That's an endless cycle. We like our draft class so we can't trade them until we see how they develop. Then, once they've developed, they are either good and we won't trade them because they are too good or we can't trade them because they didn't pan out and no one wants them. No one in our prospect pool is going to become a superstar. the risk isnt that big to trade some while they still have value instead of waiting for the leblancs, fishers, valentenkos etc to rise to the top
- muffin_man

They weren't waiting, no one wanted those guys.

Montreal has one superstar (PK), a potential one(AG) and an elite goalie. Prospect wise they have 3 pretty good D ones and some very good potential forwards in a few years. The rebuilding wasn't just in Mtl, the previous regime traded away some ood young players for very little return.

Regardless of their record this is a rebuilding team.

They weren't waiting, no one wanted those guys.

Montreal has one superstar (PK), a potential one(AG) and an elite goalie. Prospect wise they have 3 pretty good D ones and some very good potential forwards in a few years. The rebuilding wasn't just in Mtl, the previous regime traded away some ood young players for very little return.

Regardless of their record this is a rebuilding team.
- habby

It's a building team. Rebuilding implies it was built once. This is basically rebuilding what was torn down in the 70s. Right now, we are as we were the last time we won the cup: Great goaltending, some solid players, mostly mediocre.

We are building but we're doing it in a way that takes forever. At this rate, unless Galchenyuk becomes a superstar, we will continue to get second (6th?) tier UFAs, middle of the pack draft picks, and never make a trade because we have to see how everyone pans out (untouchable or Untouchable)

It's a building team. Rebuilding implies it was built once. This is basically rebuilding what was torn down in the 70s. Right now, we are as we were the last time we won the cup: Great goaltending, some solid players, mostly mediocre.

We are building but we're doing it in a way that takes forever. At this rate, unless Galchenyuk becomes a superstar, we will continue to get second (6th?) tier UFAs, middle of the pack draft picks, and never make a trade because we have to see how everyone pans out (untouchable or Untouchable)
- muffin_man

I don't think they have a choice. What trades have they missed out on and what would they have had to give up to get it done?
Bobby Ryan comes to mind and I don't think Mtl could have afforded to offer the same.

I don't think they have a choice. What trades have they missed out on and what would they have had to give up to get it done?
Bobby Ryan comes to mind and I don't think Mtl could have afforded to offer the same.
- habby

Eller, a 1st, and a prospect is doable.

Basically, to me, we have done nothing since Gainey retooled the core of the team all at once. The only significant things I can think of since then was dealing Halak (necessity) and Cammy (necessity) neither of which was (were?) handled correctly in terms of shopping them around and getting max value in return.

I think I'm just sick of the nothing. Even if we came out on the wrong end of bold moves, at least we would have tried. It took balls to deal Johnson and McClement for Stewart and Shattenkirk. It took balls to deal Goligoski for Neal and Niskanen. Yes, both were lopsided as hell but at least they tried something when they felt they had to. I don't even mind that Gainey traded for Gomez because he wanted to reconstruct the team. I mind that it was rushed (not entirely his fault) and he didnt even negotiate.

Kane for Eller+ could blow up in MB's face but at least it would be putting his stamp on the team. Same goes for acquiring Buff or Yakupov or gaborik or whoever. Briere wasn't his stamp, that was the promise of a french player. So far, all he's really done is hire his friends and have fun

edit: geez that was longer than i expected...

edit 2: Drafting McCaron was ballsy and made a statement. Even if he sucks, at least he tried.

Eller, a 1st, and a prospect is doable.

Basically, to me, we have done nothing since Gainey retooled the core of the team all at once. The only significant things I can think of since then was dealing Halak (necessity) and Cammy (necessity) neither of which was (were?) handled correctly in terms of shopping them around and getting max value in return.

I think I'm just sick of the nothing. Even if we came out on the wrong end of bold moves, at least we would have tried. It took balls to deal Johnson and McClement for Stewart and Shattenkirk. It took balls to deal Goligoski for Neal and Niskanen. Yes, both were lopsided as hell but at least they tried something when they felt they had to. I don't even mind that Gainey traded for Gomez because he wanted to reconstruct the team. I mind that it was rushed (not entirely his fault) and he didnt even negotiate.

Kane for Eller+ could blow up in MB's face but at least it would be putting his stamp on the team. Same goes for acquiring Buff or Yakupov or gaborik or whoever. Briere wasn't his stamp, that was the promise of a french player. So far, all he's really done is hire his friends and have fun

edit: geez that was longer than i expected...
- muffin_man

Probably crazier too

I think Bergevin is putting his stamp on the team. He's patiently building a cup contender. 2 or 3 years away, sorry. But for the first time in 20 years there's actually a vision leading towards being a contender again.

