This is how I feel.
The only players close to him (to me) are Weber, Stamkos, and Toews.
- jmatchett383

stammer has impressed me more lately, as his game is starting to show more things to it than simply just waiting for the puck on the dot. but i still do want to see him without st louis to truly evaluate him as one of the greatest. definitely up there regardless though, but for me to put him over tavares or toews id need to see that

Datsyuk at 27, yes. Not now (too big of an age gap). Suter is awesome, yes, but we've had this discussion before.

Well, I figured Rosehill was a given. Sorry.
- jmatchett383

yeah i feel the same with datsyuk. i always leave him out just for age reasons. stud still, but realistically wouldnt be in that "if you could pick one player" argument for that reason

so by that measure, you guys traded your manliest player on the team for steve downie? i kid, i kid....

i do see the merit in the playoffs, but it isnt as if hes been a total no show either.
- stayinthefnnet

I agree with you. Crosby's last few playoff appearances have been underwhelming. He's performed well in the past and still has a lot of chances left to impress. If the Pens struggle again in the playoffs, it would have me a little concerned as a Pens fan. It would have me euphoric as a Flyer fan

so by that measure, you guys traded your manliest player on the team for steve downie? i kid, i kid....

i do see the merit in the playoffs, but it isnt as if hes been a total no show either.
- stayinthefnnet

Crosby's career playoff Pts/GP is 1.28.
Ovechkin is 1.05.
Toews is 0.85 Pts/GP.

He does okay.

So if you had Crosby, you would trade him 1-for-1 for Toews?
Not saying you're right or wrong, just clarifying.
- jmatchett383

Would you trade Lemieux for Gretzky? Would you trade Roy for Broduer? Toews does have 2 cups, is a better "team" player, and doesnt have injury concerns.... But Corsby is better scorer and signed longer, to what is going to seem like a very friendly cap hit...if he lives long enough to see the end on the contract.

MAF was bad, but their defense was bad too. You need to have good team defense to win a cup. Pens haven't had that in the last few playoff appearances.
- PhillySportsGuy

theyve just been a complete mental mess, starting in net with MAF all the way out. you guys get them so hot and bothered its ridiculous. its been everything. forwards just wanting to run and gun all day, MAF rubbing his own excrement all over himself, mental lapses. brutal

Would you trade Lemieux for Gretzky? Would you trade Roy for Broduer? Toews does have 2 cups, is a better "team" player, and doesnt have injury concerns.... But Corsby is better scorer and signed longer, to what is going to seem like a very friendly cap hit...if he lives long enough to see the end on the contract.
- youarewrong

More Cups don't make you a better player. If you switched Crosby and Toews, do you think the Pens would be a better team?

Crosby's career playoff Pts/GP is 1.28.
Ovechkin is 1.05.
- jmatchett383

i have no attitude in this question whatsoever, so if it seems that way i dont mean it, but is there a point there that im missing or is it just more of a just pointing it out thing?

1.28 is pretty damn good.

theyve just been a complete mental mess, starting in net with MAF all the way out. you guys get them so hot and bothered its ridiculous. its been everything. forwards just wanting to run and gun all day, MAF rubbing his own excrement all over himself, mental lapses. brutal
- stayinthefnnet

Thanks, we aim to please!

Ovechkin is the best sniper in hockey. Unfortunately, that's all he really does at this point.
- PhillySportsGuy

Your right.... just throw out all Jagr's numbers.... all he ever was is a sniper.

I agree with you. Crosby's last few playoff appearances have been underwhelming. He's performed well in the past and still has a lot of chances left to impress. If the Pens struggle again in the playoffs, it would have me a little concerned as a Pens fan. It would have me euphoric as a Flyer fan
- PhillySportsGuy

oh its definitely concerning. but what can you do? most fan bases arent going to feel bad for the whole yeah.... our 2 art ross ringleaders just arent cutting it right now.

but who knows. i was really hoping the scuderi signing would bring some stability back

theyve just been a complete mental mess, starting in net with MAF all the way out. you guys get them so hot and bothered its ridiculous. its been everything. forwards just wanting to run and gun all day, MAF rubbing his own excrement all over himself, mental lapses. brutal
- stayinthefnnet

When your goaltending is bad in the playoffs, it just brings the whole team down. I think the Pens, also, get too finesse in the playoffs. That pretty poop may work against the little sisters of the poor, but not well structured defensive teams

Your right.... just throw out all Jagr's numbers.... all he ever was is a sniper.
- youarewrong

You mean BESIDES being 7th all time in assists?

