So what would it take for LA to part with Doughty? If its so easy. And by the way, it IS conjecture, but its based on some pretty sound logic. You don't need to be a rocket scientist to understand that players like this are not available.
- MBFlyerfan

who Knows? actually the teams that might move a good D man are probably teams that have viable options ....ie St. Louis, Nashville or teams that are going no where ....ie Florida and Buffalo....How do you know who's available??? and for what price??? rocket science? not exactly.
what is evident is until the Flyers have a substantial upgrade on the back end they are not a legitiment contender.

There isn't anything the Flyers can do this year to make this team a dangerous team come April. All they should be concerning themselves at this point is to get better for next year and put themselves into a good situation cap wise. This team is just missing too many pieces and anything over the top will hurt them more than it help them. They should just ride this season out and go with what they have and then evaluate over the summer what needs to be done to improve.

who Knows? actually the teams that might move a good D man are probably teams that have viable options ....ie St. Louis, Nashville or teams that are going no where ....ie Florida and Buffalo....How do you know who's available??? and for what price??? rocket science? not exactly.
what is evident is until the Flyers have a substantial upgrade on the back end they are not a legitiment contender.
- landros 2

Would you trade Morin, B. Schenn, Couturier and 2015 1st for Weber?

Because thats what it will take to get him. Also, the Blues aren't trading Pietrangelo or Shattenkirk unless the deal is ridiculously lopsided.

Would you trade Morin, B. Schenn, Couturier and 2015 1st for Weber?
- PhillySportsGuy

I think the Preds would hang up the phone almost immediately.

I don't because then the Rangers would get better.

Callahan is such an overrated player.
- PhillySportsGuy

He's like Drury... so much of his value is tied to his leadership mystique and the so-called little things... most GMs go absolutely freakin nuts over those. Thankfully, he wasn't in the Little League World Series, so at least we're all spared that.

who Knows? actually the teams that might move a good D man are probably teams that have viable options ....ie St. Louis, Nashville or teams that are going no where ....ie Florida and Buffalo....How do you know who's available??? and for what price??? rocket science? not exactly.
what is evident is until the Flyers have a substantial upgrade on the back end they are not a legitiment contender.
- landros 2

You want Doughty? Better be prepared to hear LA requesting Giroux.

I think its reasonable to be upset with Homer about the mix of defenseman they have, but I don't think its fair for you to blame Homer for the lack of a franchise defenseman.

He was put in a difficult position with the Pronger injury. I think he felt Pronger could carry the defense for 5 years while he built it up through the draft. Couple that with Mez being severely injured and he was left in a bad place.

There are very few teams that could withstand a career ending injury to their #1 dman.
- PhillySportsGuy

he hasn't been able to land a Franchise type....is it all his fault? of course not....if it was that easy, Im sure everyone would do it.....but everyone doesn't have young assets like Schenn, Couturier, Vorecek, Simmonds, Read to bargain with....Now did the Flyers withstand the career ending injury to Pronger??? thats debatable....last year out of the playoffs....a fringe team this year....
I just laugh when I here what people wouldn't give up? its not realistic....to get a top tier, franchise, a # 1 or 2 its going to hurt....would I move any of those kids for crap...no, but until Homer finds away to revamp that back end, they just arent good enough back there to succeed.

He's like Drury... so much of his value is tied to his leadership mystique and the so-called little things... most GMs go absolutely freakin nuts over those. Thankfully, he wasn't in the Little League World Series, so at least we're all spared that.
- Tomahawk

I know. I love a good two-way forward, but if a guy wants $6M AAV, he better be able to get me more than 40 points.

I dont think there is a formula that says you need an Elite Defenseman to make your team SCF worthy. IMO a decent defense mixed with potent offense and a good goalie is just as good. I think you go out, get a number 1-2 guy, and rework the defense so they are a coheisive unit, not a bunch road cones on the ice to skate around.

who Knows? actually the teams that might move a good D man are probably teams that have viable options ....ie St. Louis, Nashville or teams that are going no where ....ie Florida and Buffalo....How do you know who's available??? and for what price??? rocket science? not exactly.
what is evident is until the Flyers have a substantial upgrade on the back end they are not a legitiment contender.
- landros 2

Fine, we will continue to live in reality, and you can continue to live in your video game world where all trades are accepted in the Flyers favor and it costs them nothing and they win every trade.

