He lacks top end hockey sense, and after the eye injury in the 2008 playoffs he seems to have lost some of his offensive "flair"
- Jsaquella

Ugh. Take the nose but don't touch our defenseman's eyes!!!!

Did you tape it?
- PhillySportsGuy

Sadly no.

Ugh. Take the nose but don't touch our defenseman's eyes!!!!
- PhillySportsGuy

That's really the only event that seems to coincide with his decline offensively. Of course the next season they stumbled a bit, and lost early in the playoffs and got Pronger and had Carle at that point, so he took on a smaller and smaller role.

Braydn Schenn is going to have a better career than Ryan Kesler.
Someone break Homers hands

Exactly. He needs to be at least similar to Coburn
- Jsaquella

He looks like Bryan Allen right now... that's not entirely a bad thing, but not sure most people would be satisfied with that.

His offense has gone down every season. I remember him having some offensive ability. Not sure what happened to it. I guess being moved off the PP made the difference.
- PhillySportsGuy

He has really improved in that consistency department this season, but he really pissed me off in years past with that. He would be amazing for a stretch, and then horrific after.

I think just being able to focus on his defensive game has been good for him. He is what he is, so be it.

Sure it is. And that's why we've been talking about guys like Morrissey and Zadorov and marveling at their post-draft season progress, and how it suggests good things are in store for them.

Morin's improved, too, but his path seems a lot longer and less certain than the aforementioned guys. That's the only point that was being made.


- Tomahawk

I think that's all speculation and bias at this point. Mainly because Morin isn't the right "type" of defenseman for some fans taste.

Huh?
- Tomahawk

Corsi is a statistical measure for possession and by proxy of puck moving ability for a defenseman, is it not?

That's really the only event that seems to coincide with his decline offensively. Of course the next season they stumbled a bit, and lost early in the playoffs and got Pronger and had Carle at that point, so he took on a smaller and smaller role.
- Jsaquella

It was against the Pens wasn't it? THose bastards

Braydn Schenn is going to have a better career than Ryan Kesler.
Someone break Homers hands
- Winning

That'd be nice, but Kesler won a Selke. Im not sure Schenn will reach that level.

He has really improved in that consistency department this season, but he really pissed me off in years past with that. He would be amazing for a stretch, and then horrific after.

I think just being able to focus on his defensive game has been good for him. He is what he is, so be it.
- flyer_nutter

Yeah. Thats true with the consistency. I think he was asked to focus on certain aspects and now he plays a conservative game by nature. I wouldn't mind seeing him jump into the play more often. He's such a good skater.

He looks like Bryan Allen right now... that's not entirely a bad thing, but not sure most people would be satisfied with that.
- Tomahawk

The thing with Morin is, he is so raw that his learning curve could be huge.

Again, it gets back to being limited. Limited players either require more support, or have to take on smaller roles on a good team.

It's like Andrew MacDonald or Grossmann. On a really good team, they're 3rd pair guys. Not that there's anything wrong with that, it's just what they are.

The thing with Morin is, he is so raw that his learning curve could be huge.

Again, it gets back to being limited. Limited players either require more support, or have to take on smaller roles on a good team.

It's like Andrew MacDonald or Grossmann. On a really good team, they're 3rd pair guys. Not that there's anything wrong with that, it's just what they are.
- Jsaquella

The Flyers certainly didn't take Morin where they did because they felt he was going to be in the class of McDonald, Allen, or Grossmann. If anyone asked the Flyers scouts or Holmgren if Morin was comparable to Bryan Allen, they'd probably laugh.

I think that's all speculation and bias at this point. Mainly because Morin isn't the right "type" of defenseman for some fans taste.
- MJL

Zadorov and Morin are the same type of defenseman...

Corsi is a statistical measure for possession and by proxy of puck moving ability for a defenseman, is it not?
- MJL

So the measure is inextricable from the thing being measured?

So everybody who mentions possession or puck-moving is secretly talking about Corsi?

The Flyers certainly didn't take Morin where they did because they felt he was going to be in the class of McDonald, Allen, or Grossmann. If anyone asked the Flyers scouts or Holmgren if Morin was comparable to Bryan Allen, they'd probably laugh.
- MJL

I think we've had this conversation before... Allen's was a bonafide top-4 dman in his prime (even top-pair at times)... he had enough tools be taken 4th-overall: huge, moves well, big shot, mean as all heck. Sound familiar?

