My thoughts from the other thread.

It seems that goaltending has become a non-issue with the acquisitions of Mason and Emery. (Although they both have let in some "shoulda-hads" - nobody is perfect, right?)

It seems that Berube has gotten the offense guys to pay attention to their defensive responsibilities.

What I think I see though, is that the offense has to pay too much attention to defense because the defense, while okay, is still the weak link on this team. I think they do need to make a deal or two to strengthen the defensive corps a bit so they can loosen the reigns a little on the offense to allow them to use their skill and creativity a little more.

But what do I know? :shrug:
- Scoob

Too many slugs on the blue line fo' sho

The defensive side of the defense hasnt been the problem. Moving the puck effectively as Bill said is. I think the defense needs a major overhaul, starting with a Vet puck moving top pairing guy to replace Timonen, followed by a puck moving FA in the offseason and the development of the assetts in the system.

I think if you right the ship on defensive outlets, the offense will right itself own its own. As someone pointed out, this is the team that was top 2 in the league in scoring... Very few difference in the team.... Jagr, Briere(who wasnt great), and JVR(who was mainly injured).

So what is the difference? Matt Carle, and Younger Timonen.
- youarewrong

If they can replace Timmo and Mez with the right two guys, it will go a long ways.

Getting two quality defenseman won't be easy.
Homer has his work cut out for him.

Zetterberg out two weeks with herniated disc per Ek.

Even though it helps the Flyers, I'd almost rather he was playing.
I love to watch him play.

Speaking of elephants in the room...
Peter Lukko's departure to me reeks of the front office needing a facelift... Not I'm embarking on entrepreneurial escapades... I think it was panache that said or wrote "whatever Lukko touches turns to gold..." We'll I beg to differ cause this team is a pile of scrap copper right now... Can be salvaged but leaves much to be desired.

2 things to be thankful for are the goaltending and the 2014 draft

The elephant in the room is that the team is one of the slowest in the NHL.
They also don't have the skill to compete with better teams unless they play near flawless, mistake free hockey at maximum effort.

Sure they can play better.

But they need to play nearly perfect hockey for a full 60 minutes, and play at 100% of their abilities to compete with good teams.

How many teams can do that night in, night out?
About 1/30 or 0/30 more likely.

At 75% effort, and with their stellar goaltending, they can beat some of the weaker teams.

But the reality is, this team as assembled needs to be playing at the maximum effort, without dumb plays, and fully up on their skates for the entire game.

Otherwise they look slow and outclassed by a good team.

They have some nice pieces and some guys that could be better, but overall as a team they are lacking too much.
- Marc D

This is what I see when they play good teams, or younger/quicker teams.

It's too simplistic to say they can't win, but it's also simplistic to say that "playing harder" will solve what we saw last night.

Minnesota was simply faster overall, and they adhered to their system. We've seen it before, against the Islanders, against Pittsburgh the first time, against Montreal and Tampa.

Fast teams that adhere to their systems give us lots of trouble.

Hey guys, quick question..

I just canceled my Verizon fios service because I did not like it. does anybody here have Dish? if so, do you get all flyers games?

any reccomendatinos on what to try? all i care about is hbo, golf, and flyers games (most important)
- ehrlse

Ive cancelled my cable Tv altogether and just maintain internet. I have yet to miss a Flyers game because I have been able to find every game for free on the web...(well minus the cost of the internet itself)

This is what I see when they play good teams, or younger/quicker teams.

It's too simplistic to say they can't win, but it's also simplistic to say that "playing harder" will solve what we saw last night.

Minnesota was simply faster overall, and they adhered to their system. We've seen it before, against the Islanders, against Pittsburgh the first time, against Montreal and Tampa.

Fast teams that adhere to their systems give us lots of trouble.
- AllInForFlyers

With Konopka, Matt Cooke, and Rupp they should be more "hate-able". But it is hard to get fired up about those guys. Good team, no doubt. Terrific 1st pair with Suter and Brodin. Terrific goalie. But between them and the Flyers, it was a snooze fest.

Bertuzzi out.

the game was painful to watch. all of your points on why the flyers offense basically sucks are spot on, and the breakout is the biggest culprit of them all. they're amazingly bad coming out of their own end.

when they play a hard checking, puck pressure team they don't score. they have no answer. simple as that.

i feel bad for the goalies. emery was excellent last night. on the first goal, i'd like to know why coots was the guy in the crease trying to cover the wild forward, while timmonen was in the high slot, in no man's land doing virtually nothing.

this team needs an injection of some skill and a little bit of heart.
- hammarby31

Grossmann pretty much did nothing on the second goal as well fat rebound or not

Wow, pretty moribund tone in here today. You'd think the team was still mired in their earlier slump. One bad game and people are super down on the team and clamoring for trades/moves etc. Vinny was out and that didn't help matters offensively...aside from those two quick goals the Flyers hung in there but couldn't beat one of the best goalies in the league.

