One thing I'd like to add to the special teams. STOP ALLOWING SO MANY SHORT HANDED GOALS! THEY ARE A KILLER. Thank you.
- PhillySportsGuy

I'll second that motion!

That's certainly two players trending in completely opposite directions.
- Tomahawk

Which means nothing what so ever considering neither player is a proven NHL talent at this time

I find it hard to understand how the Flyers franchise defenseman taking a stick to the eye and suffering a career ending injury, is on the GM. Time and again, this is ignored in what has happened to the Flyers defense. And the huge role it had it the dominoes that followed. I think the defense needs to be improved for sure going forward. But if as Bill talked about in the blog, the Flyers play a solid team game defensively, then the defense is not a glaring weakness. If this current team is going to have any success this season, then the forwards have to give the support to the defense, to compensate for any weaknesses on the backend.
- MJL

Pronger's injury is certainly not on Holmgren, however it does illustrate the risk that you take when giving up multiple assets for one impact player. If that player gets a career ending injury, your team can be crippled for a number of seasons.

That being said, I would still make the Pronger deal, there's no doubt in my mind that at the time of the trade, it made the Flyers a better team.

Pronger's injury is certainly not on Holmgren, however it does illustrate the risk that you take when giving up multiple assets for one impact player. If that player gets a career ending injury, your team can be crippled for a number of seasons.

That being said, I would still make the Pronger deal, there's no doubt in my mind that at the time of the trade, it made the Flyers a better team.
- BiggE

The thing with the Pronger deal was the number of eggs Homer put in one basket.

When that basket fell down....well, you get scrambled eggs, which kind of describes how the Flyers break out of their own zone.

Without any guarantee of being able to re-sign him without significantly overspending, I'd be pretty wary about giving up any more than a 2nd and a prospect other than Laughton, Morin, Hagg, Ghost or Stolarz.

My best guess is that someone will offer more than that, so I doubt he ends up here unless Homer overpays.

edit: I think I'd much rather have Daley, if for no other reason than he's signed to a very reasonable contract for the next few years.
- BiggE

I wouldn't even give that much...picks & maybe a McGinn or Lauridsen

Pronger's injury is certainly not on Holmgren, however it does illustrate the risk that you take when giving up multiple assets for one impact player. If that player gets a career ending injury, your team can be crippled for a number of seasons.

That being said, I would still make the Pronger deal, there's no doubt in my mind that at the time of the trade, it made the Flyers a better team.
- BiggE

It's the same for any player. What happens if Giroux suffers a career ending injury? Now they didn't trade for him, and give up assets, but the affect it would have on the team would be the same. What would've happened if Lidstrom, Chara, or any other top defenseman on a team suffered a career ending injury? It's really tough to make up for that. I think if the GM is going to be criticized, then all the factors need to be considered. Look at the moves that have been made, and how it might be different if Pronger didn't get hurt. Is the trade for Grossmann made? Does he re-sign Carle? etc, etc. When a franchise defenseman goes down, the easiest and most available remedy is to add peice meal, and add role playing defenseman to use a multiple player approach to try and make up for all the facets of the game that a franchise players gave you. And when top defenseman become available, take your shot at them. I know some think that the GM should've replace Pronger by now, but I don't think that's realisitc with the options that have been available.
One area in building the defense that can certainly be criticized fairly, is in drafting and developing defense. That has been lacking in the past. But I think they are taking steps to correct that.

if Holmgren does something....it probably will be a minor tinker.....other wise he will have to make a "hockey deal" in other words give up something of value to get something....one thing that was glaring at the olympics was how important D is and how many great D men there are....the Flyers D is below average...not average...below average. Frankly I could care less what the Flyers give up in trades to rebuild "the elephant in the room D" ....because with out a franchise D man like Pronger, or a severe up grade ....they can not be considered contenders.
How can the Flyers have spent SO SO SO much on D and still have it as a glaring weakness.....Holmgren this is on you.
- landros 2

They spend so much on defense to try and fix the massive hole left in the wake of Pronger's injury.

When a team loses Pronger, there's always been a drop off, even if they traded him

I find it hard to understand how the Flyers franchise defenseman taking a stick to the eye and suffering a career ending injury, is on the GM. Time and again, this is ignored in what has happened to the Flyers defense. And the huge role it had it the dominoes that followed. I think the defense needs to be improved for sure going forward. But if as Bill talked about in the blog, the Flyers play a solid team game defensively, then the defense is not a glaring weakness. If this current team is going to have any success this season, then the forwards have to give the support to the defense, to compensate for any weaknesses on the backend.
- MJL

news flash .....Pronger hasn't played in TWO years, time too get on with it.....its not ignored, but the fact remains there D is a below average, overpriced with the most of the talent coming from guys who are very late in their career. Im not sure who would be out there that the Flyers could trade for....Im dont pretend to be in the know ....but that IS the GMs job to fix the problem and in this NHL, you have too give something up to get something.
You are very right when you talk about the forwards being responsable to help the D....but I totally disagree that their D is not the glaring weakness even with back checking forwards....

Pronger's injury is certainly not on Holmgren, however it does illustrate the risk that you take when giving up multiple assets for one impact player. If that player gets a career ending injury, your team can be crippled for a number of seasons.

