Pronger was arguably better in his 30s than he was in his 20s -- as indicated by his near constant trips to the SCF. Only thing that declined was his foot speed, but he had so many other tools that he was able to compensate.

Vinny had no less that four teammates equal or ahead of him in points per 60 mins at ES last season... including such luminaries as Tyler Johnson and Benoit Pouiliot.

Accumulated injuries are/were going to do both of them in, but Pronger at 80% still had a lot to offer! versus Vinny who has a very narrow range of effectiveness.
- Tomahawk

Vinny had great numbers during his prime, but I always thought Marty was the straw that stirred that drink. Remarkable talent for a man his size.

Ghost of Chris Pronger's wife wouldn't allow it.
- Jeropotato

Don't you worry about the Ghost of Chris Pronger's wife, let me worry about blank.

Hall

Edit: Couturier won't be traded unless its for a top pairing dman or a guy with top pairing potential. He's going to be a stud. He's already one of the best defensive centers in hockey and is on pace for 40 points. He matches up against top lines every night.
- PhillySportsGuy

Well Yeah, that's why I like him. He would be perfect in Edmonton between Perron and Yakapov. Could probably get over 50 pts regularly as well.

Value wise he is pretty close to Ebs,( give or take a sweetener) but positionally he is the hotter commodity.

Heard some talk about Nashville listening to offers for Weber prior to the draft. Think Philly would get involved again?

Well Yeah, that's why I like him. He would be perfect in Edmonton between Perron and Yakapov. Could probably get over 50 pts regularly as well.

Value wise he is pretty close to Ebs,( give or take a sweetener) but positionally he is the hotter commodity.

Heard some talk about Nashville listening to offers for Weber prior to the draft. Think Philly would get involved again?
- Jeropotato

Rule #1 of Flyers management.

If there is a big name player available, we need to get involved.

That being said, I don't see Nashville dealing him unless they get overwhelmed. It will be pretty hard for Poile to go back to management (who paid his contract out of pocket) and say "Remember that guy I said we couldn't let go under any circumstance? Well I'm trading him"

And there is no hope whatsoever that it changes?
- MJL

Of course not....what choice do they have ? Unlike the NFL the contracts are guaranteed.....so the hope has to be they can get something...anything ...out of Vinny going forward...but his play is a liability at this point.

Well Yeah, that's why I like him. He would be perfect in Edmonton between Perron and Yakapov. Could probably get over 50 pts regularly as well.

Value wise he is pretty close to Ebs,( give or take a sweetener) but positionally he is the hotter commodity.

Heard some talk about Nashville listening to offers for Weber prior to the draft. Think Philly would get involved again?
- Jeropotato

Nope. The Weber ship has sailed.

1. The Preds turned down 4 1st rounders when they matched, so my guess is they'd want Voracek or Simmonds, Brayden Schenn or Couturier, Scott Laughton and a 1st rounder to even consider it, and that's just way too much for a team that has the depth the Flyers have to entertain.

2. I doubt that Nashvile wants to move him. By the time the draft rolls around, they will have paid him $28mm for 130 games. The deal starts to get cheaper over the next 4 years, and at that point Weber's a bargain

3. Potential cap recapture issues. If the Preds deal Weber now, and he retires before the end of his deal, they could be facing $4mm per year for a couple/few years as a cap penalty

Pronger was arguably better in his 30s than he was in his 20s -- as indicated by his near constant trips to the SCF. Only thing that declined was his foot speed, but he had so many other tools that he was able to compensate.

Vinny had no less that four teammates equal or ahead of him in points per 60 mins at ES last season... including such luminaries as Tyler Johnson and Benoit Pouiliot.