Probably crazier too

I think Bergevin is putting his stamp on the team. He's patiently building a cup contender. 2 or 3 years away, sorry. But for the first time in 20 years there's actually a vision leading towards being a contender again.
- habby

Yeah, no one has ever said they were going to build the habs through the draft to become contenders in a few years. How has he put any stamp on the team other than drafting for size last year?

Yeah, no one has ever said they were going to build the habs through the draft to become contenders in a few years. How has he put any stamp on the team other than drafting for size last year?
- muffin_man

He hasn't made a panic trade, like you suggested he should. Just adding Mcdonnaugh would make this team much better. Suddenly Gorges is your #5 D. Mtl seems to have 3 good young player in hamilton right now and that's about it. In a couple of years some forwards.
There's no quick fix.

Yeah, no one has ever said they were going to build the habs through the draft to become contenders in a few years. How has he put any stamp on the team other than drafting for size last year?
- muffin_man

There's been no evidence of building through the draft. Gainey tried trades and free agency. All he did was trade young guys and draft picks. Look at the top teams, which weren't built through the draft?

Eller, a 1st, and a prospect is doable.

Basically, to me, we have done nothing since Gainey retooled the core of the team all at once. The only significant things I can think of since then was dealing Halak (necessity) and Cammy (necessity) neither of which was (were?) handled correctly in terms of shopping them around and getting max value in return.

I think I'm just sick of the nothing. Even if we came out on the wrong end of bold moves, at least we would have tried. It took balls to deal Johnson and McClement for Stewart and Shattenkirk. It took balls to deal Goligoski for Neal and Niskanen. Yes, both were lopsided as hell but at least they tried something when they felt they had to. I don't even mind that Gainey traded for Gomez because he wanted to reconstruct the team. I mind that it was rushed (not entirely his fault) and he didnt even negotiate.

Kane for Eller+ could blow up in MB's face but at least it would be putting his stamp on the team. Same goes for acquiring Buff or Yakupov or gaborik or whoever. Briere wasn't his stamp, that was the promise of a french player. So far, all he's really done is hire his friends and have fun

edit: geez that was longer than i expected...

edit 2: Drafting McCaron was ballsy and made a statement. Even if he sucks, at least he tried.
- muffin_man

I agree, I'm tired of doing nothing. It seems as though we swim to the middle of the lake and then decide to be safe swim back to where we started. Let's swim across and we will see what happens. We are years from being a strong contender, yes we have some young talent but we need some strong impact players now to shorten that time. There are approximately a half a dozen players that I would try keeping, but the balance are all available to put together the right deals.

He hasn't made a panic trade, like you suggested he should. Just adding Mcdonnaugh would make this team much better. Suddenly Gorges is your #5 D. Mtl seems to have 3 good young player in hamilton right now and that's about it. In a couple of years some forwards.
There's no quick fix.
- habby

I was not suggesting a panic trade at all. I was suggesting a trade for a young player with a huge upside that makes us better in the long term like Kane or Skinner.

I was not suggesting a panic trade at all. I was suggesting a trade for a young player with a huge upside that makes us better in the long term like Kane or Skinner.
- muffin_man

I'd love to get him. I think you're giving up Paciorrety/plus to get him. I don't see how that makes them better.

I'd love to get him. I think you're giving up Paciorrety/plus to get him. I don't see how that makes them better.
- habby

Kane for Pacioretty is lateral at worst. Pacioretty has the better contract, Kane will be better long term.

That said, Winnipeg is reportedly seeking a center who can eat first line minutes meaning its not pacioretty but Plek or, more likely, eller+ that they want in return.

Kane for Pacioretty is lateral at worst. Pacioretty has the better contract, Kane will be better long term.

That said, Winnipeg is reportedly seeking a center who can eat first line minutes meaning its not pacioretty but Plek or, more likely, eller+ that they want in return.
- muffin_man

I think Eller is going to be this teams #2 centre behind Galchenyuk.
Considering i think it takes Eller/One good young D/+ to get Kane I don't think this team has the depth yet to do that.
All Mtl has been looking for in years are big centres. They finally have some and you want to trade him?
Now if you tell me it's Eller and not much else for Kane than sure.

