The secondary scoring might be there this year, but I can guarantee you the opposition isn't scared of our 2nd 3rd or 4th lines. Until there's a 2nd line that deserves respect, all opponent resources will be put toward shutting down the Sedins.
- DrChristianTroy

Pretty much.

The secondary scoring might be there this year, but I can guarantee you the opposition isn't scared of our 2nd 3rd or 4th lines. Until there's a 2nd line that deserves respect, all opponent resources will be put toward shutting down the Sedins.
- DrChristianTroy

Primary and secondary scoring is an issue. People who are paid to produce aren't. The top 6 needs a shake up or we will be having this discussion for the next few years.

27 goals combined for both Sedins , Burrows and Booth , that's 3 less than Ovechkin

Primary and secondary scoring is an issue. People who are paid to produce aren't. The top 6 needs a shake up or we will be having this discussion for the next few years.

27 goals combined for both Sedins , Burrows and Booth , that's 3 less than Ovechkin
- VANTEL

Can't compare goal totals across conferences like that. Ovechkin might be filling the net, but his team is doing worse than the team the Sedins are primary scorers for.

Gaudy production doesn't = success. Sometimes your stars just need to waste the icetime of the other team's stars. The Sedins are +9 & +10 playing huge minutes opposite the best players our opposition has to offer. They're doing their job. We need a PP desperately.

Can't compare goal totals across conferences like that. Ovechkin might be filling the net, but his team is doing worse than the team the Sedins are primary scorers for.
- DrChristianTroy

That may be so , but it doesn't change the fact that 4 of the top 5
paid forwards here have t)3 average of less than 7 goals half way through the year. This team is getting old and has trouble putting the puck in the net.

I don't know how you can say they lok like they are skating in quicksand and then say they are doing their job.

The game is changing . Younger faster bigger players are ruling the score sheets these days. We are outdated now.

Primary and secondary scoring is an issue. People who are paid to produce aren't. The top 6 needs a shake up or we will be having this discussion for the next few years.

27 goals combined for both Sedins , Burrows and Booth , that's 3 less than Ovechkin
- VANTEL

He's also a -15 on a team with a +3 differential. I'm not a huge +/- guy, but that's gotta say something about Ovie. Relies on the PP way too much, those numbers usually don't translate into the playoffs when less penalties are called.

Per 60 minutes of 5-on-5 hockey played:
Ovechkin's Line: Caps score just 2.05 goals, allow 3.13 goals
Sedins Line: Canucks score 2.85 goals, allow just 1.85 goals

It's been proven that teams that score a larger percentage of goals at even strength tend to have more playoff success. Boston's PP sucked when they beat us for the cup, but their 5-on-5 scoring was really good.

Can't compare goal totals across conferences like that. Ovechkin might be filling the net, but his team is doing worse than the team the Sedins are primary scorers for.

Gaudy production doesn't = success. Sometimes your stars just need to waste the icetime of the other team's stars. The Sedins are +9 & +10 playing huge minutes opposite the best players our opposition has to offer. They're doing their job. We need a PP desperately.
- DrChristianTroy

Bingo.


But again, having a bad PP is preferred over not scoring enough at even strength IMO.

That may be so , but it doesn't change the fact that 4 of the top 5
paid forwards here have t)3 average of less than 7 goals half way through the year. This team is getting old and has trouble putting the puck in the net
- VANTEL

Not saying I like the direction of this team... I obviously don't... Been b!tching about it nonstop for years (to the point I don't even bother posting anymore 'cuz I'm just a broken record). But the Sedins are what they are. They'll never be fast or energetic looking players out there... and I don't think they're the problem.

Not saying I like the direction of this team... I obviously don't... Been b!tching about it nonstop for years (to the point I don't even bother posting anymore 'cuz I'm just a broken record). But the Sedins are what they are. They'll never be fast or energetic looking players out there... and I don't think they're the problem.
- DrChristianTroy

I didn't say the Sedins were the problem , I said our top 6 is the problem. They are part of the problem. Our top 6 don't have size speed or toughness to get to the tough part of the net.

He's also a -15 on a team with a +3 differential. I'm not a huge +/- guy, but that's gotta say something about Ovie. Relies on the PP way too much, those numbers usually don't translate into the playoffs when less penalties are called.

