Why are we assuming this, suddenly?
- Giroux_Is_God

Bc the Bruins will get to the ECF in their sleep. And as long as Mez doesn't shatter his shoulder again.....we're good to go

Crosby averages 1.2 PPG in the playoffs, which is slightly higher than Giroux's playoff PPG average of 1.1.

So that's a wash.

Crosby's won a lot of big faceoffs, and saying that Giroux dominates in all three zones and Crosby doesn't play well in two of them is being absolutely blinded by orange glasses.

Claude Giroux is a helluva player, but Crosby is a better one.
- Jsaquella

That's your opinion and I respect it. I know I may be in the minority of people that would take Giroux over Crosby. You can make an argument for either player. I actually think Ovechkin is better than Crosby as well. That's why we debate. Nobody's wrong or right. It's just one's opinion vs another's.

How many of those points came in the Boston series last year? When hes getting pushed around, he backs down easily. He does play well in the playoffs. But not when he's being forced to adjust his game. Crosby only plays one way.
- TonyBazz

In his 7 years in the playoffs he has higher than a point per game player.
Last year he had 15 points in 14 games.
The Penguins as a team scored 4 goals in that series.

If you want to focus on that one series out of the 7 years he has been in the playoffs have at it.

Don[t get me wrong, Giroux is my favorite player..He has that element that Foppa had which is when you get him mad he gets better.

So I missed two (frank)ing good games in a row.

Caught the 1st today, and had to work after.


- flyer_nutter

so according to the bud light commercials you shouldn't watch any games so they keep playing well with as much as it sounds like you work that might happen anyway.
can you get replays out there?

I actually think Ovechkin is better than Crosby as well.
- TonyBazz

Is that based on Ovechkins -31 this year or never winning a cup?

That's your opinion and I respect it. I know I may be in the minority of people that would take Giroux over Crosby. You can make an argument for either player. I actually think Ovechkin is better than Crosby as well. That's why we debate. Nobody's wrong or right. It's just one's opinion vs another's.
- TonyBazz

Dude.

That's your opinion and I respect it. I know I may be in the minority of people that would take Giroux over Crosby. You can make an argument for either player. I actually think Ovechkin is better than Crosby as well. That's why we debate. Nobody's wrong or right. It's just one's opinion vs another's.
- TonyBazz

Oh my sweet baby jayzis lawd

No no no. I just sat there and explained that if your only argument is that Crosby has more points than Giroux, then you should look at Giroux's numbers since December 11. I think Giroux is better because his numbers are close to Crosby's and Giroux's all around game is astronomically better than Crosby's. That's what seperates the two.
- TonyBazz

okay. now this wouldnt necessarily be my argument of choice to go about with it, but if this is what you are going with i will bite. the very notion of how sample sizes work make this a strained argument.

and how is Giroux's all around game astronomically better? you lead with faceoffs. stats say otherwise. you said dominates the PP. crosby puts up more pp points. i will concede PK. but ill also contend crosby really doesnt play PK, because 1. it would be an ineffective use of his minutes for the team. and 2. the pens have a top ranked PK without him.

That's your opinion and I respect it. I know I may be in the minority of people that would take Giroux over Crosby. You can make an argument for either player. I actually think Ovechkin is better than Crosby as well. That's why we debate. Nobody's wrong or right. It's just one's opinion vs another's.
- TonyBazz

i apologize for being a smart ass, as based on this post i mistook a tone in the prior one that wasnt there. youre right. everyone is entitled to their opinions. i just usually like people that declare them so adamantly to have some sort of reason to back them up.

That's your opinion and I respect it. I know I may be in the minority of people that would take Giroux over Crosby. You can make an argument for either player. I actually think Ovechkin is better than Crosby as well. That's why we debate. Nobody's wrong or right. It's just one's opinion vs another's.
- TonyBazz

I'm simply saying that your arguments are invalid.

Stats-wise, its easy to see that Crosby scores more, both in the regular season and in the playoffs, which makes that part of the discussion irrelevant.

But to say that Giroux is "dominant" in all three zones...just doesn't hold water. The biggest criticism of Giroux is that he doesn't always put in the effort defensively, and it's a very valid criticism.