Would you trade Morin, B. Schenn, Couturier and 2015 1st for Weber?

Because thats what it will take to get him. Also, the Blues aren't trading Pietrangelo or Shattenkirk unless the deal is ridiculously lopsided.
- PhillySportsGuy

I think certain players represent hills that GMs are willing to die on... no matter the deal, no matter how rational the offer, the answer will always be no.

You want Doughty? Better be prepared to hear LA requesting Giroux.
- jak521

that was another guys pipe dream....who would replace Doughty in LA ?

he hasn't been able to land a Franchise type....is it all his fault? of course not....if it was that easy, Im sure everyone would do it.....but everyone doesn't have young assets like Schenn, Couturier, Vorecek, Simmonds, Read to bargain with....Now did the Flyers withstand the career ending injury to Pronger??? thats debatable....last year out of the playoffs....a fringe team this year....
I just laugh when I here what people wouldn't give up? its not realistic....to get a top tier, franchise, a # 1 or 2 its going to hurt....would I move any of those kids for crap...no, but until Homer finds away to revamp that back end, they just arent good enough back there to succeed.
- landros 2

The problem for the Flyers is that they don't have much depth after their current roster. They can't trade some of the young assets then have several more come along. If you trade for a guy like Weber, it would take years to gather the defensive and offensive depth to compete for a Cup. By that time, Giroux may be passed his prime.

No one is against making a trade for a top defenseman, but it must be at the right price. You can't gut the roster for 1 player. Giroux can only play 20 minutes per night and Weber only 25 minutes per night. What are you going to do when they aren't on the ice?

Fine, we will continue to live in reality, and you can continue to live in your video game world where all trades are accepted in the Flyers favor and it costs them nothing and they win every trade.
- MBFlyerfan

wrong guy...never played a video game in my life!!! I am saying the exact opposite....I would trade one of our young centers, Morin and more then one first rounder for Weber.....because without a severe upgrade back there, we are just Lambs to the slaughter come playoffs....if we even make it.

he hasn't been able to land a Franchise type....is it all his fault? of course not....if it was that easy, Im sure everyone would do it.....but everyone doesn't have young assets like Schenn, Couturier, Vorecek, Simmonds, Read to bargain with....Now did the Flyers withstand the career ending injury to Pronger??? thats debatable....last year out of the playoffs....a fringe team this year....
I just laugh when I here what people wouldn't give up? its not realistic....to get a top tier, franchise, a # 1 or 2 its going to hurt....would I move any of those kids for crap...no, but until Homer finds away to revamp that back end, they just arent good enough back there to succeed.
- landros 2

What if the answer is to let Timonen and Meszaros walk and trade Grossmann. Then add a guy like Dailey through trade and either Markov or MacDonald through UFA. IMO your defense becomes much different. Maybe you dont have Weber or Suter, but you have confidence in your depth...

Markov/MacDonald-Schenn
Dailey-Coburn
Gus/Morin-Streit.

that was another guys pipe dream....who would replace Doughty in LA ?
- landros 2

Slava Voynov would likely get the nod. I dont think any one can just replace a guy like that, but they do have some interesting players.


Also, buy adding a guy like Giroux, they could trade another player for a d-man potentially.

I was just saying that a guy like Doughty or Weber is gonna cost you a poop ton.

I think certain players represent hills that GMs are willing to die on... no matter the deal, no matter how rational the offer, the answer will always be no.
- Tomahawk

I think it would be difficult for Poile to trade Weber after the owners used their personal wealth to pay the first few years of his signing bonus (poison pill). I'm sure Poile gave them a speech like "We need to re-sign this guy or we will be the joke of the league having lost 2 franchise defenseman in 1 offseason"

I dont think there is a formula that says you need an Elite Defenseman to make your team SCF worthy. IMO a decent defense mixed with potent offense and a good goalie is just as good. I think you go out, get a number 1-2 guy, and rework the defense so they are a coheisive unit, not a bunch road cones on the ice to skate around.
- SchennBros

that may work.....but to even get a legit top 2 its going to cost them.

