Super-star....mmmmmm debatable, I'd say star players. Boston didn't win with a super-star, but rather some star players, like Chara, and great depth. I guess it really depends on a persons subjective opinion of what a super-star is.

Building a winning Cup team is a product of drafting, trading and free agent signings. Gillis has thus far proven he's only good at the later.
- LeftCoaster

I know we won't know for a few years, but what happens if some of the Jensen, Gaunce, Shink, Horvat, Cassels, Corrado turn out to be good players. Would history be kinder to Gillis?

I know we won't know for a few years, but what happens if some of the Jensen, Gaunce, Shink, Horvat, Cassels, Corrado turn out to be good players. Would history be kinder to Gillis?
- bazz

IMO MGs issue has been his contracts that he hands out.

IMO MGs issue has been his contracts that he hands out.
- VANTEL

That is the precise reason we are franked.

Ott and Car winning

Every seems to blame Torts but lately the team is scoring with one line. The Canucks scoring have been an issue for years now. Having the proper players to me is more the reason.

Our first line has a sniper passer and a digger, and now we have success. That is why I was pushing hard for Simmonds last year even when people here were laughing.

If you go back to Sedin Sedin Burrows or Sedin Sedin Jensen ,the scoring will dry up again.
- VANTEL

What if during all these years, the twins we're played wrong. They looked great together, but they are similar players. Even though Daniel has had a forty goal season, I've never felt he was a natural sniper. Maybe he was better than Henrik, but not a pure blooded goal scorer. Maybe if the Sedins were drafted to different teams, Daniel would have developed into more of a passing winger. Following your passer, digger, shooter plan, maybe the best option going forward is to permanently have them play on different lines.

That is the precise reason we are franked.
- Grumpy13

That's right but his drafting has been ok.

What if during all these years, the twins we're played wrong. They looked great together, but they are similar players. Even though Daniel has had a forty goal season, I've never felt he was a natural sniper. Maybe he was better than Henrik, but not a pure blooded goal scorer. Maybe if the Sedins were drafted to different teams, Daniel would have developed into more of a passing winger. Following your passer, digger, shooter plan, maybe the best option going forward is to permanently have them play on different lines.
- bazz

That draft was one of the weakest in league history , so we may have got the two best players at the time but I am not a fan of having them together.

I would give Torts one more year with a better line up and see how he does.
- VANTEL

No!

I know we won't know for a few years, but what happens if some of the Jensen, Gaunce, Shink, Horvat, Cassels, Corrado turn out to be good players. Would history be kinder to Gillis?
- bazz

Don't hold your breath but probably yes.

Well in all fairness he has been doing this for a couple years and Steve Y just jumped in with zero expereince and has done a pretty damn good job.

Oh hell, Wtf does it even matter? We are the Canucks. No matter what we do, We'll never win the big game and Everything Our franchise touches turn to sh!t.

Cheers to another 40 years of mediocrity, Goalie Carousels and Horrible GM's.

Should be fun.
- vancity787

Stevie Y learned for Ken Holland... for several years and then after he had gotten the requisite apprenticeship training decided to be a GM for the Lightning... he had a great model to work from.

I've stated this before but the true parallel I see for us is in none of those teams but you mention above, but rather the San Jose Sharks. Thornton, Marleau, Boyle, these guys are 30 something vets that have been transitioned to 2nd line duties (and more importantly facing 2nd D pairing opposition) while a mix of Couture, Pavelski, and Burns, along with the odd rookie like Hertl or Nieto have taken over 1st line duties. This is a team that's won President's trophies, drafted as late as we have been, and yet have been able to draft and develop (Couture, Pavelski), trade (Burns), and sign FAs (Stuart, Niemi, Torres) well enough to stay competitive.

If a Kesler and Edler trade(s) can net us two young top 6ers that could soon take over 1st line duties and this organization develops Kassian and Jensen properly, we could turn the tide real quick here.
- AlexF

That's a great point but I just don't think the Sedins can be as effective as Thornton and Marleau have been. Maybe if they get of the 2nd line matchups you speak of. San Jose has done a great job re-tooling of the fly, I'm just not sure if I have the confidence in our staff to do the same.

No!
- LeftCoaster

I didn't like AV but he is proving in NY he can be effective . Torts is having the same results with this bunch of misfits. Somewhere you have to start blaming the players.

Torts rewards players that produce and he does give the youth a chance. I know he has his faults but I blame the roster more than anything.

I didn't like AV but he is proving in NY he can be effective . Torts is having the same results with this bunch of misfits. Somewhere you have to start blaming the players.