Accumulated injuries are/were going to do both of them in, but Pronger at 80% still had a lot to offer, versus Vinny who has a very narrow range of effectiveness.
- Tomahawk

Getting to the SCF is a team accomplishment. So that is a false narrative to argue that he was better in his 30's then in his 20's. He was winning individual awards such as the Hart and Norris Trophy when he was in his 20's

Tyler Johnson played all of 14 games last Season. Hardly enough of a sample to allow for ups and downs or slumps for a player. And points per 60 is a badly flawed stat. There's no way they can account for the various factors that come into play, as a player is given more and more responsibilities and plays in a different and larger role. And how it can affect that rate.
But if anyone wants to ignore that Lecavalier was a top key player for TB last Season, and state that Pouliot and Johnson were in any way better players. They are welcome to do so.

Of course not....what choice do they have ? Unlike the NFL the contracts are guaranteed.....so the hope has to be they can get something...anything ...out of Vinny going forward...but his play is a liability at this point.
- landros 2

So I say let's put him in the best position to succeed.

So I say let's put him in the best position to succeed.
- MJL

Lets put the team in the best position to succeed

So I say let's put him in the best position to succeed.
- MJL

What if that forces a younger player out of his best position to succeed? Because if he's playing 2nd line center that means Brayden Schenn moves to a position he's less effective playing.

I'm sorely disappointed in Lecavalier's all around play. I give him a bit of leeway for the injuries, but he's been awful.

If it is injuries that are limiting him, they should shut him down.

What if that forces a younger player out of his best position to succeed? Because if he's playing 2nd line center that means Brayden Schenn moves to a position he's less effective playing.

I'm sorely disappointed in Lecavalier's all around play. I give him a bit of leeway for the injuries, but he's been awful.

If it is injuries that are limiting him, they should shut him down.
- Jsaquella

He does a lot of other things that piss me off too. He seems to cherry pick and look for the home run a lot. He doesn't do anything well defensively and worst of all, he tries too many low percentage plays. He needs to simplify his game. Stop trying to do to much.

Nope. The Weber ship has sailed.

1. The Preds turned down 4 1st rounders when they matched, so my guess is they'd want Voracek or Simmonds, Brayden Schenn or Couturier, Scott Laughton and a 1st rounder to even consider it, and that's just way too much for a team that has the depth the Flyers have to entertain.

2. I doubt that Nashvile wants to move him. By the time the draft rolls around, they will have paid him $28mm for 130 games. The deal starts to get cheaper over the next 4 years, and at that point Weber's a bargain

3. Potential cap recapture issues. If the Preds deal Weber now, and he retires before the end of his deal, they could be facing $4mm per year for a couple/few years as a cap penalty
- Jsaquella

I think the odds are slim. But I don't think the door is fully closed. Weber's deal still sees signing bonuses due each off season of 13M,13M, 8M, 8M the next four off seasons. And Nashville faces pretty much the same cap recapture penalties if they keep him and don't trade him and he retires early, say with two years left on the deal, then if they trade him this off season. So that's not really a factor.

What if that forces a younger player out of his best position to succeed? Because if he's playing 2nd line center that means Brayden Schenn moves to a position he's less effective playing.

I'm sorely disappointed in Lecavalier's all around play. I give him a bit of leeway for the injuries, but he's been awful.

If it is injuries that are limiting him, they should shut him down.
- Jsaquella

I don't believe that Brayden Schenn is that much of a different player, at Wing then at center.

Lets put the team in the best position to succeed
- PhillySportsGuy

I agree. That's why I want Schenn at Wing, and Lecavalier at Center.

He does a lot of other things that piss me off too. He seems to cherry pick and look for the home run a lot. He doesn't do anything well defensively and worst of all, he tries too many low percentage plays. He needs to simplify his game. Stop trying to do to much.
- PhillySportsGuy

I agree there. Last night that choice of the spin around back hand pass was ridiculous. Sign of a struggling and frustrated player.

I don't believe that Brayden Schenn is that much of a different player, at Wing then at center.
- MJL

I disagree, and I don't feel making adjustments to fit in Lecavalier helps the team, given the poor level of play he's displayed for most of the season.

I'd rather see them do Bill's suggestion, and use him as a 4th liner and PP specialist.

