scoring. Can they use another sniper? Sure, but there is enough firepower on this roster to score goals and be a good team. In my opinion, a greater team commitment to D will lead to more scoring.

Playing better defensively, which means shortening gaps and have all 5 skaters commit to defense will lead to crisper breakouts. Crisp breakouts and smarter decisions with puck when entering the offensive zone will lead to more even strength scoring. Can they use another sniper? Sure, but there is enough firepower on this roster to score goals and be a good team. In my opinion, a greater team commitment to D will lead to more scoring.
- BiggE

What team couldn't use another sniper?

What team couldn't use another sniper?
- MJL

Outside of Maybe Chicago and Pittsburgh no one I can think of.

The only thing that could be considered high stakes was the Richards and Carter trades. And everyone, including you, was fine with those deals. Correct me if I'm wrong. I don't see how the Schenn trade was questionable. That's a good Hockey trade that has helped both teams. Just because you don't like it, doesn't make it questionable. In hindsight, I'd rather have Carle then Streit. But I was fine with the reasons of why Carle left, so I'm not going to go back on that now. And they've also built a fine stable of defensive prospects.
- MJL

we needed at least one of the stable of d men to be an impact plyr 2 yrs ago, not 2 yrs from now- homer fail. if they miss the post season he's out and deservedly so...and take the craps dice w/ him.

we needed at least one of the stable of d men to be an impact plyr 2 yrs ago, not 2 yrs from now- homer fail. if they miss the post season he's out and deservedly so...and take the craps dice w/ him.
- isaiah520

I think that's plain to see. I have no worries he will be gone if they miss it again.

I think Talbot might have a major resurgence, and will be the answer to the 3rd
line question we all have. He seems to me a heady hockey player that may have not been giving the effort, knowing it was leading to nowhere.

Should a coach be able to craft a system to suit the players he's given or should a GM give a coach players that fit into the system they are most comfortable teaching/employing?

So if Giroux, Hartnell, Simmonds, Voracek, and Read all score 20 goals or better. And Schenn adds 18 and Couturier 12. Along with 8-10 for Talbot. I think that's plenty of offense from the forwards to be a playoff team.
- MJL

I agree.

And good point about the snipers before.

really are you saying Kimmo is to blame
- LJF

No. Just saying he's been here through out it all. 3 different coaches? 2? Something like that.

Just pointing it out. I love Timonen. Just bought myself a autographed 16x20 for my man cave.

Should a coach be able to craft a system to suit the players he's given or should a GM give a coach players that they are most comfortable teaching/employing?
- eayost

In this case both failed.

we needed at least one of the stable of d men to be an impact plyr 2 yrs ago, not 2 yrs from now- homer fail. if they miss the post season he's out and deservedly so...and take the craps dice w/ him.
- isaiah520

You didn't really answer any of the questions. And you also fail to include the career ending injury that took away an impact defenseman, and gave more urgency to needing to add an impact defenseman. Which certainly can't be blamed on Holmgren. And I don't think you've made a solid case for the high stakes. Like I said previously, the only real gambles were the Carter and Richards trade. Which if I remember correctly, you were in favor of.

Should a coach be able to craft a system to suit the players he's given or should a GM give a coach players that they are most comfortable teaching/employing?
- eayost

I think a bit of both. No GM can get every player that will fit a coaches system. If a coach doesn't have the players to effectively execute his system, he must try to adapt and play the hand he's been given.

Should a coach be able to craft a system to suit the players he's given or should a GM give a coach players that fit into the system they are most comfortable teaching/employing?
- eayost

Both.

I think a bit of both. No GM can get every player that will fit a coaches system. If a coach doesn't have the players to effectively execute his system, he must try to adapt and play the hand he's been given.
- PLindbergh31