He's had lazy back checks, including several this season, that led to goals against. Jonathan Toews is a guy that dominates in all three zones. Neither Giroux or Crosby compare to his all around game on a consistent basis.

Both Giroux and Crosby can be highly effective two way players. It seems to take a rivalry like the Flyers-Pens to bring it out in Giroux, because he has been a whirling dervish the last two games, in all three zones.

In fact, if Giroux's two way game was consistently as good as it has been the last two games, I'd probably have him ahead of Toews. But it's not.

As for Ovechkin being better than Crosby...I'd rather have Phil Kessel than Ovechkin. He's a one trick pony at this point of his career, and both Giroux AND Crosby are better in playoffs than Ovie

How many of those points came in the Boston series last year? When hes getting pushed around, he backs down easily. He does play well in the playoffs. But not when he's being forced to adjust his game. Crosby only plays one way.
- TonyBazz

yeah. boston was a rough series. but okay, how about after the year you guys trounced the pens and played the devils. that wasnt exactly a shining set of games for giroux. it happens. even to the best of them.

I'm simply saying that your arguments are invalid.

Stats-wise, its easy to see that Crosby scores more, both in the regular season and in the playoffs, which makes that part of the discussion irrelevant.

But to say that Giroux is "dominant" in all three zones...just doesn't hold water. The biggest criticism of Giroux is that he doesn't always put in the effort defensively, and it's a very valid criticism.

He's had lazy back checks, including several this season, that led to goals against. Jonathan Toews is a guy that dominates in all three zones. Neither Giroux or Crosby compare to his all around game on a consistent basis.

Both Giroux and Crosby can be highly effective two way players. It seems to take a rivalry like the Flyers-Pens to bring it out in Giroux, because he has been a whirling dervish the last two games, in all three zones.

In fact, if Giroux's two way game was consistently as good as it has been the last two games, I'd probably have him ahead of Toews. But it's not.
- Jsaquella

How many Guinesses tonight for you?
- Just5

i haven't had one in a LONG time but i think the plural of guiness is guiness

yeah. boston was a rough series. but okay, how about after the year you guys trounced the pens and played the devils. that wasnt exactly a shining set of games for giroux. it happens. even to the best of them.
- stayinthefnnet

Giroux had three points in 4 games...of course, he was suspended for game five, so...er, ah

technically his argument is valid, it's just that the conclusion he draws from his premises is not substantiated

I'm simply saying that your arguments are invalid.

Stats-wise, its easy to see that Crosby scores more, both in the regular season and in the playoffs, which makes that part of the discussion irrelevant.

But to say that Giroux is "dominant" in all three zones...just doesn't hold water. The biggest criticism of Giroux is that he doesn't always put in the effort defensively, and it's a very valid criticism.

He's had lazy back checks, including several this season, that led to goals against. Jonathan Toews is a guy that dominates in all three zones. Neither Giroux or Crosby compare to his all around game on a consistent basis.

Both Giroux and Crosby can be highly effective two way players. It seems to take a rivalry like the Flyers-Pens to bring it out in Giroux, because he has been a whirling dervish the last two games, in all three zones.

In fact, if Giroux's two way game was consistently as good as it has been the last two games, I'd probably have him ahead of Toews. But it's not.

As for Ovechkin being better than Crosby...I'd rather have Phil Kessel than Ovechkin. He's a one trick pony at this point of his career, and both Giroux AND Crosby are better in playoffs than Ovie
- Jsaquella

I think homer has done a fairly nice job.

The only trade he really got fleeced on was the JVR/Schenn deal IMO.

On the flip side... the Carts/Richie deals were fantastic. Acquiring Mason for Leighton and a 3rd was solid. Those are probably his best work.

I like that FAs 'want' to come to Philly and the sales job Homer does there --- Matt Read, Shea Weber, Vinny Lecavalier, Mark Streit, Jaromir Jagr, to name a few. I actually like the VL and Streit signings even though VL has really struggled. I like that Homer's been more patient than me with developing the young guys (Schenn, Simmonds, Coots, Jake, etc). I like the aggressiveness to solve problems (Bryz trade, Weber OS, Parise/Suter FA) and the prompt redirect when things are not working well (i.e. Bryz CBO, Lavy Firing after 3 games). I like his recent contracts (Giroux, Simmonds, Jake, Coots, etc) and how they have been cap manageable. Give it a couple years and the Hartsy, VL, Streit contracts will all look quite nice.