I agree. That's why I want Schenn at Wing, and Lecavalier at Center.
- MJL

He does a lot of other things that piss me off too. He seems to cherry pick and look for the home run a lot. He doesn't do anything well defensively and worst of all, he tries too many low percentage plays. He needs to simplify his game. Stop trying to do to much.
- PhillySportsGuy

That drives me nuts, too...but it's just uncanny how, since that first injury from the fight in Washington, as soon as he joined a line it's effectiveness took a hit.

He went to the Couturier-Read line when Downie went out and that line's overall effectiveness dropped. He went back to the Schenn-Simmonds line, replacing Hartnell and their play slipped, as well.

So I say let's put him in the best position to succeed.
- MJL

Not that it's our choice but the Flyers will do what's best for the organization.....if they feel at this point, as I do, Schenn is a better option today and for tomorrow as the teams # 2 center.....that's the way it's going to be....this is not about what's best for one guy.....it's what's better for the team.

Nope. The Weber ship has sailed.

1. The Preds turned down 4 1st rounders when they matched, so my guess is they'd want Voracek or Simmonds, Brayden Schenn or Couturier, Scott Laughton and a 1st rounder to even consider it, and that's just way too much for a team that has the depth the Flyers have to entertain.

2. I doubt that Nashvile wants to move him. By the time the draft rolls around, they will have paid him $28mm for 130 games. The deal starts to get cheaper over the next 4 years, and at that point Weber's a bargain

3. Potential cap recapture issues. If the Preds deal Weber now, and he retires before the end of his deal, they could be facing $4mm per year for a couple/few years as a cap penalty
- Jsaquella

Would that $4m help a team get to the cap floor or is it just deducted from the cap ceiling? Just curious.

I disagree, and I don't feel making adjustments to fit in Lecavalier helps the team, given the poor level of play he's displayed for most of the season.

I'd rather see them do Bill's suggestion, and use him as a 4th liner and PP specialist.
- Jsaquella

Schenn has been playing at center, and he has 6 points in the last 15 games. The numbers are clear. He has had the same ups and downs and struggles at center as he has at wing.
I don't think there is any doubt that Lecavalier is a better player at Center then at LW. And the disparity between him playing those two spots, is much larger then moving Schenn between Wing and center.
Playing Lecavalier on the 4th line, and getting the scraps of whatever is left on the PP after the first unit is done, is a waste. Might at well scratch him.

I think the odds are slim. But I don't think the door is fully closed. Weber's deal still sees signing bonuses due each off season of 13M,13M, 8M, 8M the next four off seasons. And Nashville faces pretty much the same cap recapture penalties if they keep him and don't trade him and he retires early, say with two years left on the deal, then if they trade him this off season. So that's not really a factor.
- MJL

And they'll still want a massive load of assets to even consider moving him, which guts the team's depth and makes adding Weber kind of useless.

Not that it's our choice but the Flyers will do what's best for the organization.....if they feel at this point, as I do, Schenn is a better option today and for tomorrow as the teams # 2 center.....that's the way it's going to be....this is not about what's best for one guy.....it's what's better for the team.
- landros 2

My focus is the same. And my opinion is based on what I feel is best for the team. Not just one player. And yes, the Flyers might not agree, and they have the only vote.

And they'll still want a massive load of assets to even consider moving him, which guts the team's depth and makes adding Weber kind of useless.
- Jsaquella

As with any trade, it depends on the cost.

That drives me nuts, too...but it's just uncanny how, since that first injury from the fight in Washington, as soon as he joined a line it's effectiveness took a hit.

He went to the Couturier-Read line when Downie went out and that line's overall effectiveness dropped. He went back to the Schenn-Simmonds line, replacing Hartnell and their play slipped, as well.
- Jsaquella

I know. I remember Berube using him on a line with G and Jake for a few shifts a game (This is when Raffl was on the top line) and for those few shifts, the team would either let in a goal or come close to allowing a goal.

He's the anti-raffl right now.