Thanks, we aim to please!

- BiggE

haha oh of course. in all seriousness, that series was frustratingly devastating. i wish i couldve had no interest so that i could have just appreciated carnage pond hockey at its finest.

Your right.... just throw out all Jagr's numbers.... all he ever was is a sniper.
- youarewrong

Jagr and Ovechkin are totally different players. Jagr was a very good setup man and puck carrier. He's also an underrated back checker. You're comparing apples and oranges

More Cups don't make you a better player. If you switched Crosby and Toews, do you think the Pens would be a better team?
- PhillySportsGuy

Chris Osgood was better than Hasek, because he has more Cups.

And Kris Draper was better than Mario Lemieux for the same reason.

Heck, Mario wasn't even the best Lemieux. Claude has 3 Cups, so he's better than Mario.

haha oh of course. in all seriousness, that series was frustratingly devastating. i wish i couldve had no interest so that i could have just appreciated carnage pond hockey at its finest.
- stayinthefnnet

One of the most satisfying series win I can remember. Seeing the Pens lose control made it even more special. It was the most immature series of demonstrations I can remember in a long time. I just wish it was the Stanley Cup and not the first (frank)ing round!

One of the most satisfying series win I can remember. Seeing the Pens lose control made it even more special. It was the most immature series of demonstrations I can remember in a long time. I just wish it was the Stanley Cup and not the first (frank)ing round!
- PhillySportsGuy

Neither team was winning the Cup that year because of the first round. All of the energy was gone in 6 games.

When your goaltending is bad in the playoffs, it just brings the whole team down. I think the Pens, also, get too finesse in the playoffs. That pretty poop may work against the little sisters of the poor, but not well structured defensive teams
- PhillySportsGuy

definitely. its hard to discern too much for me though, because having your team be totally reckless in front of you can rattle goalies as well. it was just a brutal cycle. the team in front of him gives up breakaways and odd man rushes left and right, MAF gets PTSD and overcompensates and lets in repeated softies, resulting in the team in front of him trying to score at all costs even more, and so on and so on. a carousel of misery.

they do have a tendency to get too finesse though. they are the kid in college who everything was easy for and never had to study and therefore never learned how to crack down and put it to the grindstone. now theyre in law school and all of a sudden everythings ramped up and you cant just wing it and pot 5 in at a moments notice. they definitely hurt themselves

You mean BESIDES being 7th all time in assists?
- jmatchett383

Sorry, that was points. He's 11th all time in assists.

Neither team was winning the Cup that year because of the first round. All of the energy was gone in 6 games.
- jmatchett383

Little did we know, the next series was the beginning of a frustrating realization that the Flyers can't defend a forecheck.

Little did we know, the next series was the beginning of a frustrating realization that the Flyers can't defend a forecheck.
- PhillySportsGuy

What does "defend a forecheck" mean? I'm not familiar with that term.

Sorry, that was points. He's 11th all time in assists.
- jmatchett383

See. You;re wrong. Pure goal scorer. Nothing more.

When your goaltending is bad in the playoffs, it just brings the whole team down. I think the Pens, also, get too finesse in the playoffs. That pretty poop may work against the little sisters of the poor, but not well structured defensive teams
- PhillySportsGuy

although in an odd series of events, i feel as though it was the reverse against boston. they tried so hard to match the bruins physicality, and they totally lost themselves in it. not by being goonish, but by just putting the cart before the horse in their on ice play. the bruins have the players that can be ridiculously physical, while still getting the job done. the pens were so concerned with not getting pushed around that they basically forgot to generate and stop quality chances a long the way using their speed.

See. You;re wrong. Pure goal scorer. Nothing more.
- PhillySportsGuy

Agreed. His stickhandling skills and ability to shield the puck really leave something to be desired as well.