I don't think the Flyers D is incapable of moving the puck...I've seen time and time again players like Grossmann, Timonen, Coburn, Schenn, Streit make good basic plays to move the puck up the ice. I think more at issue is what the forwards do with it (or don't do with it) once they get it. Can the D be better? Sure. Could we use a (young) skilled, puck carrying, producer out there? Sure, who wouldn't. But I don't think the current guys are the slow, plodding group that can't move the puck out that some think they are. Most of the time I feel they do an adequate job. Again, I think the forwards need to make sure they support the D in the zone and help carry the mail when needed...and they need to do a better job at setting up and making plays to enter the offensive zone with an effective plan of attack.

I am still in the mode of thinking this team is not a contender, but the window will open wider in the next few years as guys like Ghost, Laughton, Morin, Alt, Hagg etc. start coming up and making an impact and the likes of B Schenn and Couturier are coming into their own. For now I am content to see the team seems to have found a quality young goalie in Mason (sign that dude!) and has some good young players starting to spread their wings (Coots, Schenn).

I'm ok with some losses here and there, but overall I want to see progress, and in some areas, I think it's there to be seen, while other areas still need a lot of work...it will be interesting to see what Holmgren does with Timo and Mez's cash/roster spots next season...there's an opportunity there, to upgrade the position.

Grossmann pretty much did nothing on the second goal as well fat rebound or not
- nastyflyergirl

He got caught in no-man's land. He drifted over to his partner's side to try and block the initial shot -- a gamble that had better pay off -- and gave himself no chance to get to the goal scorer when the shot got through and rebounded into the slot he should have been covering in the first place.

Gutless and heartless team right now...with the chance to be tied for the third playoff spot, they played with no passion...the most energy I saw consistantly last night was when Emery got pulled...I still do not understand why this team is together. Like Luuko, some guys just need to go, not becasue they aren't good, but becasue there is no passion for the game...there is no one leading this team to skate hard every shift, horrible forechecking, guys coasting, just a bad team...lots of great individuals, but as a team they just stink...

Wow, pretty moribund tone in here today. You'd think the team was still mired in their earlier slump. One bad game and people are super down on teh team and clamoring for trades/moves etc. Vinny was out and that didn't help matters offensively...aside from those two quick goals the Flyers hung in there but couldn't beat one of the best goalies in the league.

I don't think the Flyers D is incapable of moving the puck...I've seen time and time again players like Grossmann, Timonen, Coburn, Schenn, Streit make good basic plays to move the puck up the ice. I think more at issue is what the forwards do with it (or don't do with it) once they get it. Can the D be better? Sure. Could we use a (young) skilled, puck carrying, producer out there? Sure, who wouldn't. But I don't think the current guys are the slow, plodding group that can't move the puck out that some think they are. Most of the time I feel they do an adequate job. Again, I think the forwards need to make sure they support the D in the zone and help carry the mail when needed...and they need to do a better job at setting up and making plays to enter the offensive zone with an effective plan of attack.

I am still in the mode of thinking this team is not a contender, but the window will open wider in the next few years as guys like Ghost, Laughton, Morin, Alt, Hagg etc. start coming up and making an impact and the likes of B Schenn and Couturier are coming into their own. For now I am content to see the team seems to have found a quality young goalie in Mason (sign that dude!) and has some good young players starting to spreasd their wings (Coots, Schenn).

I'm ok with some losses here and there, but overall I want to see progress, and in some areas, I think it's there to be seen, while other areas still need a lot of work...it will be interesting to see what Holmgren does with Timo and Mez's cash/roster spots next season...there's an opportunity there, to upgrade the position.
- exlund

Good comments, I think the reason we are down on this team is becasue we see what they might be able to do, and then we see games like FLA, TB, and MIN last night where the team just seems uninterested in playing thier game with a solid forecheck...After a solid gut check win in NAS (which we usually turtle and lose) it was mind numbing watching that game last night...once again, not a contender until they really can play 60 minutes of hockey...

The elephant in the room is that the team is one of the slowest in the NHL.
They also don't have the skill to compete with better teams unless they play near flawless, mistake free hockey at maximum effort.

Sure they can play better.

But they need to play nearly perfect hockey for a full 60 minutes, and play at 100% of their abilities to compete with good teams.

How many teams can do that night in, night out?
About 1/30 or 0/30 more likely.

At 75% effort, and with their stellar goaltending, they can beat some of the weaker teams.

But the reality is, this team as assembled needs to be playing at the maximum effort, without dumb plays, and fully up on their skates for the entire game.