Torts rewards players that produce and he does give the youth a chance. I know he has his faults but I blame the roster more than anything.
- VANTEL

I think you're totally off base, the collapse of our offensive players is directly attributed to JT and his methods/systems.

I didn't like AV but he is proving in NY he can be effective . Torts is having the same results with this bunch of misfits. Somewhere you have to start blaming the players.

Torts rewards players that produce and he does give the youth a chance. I know he has his faults but I blame the roster more than anything.
- VANTEL

There's plenty of blame to go around, mostly of it falls on FA, Gillis, Torts and the Canucks dressing room leadership.

Since Yeti deleted my last response....



So you dont want to be like Edmonton or Calgary? You would rather be like Pittsburgh? The team that drafted top 5 for 5 consecutive years? 2-1st overalls, 2-2nd overalls (one being Malkin) and a 5th overall? Yeah that is SOOOOO much better than Edmonton...

Or Chicago? the team that drafted 3rd overall, 7th, 3rd (Toews), 1st, then 11th overall? When they already had Keith and Seabrooke in the system? Again....SOOOO much better than Edmonton or Calgary.
- Iggysbff

What are you getting at? Yes, I would rather the Canucks rebuild like Chicago then Edmonton. Canucks had two first rounders in a deep draft last year. I'm hoping they get the 6th pick this year. I want them to rebuild for the next few years and get two more top 5 picks which a chance at a lottery pick for top overall. Very similar to Chicago. Edmonton picked 1st overall 3 years in a row and then 7th. After having Eberle in the system. And now likely 2nd overall this year. Their rebuild is going great.

I think you're totally off base, the collapse of our offensive players is directly attributed to JT and his methods/systems.
- LeftCoaster

8 goals in 7 games against the Bruins says it is not Torts fault. How many did we get against LA in the playoffs?

When we were the high flying Canucks we had Bieksa Edler and Erhoff all had deadly shots and had close to 50 pts.. That dried up before Torts got here. Our back end is virtually useless. It is not big enough and strong enough to move players and most of them have the shot of a cream puff. What the hell happened to Bieksa's and Edlers shot? Garriison couldn't hit the ocean if he was standing 5 feet in front of it.Our back end plays positional hockey and covers a lot of faults.

Who is our guy that causes poop in front of the net?
How many goals did Booth have last year ?
You have said it yourself many times Higgins and Hansen are third liners yet they have been forced to play second and first line minutes?
Who is our fourth line? Who is Keslers line mates?

We knew before this season started this team had many holes. I refuse to blame the coach for that.

There's plenty of blame to go around, mostly of it falls on FA, Gillis, Torts and the Canucks dressing room leadership.
- DariusKnight

I agree you can't point the finger at one person. it needs a rebuild not a reset or a effin retool.

I just looked up the average age for the teams you listed,
SJ 28.2 yrs
CHI 28.2
ANA 28.0
VAN 27.6
COL 27.4
STL 27.2
LA 27.0
- A_SteamingLombardi

That's totally misleading

Let's talk current/future core players under 30 who have actually played in the NHL
SJ: Couture, Hertl, Pavelski, Vlasic, Nieto
Chi: Toews, Kane, Saad, Kruger, Hjalmarsson, Leddy
Ana: Getzlaf, Perry, Fowler, Silverberg, Lindholm, Bonino, Cogliano, Sbisa, etc
Van: Kesler, Edler (-30), Tanev, Kassian
Col: Duchene, Mackinnon, Landeskog, O'Reilly, E.Johnson, Barrie
St.L: Backes, Oshie, Pietrangelo, Shattenkirk, Sobotka, Schwartz, Tarasenko, etc
LA: Kopitar, Doughty, Voynov, Toffoli, Carter, Richards, Quick,

You tell me which team you'll take last. Our core is clearly past their prime. We can carry on the same path or get the inevitable started.

8 goals in 7 games against the Bruins says it is not Torts fault. How many did we get against LA in the playoffs?

When we were the high flying Canucks we had Bieksa Edler and Erhoff all had deadly shots and had close to 50 pts.. That dried up before Torts got here. Our back end is virtually useless. It is not big enough and strong enough to move players and most of them have the shot of a cream puff. What the hell happened to Bieksa's and Edlers shot? Garriison couldn't hit the ocean if he was standing 5 feet in front of it.Our back end plays positional hockey and covers a lot of faults.

Who is our guy that causes poop in front of the net?
How many goals did Booth have last year ?
You have said it yourself many times Higgins and Hansen are third liners yet they have been forced to play second and first line minutes?
Who is our fourth line? Who is Keslers line mates?