Per 60 minutes of 5-on-5 hockey played:
Ovechkin's Line: Caps score just 2.05 goals, allow 3.13 goals
Sedins Line: Canucks score 2.85 goals, allow just 1.85 goals

It's been proven that teams that score a larger percentage of goals at even strength tend to have more playoff success. Boston's PP sucked when they beat us for the cup, but their 5-on-5 scoring was really good.
- Nucker101

You have said many times +- has little to do with reality. I look it the other way. I look at Washington and think they have a Sh!t roster and would probably be bottom feeders if it wasn't for OV

Not saying I like the direction of this team... I obviously don't... Been b!tching about it nonstop for years (to the point I don't even bother posting anymore 'cuz I'm just a broken record). But the Sedins are what they are. They'll never be fast or energetic looking players out there... and I don't think they're the problem.
- DrChristianTroy

That's probably why they piss a lot of people off. I don't really give a poop about what they look like, just as long as the bottom line is good eniugh. And in the playoff, their recent career point averages are on par with a lot of other "stars". Everyone's scoring goes down in the playoffs, you're playing stronger teams, usually stronger goalies and with less penalties called, the NHL is the only one of the "big 4" that openly officiates the games differently in the playoffs.

Daniel's goal-scoring has declined though IMO.

Not saying I like the direction of this team... I obviously don't... Been b!tching about it nonstop for years (to the point I don't even bother posting anymore 'cuz I'm just a broken record). But the Sedins are what they are. They'll never be fast or energetic looking players out there... and I don't think they're the problem.
- DrChristianTroy

To be honest, I've never seen the Twins with as much commitment to both ends of the ice like they have shown this season. Their PK minutes have been really impressive. That's what has surprised me the most.

Instead of noting which forwards were on the ice for goals against, how about tracking which defencemen were victimized? Seems all too often that No. 3 is the culprit on some breakdown or blunder that eventually leads to a goal. Like the last minute goal for Philly off the faceoff the other night that cost them a point.

Would really like to see how the goals against Bieksa's on for compare to Edler and Tanev relative to their TOI 5 on 5. Anybody have a link to a stats site that tracks this sort of thing over the full course of the season?

Instead of noting which forwards were on the ice for goals against, how about tracking which defencemen were victimized? Seems all too often that No. 3 is the culprit on some breakdown or blunder that eventually leads to a goal. Like the last minute goal for Philly off the faceoff the other night that cost them a point.

Would really like to see how the goals against Bieksa's on for compare to Edler and Tanev relative to their TOI 5 on 5. Anybody have a link to a stats site that tracks this sort of thing over the full course of the season?
- YeOldTimer

http://www.behindthenet.c...5+21+22+23+24+25+26+27+28

Finally some discussion and I have to go shovel. Lame.

Instead of noting which forwards were on the ice for goals against, how about tracking which defencemen were victimized? Seems all too often that No. 3 is the culprit on some breakdown or blunder that eventually leads to a goal. Like the last minute goal for Philly off the faceoff the other night that cost them a point.

Would really like to see how the goals against Bieksa's on for compare to Edler and Tanev relative to their TOI 5 on 5. Anybody have a link to a stats site that tracks this sort of thing over the full course of the season?
- YeOldTimer

We already know that but we don't mention it here because we don't want to piss of KB3

To be honest, I've never seen the Twins with as much commitment to both ends of the ice like they have shown this season. Their PK minutes have been really impressive. That's what has surprised me the most.
- bloatedmosquito

The Sedins have had their prime and are still very good players ,much like Thorton. Gillis has done little to help ease them into slowing down.

Sharks have surrounded Marleau Thorton with Couture Hertl and little Joe , we got Booth Burrow s ( sorry he is getting old) and Higgins .huge difference and that is why other fans say that imaginary window is closing

We already know that but we don't mention it here because we don't want to piss of KB3
- VANTEL

Goals against per 60 mins of 5-on-5:

Bieksa: 2.50(5th toughest minutes, wtf)
Edler: 2.47(toughest minutes)
Garrison: 2.44(4th toughest minutes, meh)
Stanton: 2.43(6th toughest minutes)
Hamhuis: 2.25(2nd toughest minutes, stud)
Tanev: 2.16(3rd toughest minutes, stud)

Weber, Corrado and Alberts haven't played enough to really count.