That being said, I would still make the Pronger deal, there's no doubt in my mind that at the time of the trade, it made the Flyers a better team.
- BiggE

all fine and good.....but its time the problem is addressed, with more then a band aid solution.

all fine and good.....but its time the problem is addressed, with more then a band aid solution.
- landros 2

How? What would suggest they do? Get Shea Weber? Get Ryan Suter. Maybe Homer should have tried to sign those guys.

They spend so much on defense to try and fix the massive hole left in the wake of Pronger's injury.

When a team loses Pronger, there's always been a drop off, even if they traded him
- Jsaquella

that in there lies the problem....it's the swings and misses on their current crop of d men thats the problem. The Pronger injury is over with....done....He hasn't played in two years. What I see is a team with some great young forwards, that will go no where unless they organization fixes its problems on the back end.
Would I trade Giroux ? no. But besides the countless # of no trade and no movement clauses this team has, they will have to give up something of value to help fix the "pronger" problem.....

How? What would suggest they do? Get Shea Weber? Get Ryan Suter. Maybe Homer should have tried to sign those guys.
- MBFlyerfan

they tried on both....I don't think its from lack of trying....But in both cases they were not giving up anything to get those guys except Ed Sniders $

The thing with the Pronger deal was the number of eggs Homer put in one basket.

When that basket fell down....well, you get scrambled eggs, which kind of describes how the Flyers break out of their own zone.
- johndewar

Nailed it. I'd go one step further and bring Kimmo into the risk management angle... Hitching the entire team's fortunes to two mid-30's D was just asking for trouble. Yes, they were unlucky with Prongers fluke injury, but consider how lucky they've been that Kimmo's been able to avoid missing many games. The hockey gods give and they take, but that doesn't mean Homer's off the hook for betting against the odds in the Pronger deal.

they tried on both....I don't think its from lack of trying....But in both cases they were not giving up anything to get those guys except Ed Sniders $
- landros 2

I think he was being a little sarcastic with that post!

Does he re-sign Carle? etc, etc. When a franchise defenseman goes down, the easiest and most available remedy is to add peice meal, and add role playing defenseman to use a multiple player approach to try and make up for all the facets of the game that a franchise players gave you. And when top defenseman become available, take your shot at them. I know some think that the GM should've replace Pronger by now, but I don't think that's realisitc with the options that have been available.
One area in building the defense that can certainly be criticized fairly, is in drafting and developing defense. That has been lacking in the past. But I think they are taking steps to correct that.
- MJL

[
that certainly has been Holmgrens approach......peice meal. But I don't know how you would know that there hasn't been any realistic options out there....

4 points and a hat trick last night…I'm talking about Jay Rosehill in yesterdays practice. Oh and Laughton had a pretty good game last night too I think.
- PhillySportsGuy

that in there lies the problem....it's the swings and misses on their current crop of d men thats the problem. The Pronger injury is over with....done....He hasn't played in two years. What I see is a team with some great young forwards, that will go no where unless they organization fixes its problems on the back end.
Would I trade Giroux ? no. But besides the countless # of no trade and no movement clauses this team has, they will have to give up something of value to help fix the "pronger" problem.....
- landros 2

The issue is, that they tried to remain competitive after the injury, rather than rebuild. To do that, required spending on free agents or retaining your own players at market value.

They also used a lot of picks to acquire the defensemen, which on top of the trade for Pronger, forced them to the sidelines and meant fewer opportunities to draft young defensemen, which costs less. That's the real reason why the defense is so expensive, there's very few guys on their first or second contracts.

That can be blamed on the GM or at least the failure to draft & develop defensemen internally.

So glad the Olympics are over.

- johndewar

Amen! Time for real hockey again!! woo!!!

Which means nothing what so ever considering neither player is a proven NHL talent at this time
- mochoson

Yeah, growth trends mean nothing... should have traded Giroux for Erik Johnson back in 07.

I think he was being a little sarcastic with that post!
- Daceroni

Im sure he was.....but addressing the problem with $ or an actual Hockey trade is two different things....one takes a well thought out plan....the other takes Ed Sniders $.....and right now Option 2 ain't working.

Im sure he was.....but addressing the problem with $ or an actual Hockey trade is two different things....one takes a well thought out plan....the other takes Ed Sniders $.....and right now Option 2 ain't working.
- landros 2

So who would you trade for and what would you give up?

So who would you trade for and what would you give up?
- PhillySportsGuy

bschenn for roman josi.

The issue is, that they tried to remain competitive after the injury, rather than rebuild. To do that, required spending on free agents or retaining your own players at market value.

They also used a lot of picks to acquire the defensemen, which on top of the trade for Pronger, forced them to the sidelines and meant fewer opportunities to draft young defensemen, which costs less. That's the real reason why the defense is so expensive, there's very few guys on their first or second contracts.

That can be blamed on the GM or at least the failure to draft & develop defensemen internally.
- Jsaquella

I disagree with the the notion of the "rebuild". I do not understand why a team needs to "rebuild" in the NHL. You can make the playoffs while still improving your depth. Just stop trading young assets for older assets. Make your draft picks. The Flyers have focused on drafting D-men over the last few drafts. I am ok with this team being just a playoff team while they build up assets. I do not think a team needs to be bad now to be good in 3-5 years. This is not the NBA.

bschenn for olli maata.
- stayinthefnnet

deal

bschenn for roman josi.
- stayinthefnnet

I would make that trade for the Flyers. However, I would need an additional pick or asset though. I think Schenn has the higher guaranteed high end game.