I think Eller is going to be this teams #2 centre behind Galchenyuk.
Considering i think it takes Eller/One good young D/+ to get Kane I don't think this team has the depth yet to do that.
All Mtl has been looking for in years are big centres. They finally have some and you want to trade him?
Now if you tell me it's Eller and not much else for Kane than sure.
- habby

Thing is, Eller, Galchenyuk, Pacioretty, Bourque, they are all big but none of them play big. We need size AND grit, not just size.

Eller and Beaulieu for Kane I do. like you said though, much more than that and no.

Thing is, Eller, Galchenyuk, Pacioretty, Bourque, they are all big but none of them play big. We need size AND grit, not just size.

Eller and Beaulieu for Kane I do. like you said though, much more than that and no.
- muffin_man

A) I think it takes more than Eller and Beaulieu
B) I think Eller/Gal play with size

A) I think it takes more than Eller and Beaulieu
B) I think Eller/Gal play with size
- habby

A big factor in playing big is the system in play. Last year they had an aggressive system so we saw huge hits from Prust, White, Subban, Emelin, etc... but this year we don't see it as much because instead of always attacking and skating forward, the team retreats and tries to remain in a defensive position.

Under Therrien we're not going to see guys like Bourque or Pacioretty or whomever go out of position in order to lay a hit. I mean when is the last time we saw PK stand up at the blue line?

A big factor in playing big is the system in play. Last year they had an aggressive system so we saw huge hits from Prust, White, Subban, Emelin, etc... but this year we don't see it as much because instead of always attacking and skating forward, the team retreats and tries to remain in a defensive position.

Under Therrien we're not going to see guys like Bourque or Pacioretty or whomever go out of position in order to lay a hit. I mean when is the last time we saw PK stand up at the blue line?
- willey101

While I agree to an extent, no one is hitting anyone, ever. I don't think that's just the system. I think Bourque, Emelin, Prust, Pacioretty are all gun shy after their various injuries. The teams needs a shrink as much as it needs a coach.

While I agree to an extent, no one is hitting anyone, ever. I don't think that's just the system. I think Bourque, Emelin, Prust, Pacioretty are all gun shy after their various injuries. The teams needs a shrink as much as it needs a coach.
- muffin_man

Or an exorcist

While I agree to an extent, no one is hitting anyone, ever. I don't think that's just the system. I think Bourque, Emelin, Prust, Pacioretty are all gun shy after their various injuries. The teams needs a shrink as much as it needs a coach.
- muffin_man

I think he's playing hurt. It usually takes about a full year to recover from knee surgery, I figure Emelin gets a pass for the rest of the season as long as he can stay healthy. The other guys are soft, agreed, nothing to do with system.

I think he's playing hurt. It usually takes about a full year to recover from knee surgery, I figure Emelin gets a pass for the rest of the season as long as he can stay healthy. The other guys are soft, agreed, nothing to do with system.
- habby

After watching this game I can't imagine MB not pulling the trigger. Do something!! Price was brilliant, but can't do this during a playoff series, night after night. We are so soft! Very soft! We can't go into the playoffs with this team cause we will be out in 4 to 5 games. They have to look up front, but we need to something with the defense.

After watching this game I can't imagine MB not pulling the trigger. Do something!! Price was brilliant, but can't do this during a playoff series, night after night. We are so soft! Very soft! We can't go into the playoffs with this team cause we will be out in 4 to 5 games. They have to look up front, but we need to something with the defense.
- Slimvinnie

Problem is that right now he likely needs to deal Briere, Bourque, Diaz and not much take for any f those guys except for maybe Diaz.

Problem is that right now he likely needs to deal Briere, Bourque, Diaz and not much take for any f those guys except for maybe Diaz.
- willey101

retain $1M for Bourque and he's a fine 3rd liner for someone

Problem is that right now he likely needs to deal Briere, Bourque, Diaz and not much take for any f those guys except for maybe Diaz.
- willey101

If there any takers on Diaz, please ship him! I don't care what we get back. He was never between the boards and a player last night, spent his night poke checking from behind the players hoping he would end up with the puck. I can't see how Beaulieu and or Tonordi can play any worse.

retain $1M for Bourque and he's a fine 3rd liner for someone
- muffin_man

I agree, carry a bit of his salary and move him. Can't put up with this for another two years. He is totally disconnected, maybe a change would do him some good. It would certainly do the team some good.

Problem is that right now he likely needs to deal Briere, Bourque, Diaz and not much take for any f those guys except for maybe Diaz.
- willey101

STFU with your overly overwhelming opinions.. U suck!!!