His overall work is pretty good imo and I do think this team is headed in the right direction which is ultimately most important to me.

An interesting thing to me is the perception of GMs around the league. Its so easy for them to be a goat until their team goes to the SCF and then that same goat a season ago is all of a sudden a genious. Look no further than Dean Lombardi and Stan Bowman. Lombardi got lambasted for not trading quick so bernier could get the nod. quick goes on to win them the SC. Lombardi is a genious for being patient. Bowman after winning a SC w/ Tallon's team in 2010 then dismantled it with bad trades, made very few moves the following couple seasons while hording all his prospects, and then after two embarrassing playoff outs and a fan base wanting his head on a spike - goes on to win another SC last year. now hes the GM everyone wants running their team. If homer and the flyers made a deep run this season I guarantee everyone will be saying homer is the best thing since sliced bread. Funny - but its true.
- moylander

Let's not forget his work after the horrific 06-07 season. Zhitnik for Coburn was a fleecing - and the acquisitions of Timonen and Hartnell were fantastic.

Giroux had three points in 4 games...of course, he was suspended for game five, so...er, ah
- Jsaquella

really? i didnt even think he put in that many. he certainly seemed hemmed in and frustrated. granted, thats usually what happens when most teams play the devils.

so according to the bud light commercials you shouldn't watch any games so they keep playing well with as much as it sounds like you work that might happen anyway.
can you get replays out there?
- hogweed

I missed essentially most of February with practicum. Enjoyed my two weeks off and got a little too party happy.

Back in school for a month, and get to see them more.

Replays, I don't know. I never was too into a game once I know the outcome.

technically his argument is valid, it's just that the conclusion he draws from his premises is not substantiated
- hogweed

Point taken.

Hey, I get his thought process. I love Giroux, too. When he was slumping I was here daily defending him and his deal, and expecting him to rebound.

He's an elite level player and he's capable of being even better than he has been over the last four years or so. I just don't see me taking him before Crosby or Toews.

The only trade he really got fleeced on was the JVR/Schenn deal IMO.
- moylander

Upshall and a 2nd for Carcillo? 1st-round pick (Carlson) for Steve Eminger?

There's things I like about Homer -- namely his ability to identify talent, and his commitment to playing and rewarding his young players -- but there are also plenty of things that he could do much better.

He is as liable to make a genius move as he is to making a boneheaded gaffe, and I think the sum total of that balance lands him somewhere in the middle of the pack with respect to his peers.

really? i didnt even think he put in that many. he certainly seemed hemmed in and frustrated. granted, thats usually what happens when most teams play the devils.
- stayinthefnnet

i went back and double checked. He had 2 goals & 1 assist.

I missed essentially most of February with practicum. Enjoyed my two weeks off and got a little too party happy.

Back in school for a month, and get to see them more.

Replays, I don't know. I never was too into a game once I know the outcome.
- flyer_nutter

i missed the first two periods yesterday and caught the third. the replay came on about 30 minutes later and i watched per 1 & 2 just so i could see them score.

Let's not forget his work after the horrific 06-07 season. Zhitnik for Coburn was a fleecing - and the acquisitions of Timonen and Hartnell were fantastic.
- BoomGoesTheCoburn

The one thing I will give him with this crew, is they have heart. They may lack in other areas, but its hard to doubt that inner mojo.

Jekyl and Hyde, but when they are on. Hell of a lot of fun to watch. Even if it is highlights some nights

Point taken.

Hey, I get his thought process. I love Giroux, too. When he was slumping I was here daily defending him and his deal, and expecting him to rebound.

He's an elite level player and he's capable of being even better than he has been over the last four years or so. I just don't see me taking him before Crosby or Toews.
- Jsaquella

i agree with this.

i went back and double checked. He had 2 goals & 1 assist.
- Jsaquella

that may be the most frustrating series i can remember for a while