We knew before this season started this team had many holes. I refuse to blame the coach for that.
- VANTEL

For one thing you're comparing playoff scoring to regular season, two you're forgetting Hank has 27 pts in his last 34 playoff games & Daniel has 25 pts in his last 29 playoff games, three it's not the twins fault Mike Gillis hasn't provided a second line for the past three years so all that another team has to do is check the twins in the playoffs and the Canucks are (frank)ed.

You're also negating the fact last year was a half year not a normal year, yet the twins were still on pace for a 70 to 80 point year. Torts way over-used them in the beginning of the year and killed their legs. Their minutes need to be managed like AV did, they're offensive players who've never been great skaters.

Last year Garrison had a great year, he was way better defensively and a +18. Edler had 22 pts in 45 gms, that's ~ a 40 pt year. The defence is playing a chip and chase, they're built for puck possession.

The whole team didn't just get bad all of a sudden, this is their systems play, the fact GMMG hasn't provided any top six players just compounded the issues.

Gillis and Torts both need to go.

Smoke and mirrors. MG still runs the show and Nazzy is the deflection.
- VANTEL

THIS.

For one thing you're comparing playoff scoring to regular season, two you're forgetting Hank has 27 pts in his last 34 playoff games & Daniel has 25 pts in his last 29 playoff games, three it's not the twins fault Mike Gillis hasn't provided a second line for the past three years so all that another team has to do is check the twins in the playoffs and the Canucks are (frank)ed.

You're also negating the fact last year was a half year not a normal year, yet the twins were still on pace for a 70 to 80 point year. Torts way over-used them in the beginning of the year and killed their legs. Their minutes need to be managed like AV did, they're offensive players who've never been great skaters.

Last year Garrison had a great year, he was way better defensively and a +18. Edler had 22 pts in 45 gms, that's ~ a 40 pt year. The defence is playing a chip and chase, they're built for puck possession.

The whole team didn't just get bad all of a sudden, this is their systems play, the fact GMMG hasn't provided any top six players just compounded the issues.

Gillis and Torts both need to go.
- LeftCoaster

Do you think FA will pay 16 mil to fire both of them and 4 more to buy out Booth?

Do you think FA will pay 16 mil to fire both of them and 4 more to buy out Booth?
- VANTEL

I know what I want him to do

Gillis is in tight with the ownership I'm thinking, Torts will be the fall guy hopefully. His careless selfish walk into the Flames dressing room started this mess. Playing the twins an extra five minutes a night at the ages of 33 tired them out badly, when you get tired you tend to get injured. Trust me I know.

I know what I want him to do

Gillis is in tight with the ownership I'm thinking, Torts will be the fall guy hopefully. His careless selfish walk into the Flames dressing room started this mess. Playing the twins an extra five minutes a night at the ages of 33 tired them out badly, when you get tired you tend to get injured. Trust me I know.
- LeftCoaster

I agree he overplayed him and Kesler but who else could he play? Half this team belongs in the AHL . That falls on Gillis . Since Gillis has been here he has taken the teams to the playoffs every year ,two PT a SCF and merchandise has now hit a gazillion dollars. I doubt MG. Gets fired and apparently FA loves Torts.

Thus bring in the loveable Naslund to deflect the hate for two years as the young players develop.

I think Booth is the only one who gets let go. I know if it was my money I would keep status quo.

I agree he overplayed him and Kesler but who else could he play? Half this team belongs in the AHL . That falls on Gillis . Since Gillis has been here he has taken the teams to the playoffs every year ,two PT a SCF and merchandise has now hit a gazillion dollars. I doubt MG. Gets fired and apparently FA loves Torts.

Thus bring in the loveable Naslund to deflect the hate for two years as the young players develop.

I think Booth is the only one who gets let go. I know if it was my money I would keep status quo.
- VANTEL

It's really a combination of both, that said, if GMMG is on board with trading Kesler that's gonna help the team become more balanced. Providing he gets a good you center coming back our way.

Torts HAS to manage the roster better though, the Western Conference is not like the East regarding travel and managing minutes. The team is really not built for his coaching style. Gulutzan would be better IMO.

It's really a combination of both, that said, if GMMG is on board with trading Kesler that's gonna help the team become more balanced. Providing he gets a good you center coming back our way.

Torts HAS to manage the roster better though, the Western Conference is not like the East regarding travel and managing minutes. The team is really not built for his coaching style. Gulutzan would be better IMO.
- LeftCoaster

Torts will learn.

Don't be surprised if Gillis thinks Bo will be Kes's replacement. I heard an interview about three weeks ago suggesting Bo to be second line center.