Zadorov and Morin are the same type of defenseman...


- Tomahawk

One of the topics of conversation regarding Morin today has been that some feel that he doesn't have a high offensive upside, and that they would've preferred that type of player, versus what Morin is.

So the measure is inextricable from the thing being measured?

So everybody who mentions possession or puck-moving is secretly talking about Corsi?
- Tomahawk

It's all simply related.

Nice goal by Ennis.

I think we've had this conversation before... Allen's was a bonafide top-4 dman in his prime (even top-pair at times)... he had enough tools be taken 4th-overall: huge, moves well, big shot, mean as all heck. Sound familiar?
- Tomahawk

Allen was drafted by Vancouver 4th overall. But he obviously didn't live up to that. Not saying that he's not been a good player. But I would think that the Flyers have hopes that Morin turns out to be a better player then Allen has turned out to be.

One of the topics of conversation regarding Morin today has been that some feel that he doesn't have a high offensive upside, and that they would've preferred that type of player, versus what Morin is.

- MJL

I love ceilings applied to high draft picks before they've even gotten 1 season under their belt...

What's the point?

Fun game in Dallas. Run and gun. Really like those jerseys.

I think we've had this conversation before... Allen's was a bonafide top-4 dman in his prime (even top-pair at times)... he had enough tools be taken 4th-overall: huge, moves well, big shot, mean as all heck. Sound familiar?
- Tomahawk

The worrisome thing is, Allen was taken in 1998...when guys Hatcher were necessary pieces for a NHL team, with the "dead puck" era in full bloom. It's a different world now, and even if a guy is a big, physical nasty bastard, he's got to be able to skate a lot better than Hatcher did.

Thankfully, Morin doesn't seem to be limited by his skating, but his puck carrying and passing skills will need to be honed to avoid his becoming a limited guy.

Fun game in Dallas. Run and gun. Really like those jerseys.
- flyer_nutter

Good hockey weather in Dallas as well.

Love you Climate Change.

The worrisome thing is, Allen was taken in 1998...when guys Hatcher were necessary pieces for a NHL team, with the "dead puck" era in full bloom. It's a different world now, and even if a guy is a big, physical nasty bastard, he's got to be able to skate a lot better than Hatcher did.

Thankfully, Morin doesn't seem to be limited by his skating, but his puck carrying and passing skills will need to be honed to avoid his becoming a limited guy.
- Jsaquella

It's still Hockey. Derian Hatcher in his prime would be a top defenseman today, just as he was back when he played.

The worrisome thing is, Allen was taken in 1998...when guys Hatcher were necessary pieces for a NHL team, with the "dead puck" era in full bloom. It's a different world now, and even if a guy is a big, physical nasty bastard, he's got to be able to skate a lot better than Hatcher did.

Thankfully, Morin doesn't seem to be limited by his skating, but his puck carrying and passing skills will need to be honed to avoid his becoming a limited guy.
- Jsaquella

Yeah, that's all that anybody is saying, and that's a lot more of a pragmatic view than poop like Panotch's been throwing out... casual Pronger comparisons that aren't rooted in anything but "somebody told me".

Yeah, that's all that anybody is saying, and that's a lot more of a pragmatic view than poop like Panotch's been throwing out... casual Pronger comparisons that aren't rooted in anything but "somebody told me".
- Tomahawk

And honestly, comparing the player to Pronger is just setting the kid up for failure. That's a very unlikely scenario.

Yeah, that's all that anybody is saying, and that's a lot more of a pragmatic view than poop like Panotch throwing out... casual Pronger comparisons that aren't rooted in anything but "somebody told me".
- Tomahawk

I follow enough guys who are QMJHL observers to feel OK about Morin's potential. My biggest concern is the Flyers rushing him. They'll need to take the slow cooker approach to him.

I've seen a couple of his games and watched some highlights. He does move well for his size, and he's not a black hole with the puck. It'll be interesting to see how he adapts when he gets to higher levels in that regard.