The Sedins have had their prime and are still very good players ,much like Thorton. Gillis has done little to whelp ease them into slowing down.

Sharks have surrounded Marleau Thorton with Couture Hertl and little Joe , we got Booth Burrow s ( sorry he is getting old) and Higgins .huge difference and that is why other fans say that imaginary window is closing
- VANTEL

It's not just other fans saying that...

Goals against per 60 mins of 5-on-5:

Bieksa: 2.50(5th toughest minutes, wtf)
Edler: 2.47(toughest minutes)
Garrison: 2.44(4th toughest minutes, meh)
Stanton: 2.43(6th toughest minutes)
Hamhuis: 2.25(2nd toughest minutes, stud)
Tanev: 2.16(3rd toughest minutes, stud)

Weber, Corrado and Alberts haven't played enough to really count.
- Nucker101

NTC

Instead of noting which forwards were on the ice for goals against, how about tracking which defencemen were victimized? Seems all too often that No. 3 is the culprit on some breakdown or blunder that eventually leads to a goal. Like the last minute goal for Philly off the faceoff the other night that cost them a point.

Would really like to see how the goals against Bieksa's on for compare to Edler and Tanev relative to their TOI 5 on 5. Anybody have a link to a stats site that tracks this sort of thing over the full course of the season?
- YeOldTimer

Botchford was saying that he has heard there is a Canucks playing through a lingering injury that will require surgery at some point in time; speculation is that this is Bieksa.

It's not just other fans saying that...
- DrChristianTroy

I for one will be happy to see the new generation of Canucks.

Botchford was saying that he has heard there is a Canucks playing through a lingering injury that will require surgery at some point in time; speculation is that this is Bieksa.
- Chest Rockwell

Truth is Bieksa has made some bad mistakes for years , but his upsides are he is the only Dman that will fight and he does score usually in the top 2/3 Dmen on the team
When it comes to the playoffs he is usually the only one that is noticable

For the love of God guys, please ignore that Prock character, he can't troll here so he's trolling othe threads saying poop about the Nucks now.

Goals against per 60 mins of 5-on-5:

Bieksa: 2.50(5th toughest minutes, wtf)
Edler: 2.47(toughest minutes)
Garrison: 2.44(4th toughest minutes, meh)
Stanton: 2.43(6th toughest minutes)
Hamhuis: 2.25(2nd toughest minutes, stud)
Tanev: 2.16(3rd toughest minutes, stud)

Weber, Corrado and Alberts haven't played enough to really count.
- Nucker101

Thanks for going to the trouble. Good to know the numbers do back up the impression.

Edler makes boneheaded plays that end up in our net as well, but it doesn't seem to be nearly as often. He's more dangerous on the power play (which is clearly missing him now that he's out) and is the only d-man other than Alberts who has the size to deal with larger forwards.

Yes Bieksa can fight and plays with a snarl and all that stuff we miss with all the other D we've got, but the opposing forwards continue to get bigger and I don't know that he really intimidates anyone anymore. His 'toughness' isn't really an intangible that provides any kind of advantage.

Call him a swashbuckler, gunslinger, or whatever, but if you're looking at convincing a d-man to drop his NTC so you can upgrade the team, Bieksa's probably the more expendable commodity.

Thanks for going to the trouble. Good to know the numbers do back up the impression.

Edler makes boneheaded plays that end up in our net as well, but it doesn't seem to be nearly as often. He's more dangerous on the power play (which is clearly missing him now that he's out) and is the only d-man other than Alberts who has the size to deal with larger forwards.

Yes Bieksa can fight and plays with a snarl and all that stuff we miss with all the other D we've got, but the opposing forwards continue to get bigger and I don't know that he really intimidates anyone anymore. His 'toughness' isn't really an intangible that provides any kind of advantage.

Call him a swashbuckler, gunslinger, or whatever, but if you're looking at convincing a d-man to drop his NTC so you can upgrade the team, Bieksa's probably the more expendable commodity.
- YeOldTimer

His kids have grown up here I don't see him uprooting his family.