Otherwise they look slow and outclassed by a good team.

They have some nice pieces and some guys that could be better, but overall as a team they are lacking too much.
- Marc D

too many muckers and grinders and not enough speed and skill if you ask me

Good comments, I think the reason we are down on this team is becasue we see what they might be able to do, and then we see games like FLA, TB, and MIN last night where the team just seems uninterested in playing thier game with a solid forecheck...After a solid gut check win in NAS (which we usually turtle and lose) it was mind numbing watching that game last night...once again, not a contender until they really can play 60 minutes of hockey...
- JW98FlyerFan

Last night was SPECIFICALLY a game where our speedy players such as Voracek and Giroux needed to take over the game and live up to their apparent pedigrees as top flight players. They did not, as has been the norm for most of this season, they came up woefully small.

He got caught in no-man's land. He drifted over to his partner's side to try and block the initial shot -- a gamble that had better pay off -- and gave himself no chance to get to the goal scorer when the shot got through and rebounded into the slot he should have been covering in the first place.
- bmeltzer

At first I thought he was hurt or something because he just sort of hunched over a little bit and looked all awkward and out of position. it was weird. maybe it was just because he was flatfooted.

Even if they get better break out passes from one or 2 new dmen they still have a forward skill problem. They do not shoot well and they don't have many guys that can carry the puck over the blue line and back off the opposing D. Also, the forwards pass poorly and often try to squeeze pucks between 2 opposing players in ill-timed cross-ice plays. Not to mention they rarely win puck battles when they have the puck in the offensive zone. They are tough to watch right now. At least they have good goalies for once.

Good comments, I think the reason we are down on this team is becasue we see what they might be able to do, and then we see games like FLA, TB, and MIN last night where the team just seems uninterested in playing thier game with a solid forecheck...After a solid gut check win in NAS (which we usually turtle and lose) it was mind numbing watching that game last night...once again, not a contender until they really can play 60 minutes of hockey...
- JW98FlyerFan

honestly I just think with the lack of young speed and skill on the team, they have to work hard every shift every game and they just aren't capable to do it.....or they don't want to or whatever. I just wish they had more speed and skill. even their best forward prospects....McGinn, Laughton, Cousins. more of the same really. At least they have decent dmen prospects with some skill coming along....hopefully anyway.

I still think this team is a 7-8 seed at best. I don't think the addition of one or two puck moving dmen all of a sudden makes them a real cup threat. not when factoring in what it will take to get said player(s). I preach it all the time but they need to draft well and build through the draft and suppliment via free agency.

Homer offering Phaneuf 7 years, $50 million in the offseason gets more likely with every passing day.

Good comments, I think the reason we are down on this team is becasue we see what they might be able to do, and then we see games like FLA, TB, and MIN last night where the team just seems uninterested in playing thier game with a solid forecheck...After a solid gut check win in NAS (which we usually turtle and lose) it was mind numbing watching that game last night...once again, not a contender until they really can play 60 minutes of hockey...
- JW98FlyerFan

This 60 minutes of hockey talk is maddening - I assume this means 60 minutes of effort so here goes my little rant:

Last year was the same (frank)ing rollercoaster ride. One step forward, one step back. I just can't comprehend how these people have the balls to not give it their all for 60 minutes. Nearly all of them are making millions of dollars. They have thousands of fans chanting their names and cheering for this team. They have one chance to get the hockey players holy grail - Lord Stanleys Cup - every season.

Imagine if you were given the same opportunity with the dollars, fame, fans chanting and chief looking over your back. I wouldn't dare to do anything but my best for every single one of those sixty minutes. Fundamentally not being a good player is excusable, but not putting up the (frank)ing effort, is not!

What if I said I'm starting not to like Giroux?

This 60 minutes of hockey talk is maddening - I assume this means 60 minutes of effort so here goes my little rant:

Last year was the same (frank)ing rollercoaster ride. One step forward, one step back. I just can't comprehend how these people have the balls to not give it their all for 60 minutes. Nearly all of them are making millions of dollars. They have thousands of fans chanting their names and cheering for this team. They have one chance to get the hockey players holy grail - Lord Stanleys Cup - every season.

Imagine if you were given the same opportunity with the dollars, fame, fans chanting and chief looking over your back. I wouldn't dare to do anything but my best for every single one of those sixty minutes. Fundamentally not being a good player is excusable, but not putting up the (frank)ing effort, is not!
- Bearintheforest

I bust my butt every shift I play because, well, i love playing! I can't play enough. A few weekends ago I played 3 games in one night!

I think it's fairly obvious this team just isn't talented enough. Overall, the team is slow and lacks puck skills.

What if I said I'm starting not to like Giroux?
- shekkie

It's almost like he's caught NODLitice.