wrong guy...never played a video game in my life!!! I am saying the exact opposite....I would trade one of our young centers, Morin and more then one first rounder for Weber.....because without a severe upgrade back there, we are just Lambs to the slaughter come playoffs....if we even make it.
- landros 2

Sorry. Not enough. Were talking multiple forwards. Couturier, Simmonds/Voracek, Morin, 2 1sts.

he hasn't been able to land a Franchise type....is it all his fault? of course not....if it was that easy, Im sure everyone would do it.....but everyone doesn't have young assets like Schenn, Couturier, Vorecek, Simmonds, Read to bargain with....Now did the Flyers withstand the career ending injury to Pronger??? thats debatable....last year out of the playoffs....a fringe team this year....
I just laugh when I here what people wouldn't give up? its not realistic....to get a top tier, franchise, a # 1 or 2 its going to hurt....would I move any of those kids for crap...no, but until Homer finds away to revamp that back end, they just arent good enough back there to succeed.
- landros 2

We know this. And we know that a franchise-type defenseman is capable of changing that (the Pronger-types, not the J-Bo types). Unfortunately, there is no logical deal that will pluck one away. So yes, the back end is flawed right now. They have drafted deep with defensemen the past 2 years in the hope that a) one of them will pan out as that type of player or b) the sum of their parts makes that player a luxury instead of a need. There is nothing that anyone can do right now to make this defense anything but marginally better without gutting the team.

wrong guy...never played a video game in my life!!! I am saying the exact opposite....I would trade one of our young centers, Morin and more then one first rounder for Weber.....because without a severe upgrade back there, we are just Lambs to the slaughter come playoffs....if we even make it.
- landros 2

There's no way that a young, high ceiling but fairly unproven center, a huge question mark of a draft pick, and a few 1sts are prying away Shea Weber.

Try B. Schenn and Couturier, Morin, Coburn, Laughton, and 2 1sts and you're probably closer.

We know this. And we know that a franchise-type defenseman is capable of changing that (the Pronger-types, not the J-Bo types). Unfortunately, there is no logical deal that will pluck one away. So yes, the back end is flawed right now. They have drafted deep with defensemen the past 2 years in the hope that a) one of them will pan out as that type of player or b) the sum of their parts makes that player a luxury instead of a need. There is nothing that anyone can do right now to make this defense anything but marginally better without gutting the team.
- jmatchett383

Franchise defenseman are a key component of most Stanley Cup winners, but so is depth. No team wins the Cup without depth.

The problem for the Flyers is that they don't have much depth after their current roster. They can't trade some of the young assets then have several more come along. If you trade for a guy like Weber, it would take years to gather the defensive and offensive depth to compete for a Cup. By that time, Giroux may be passed his prime.
No one is against making a trade for a top defenseman, but it must be at the right price. You can't gut the roster for 1 player. Giroux can only play 20 minutes per night and Weber only 25 minutes per night. What are you going to do when they aren't on the ice?
- PhillySportsGuy

While I am more of a guy that would rather balance out our defense than trade for an "elite" guy... I will say that you are more likely to be able to fill your offensive wholes through FA and trades then you are to fill a Top defenseman that same way.

For example, lets say you have trade someone like Read or Schenn for a top defenseman. You can always sign a guy like Calahan or Gaborik in FA... Not that I am suggesting either, just an example that you can still get A- forwards in FA while the best your likely to get is a B defenseman.

What if the answer is to let Timonen and Meszaros walk and trade Grossmann. Then add a guy like Dailey through trade and either Markov or MacDonald through UFA. IMO your defense becomes much different. Maybe you dont have Weber or Suter, but you have confidence in your depth...

Markov/MacDonald-Schenn
Dailey-Coburn
Gus/Morin-Streit.
- SchennBros

Honestly...Mez and Timo are gone after this year anyways.....I haven't seen that much of Dailey to know and Macdonald does have some offensive upside to his game, but your probably over paying for him.
Im not saying its easy....but I know what I watch game in and game out, and their D is not very good.
perhaps with the Cap going up some of the teams with limited budgets will be forced to move some assets at a more palatable price. I guess we'll see.

Sorry. Not enough. Were talking multiple forwards. Couturier, Simmonds/Voracek, Morin, 2 1sts.
- PhillySportsGuy

and maybe thats why Weber is not a Flyer. but any deal for Weber is and was going to hurt.