I really love the idea of Raffl playing with Schenn and Simmonds. They are better with both his puck possession and his speed.
He fits better on that line then with Couturier and Read.

Also Vinnie lately has been scoring goals when he is the 4th line center.
I know his goal last night was when the lines were scrambled up after a PK but he makes that 4th line relevant. They had some good shifts. Granted against Buffalo and their AHL guys.
- Marc D

I agree with it all

Sure, but most NHL players aren't intimidated. If they think they can get a player off his game by taking physical liberties with a player, they'll do it. Any enforcer is not going to stop that.
- MJL

I disagree. Remember the Boyle/Carkner incident from a 11/12? In Game 1, Ottawa was so weak that Boyle was literally swinging away on Karlsson all game long. He'd just skate up to him when the ref wasn't looking and just punch him in the face.

In Game 2, Matt Carkner went out on the ice, and put a beating on Carkner. Boyle decided not to go after Karlsson again. Had Carkner been in Game 1, Boyle might hit Karlsson once, if that, but that would be it.

I think this is only because of the instigator rule. We will agree to disagree on the rest.
- MBFlyerfan

That rule is definitely a part of it. But it was the same way before the rule was instigated.

You make my point. Did having Dave Schultz in the lineup prevent Clarke from being high sticked in the first place? No, and other teams targeted Clarke physically. All an enforcer can do in any era is respond to something happening. And an enforcer is on the roster, for certain situations where they think a game could get a little out of hand, due to past incidents and bad blood between teaams that could escalate. Rather then have somebody else have to stand up and take on a Colton Orr of John Scott.

Enforcers cannot, and never have prevented players from being cheapshotted.
- MJL

just not true.

Understandable. But if the 2nd line doesn't produce offensively in the playoffs, that will generate plenty of criticism towards that line. A 2nd line is not a line you want to play like it's a checking line. It's needs to produce offensively at ES.

The combination of Schenn Simmonds and Lecavalier in the middle, is not a failed experiment. They played well in the beginning of the Season.
- MJL

Define "well." I don't think anyone on the team played "well" besides Mason until about December.

I disagree. Remember the Boyle/Carkner incident from a 11/12? In Game 1, Ottawa was so weak that Boyle was literally swinging away on Karlsson all game long. He'd just skate up to him when the ref wasn't looking and just punch him in the face.

In Game 2, Matt Carkner went out on the ice, and put a beating on Carkner. Had Carkner been in Game 1, Boyle might hit Karlsson once, if that, but that would be it.
- jmatchett383

Might have being the key word. Enforcers don't deter players from taking liberties.

Sadly for Buffalo, it's coming close to that.
- jmatchett383

They basically did have do that after the Miller trade

http://www.cbssports.com/...e-after-ryan-miller-trade

Define "well." I don't think anyone on the team played "well" besides Mason until about December.
- jmatchett383

Lecavalier scored at a 33 goal pace in the first 25 games of the Season.

Might have being the key word. Enforcers don't deter players from taking liberties.
- MJL

But that was my point. When Carkner was out of the lineup, he did take liberties. When Carkner was in the lineup (even after having been ejected), he was able to prevent it from happening. Please tell me why you think Boyle didn't continue to do it after Game 1.

I agree, Downie will likely be added to the lineup tomorrow because of Rinaldo's impending suspension. I'm not a fan of VDV, he's not an NHL player.
- PLindbergh31

Well if Rinaldo is out their options for the 4th line are pretty limited: Rosehill, VDV, McGinn, Holmstrom; pick your poison.

Rinaldo's inability to avoid stupid penalties like last night is a primary reason that people argue that the Flyers need a better and more effective 4th line.

Not surprised that you have a nit to pick. Glad you got your argument out of the way early, now you can be on stand by for CBA questions, which is really the sole use you have.
- Jsaquella

Standing by as well...

Understandable. But if the 2nd line doesn't produce offensively in the playoffs, that will generate plenty of criticism towards that line. A 2nd line is not a line you want to play like it's a checking line. It's needs to produce offensively at ES.

The combination of Schenn Simmonds and Lecavalier in the middle, is not a failed experiment. They played well in the beginning of the Season.
- MJL

Schenn and Simmonds have plenty of offensive talent. Raffl isn't a guy without skill. He averages a point every 38 minutes of ice time. Read averages a point every 35 minutes of ice time.

That whole "woe is me" routine from Rinaldo during the post-game was appalling.

Lecavalier scored at a 33 goal pace in the first 25 games of the Season.
- MJL

And you think that was sustainable production that will be recreated in the present? Do you want to base Claude Giroux's expected production over his first 25 games as well?

Happy Rinaldo Day everybody !

That whole "woe is me" routine from Rinaldo during the post-game was appalling.
- countreeman28

Agreed. I would have liked it if he said, "You know, I didn't mean to do it, and I crossed the line."

But, then again, how often do you see a player or coach do that?

And you think that was sustainable production that will be recreated in the present? Do you want to base Claude Giroux's expected production over his first 25 games as well?
- jmatchett383

He was shooting a high percentage. In fact, he's on pace to finish with his highest shooting percentage EVER. There is reason to believe, he's been lucky to even get to 19 goals.

If he were shooting a normal percentage, he'd have 14-16 goals right now.

Hey if Matt Cooke can clean up his game then anything is possible.
- jaumiller

Reformed Cooke is still a good defensive player and primary PK'er and able to finish off some plays.

Take Rinaldo off the tightrope and he's almost completely useless. If he's not launching his body at high-velocity, or pissing people off, he's not really impacting the game.

Happy Rinaldo Day everybody !
- -davies-

Thanks! It's been a while

You make my point. Did having Dave Schultz in the lineup prevent Clarke from being high sticked in the first place? No, and other teams targeted Clarke physically. All an enforcer can do in any era is respond to something happening. And an enforcer is on the roster, for certain situations where they think a game could get a little out of hand, due to past incidents and bad blood between teaams that could escalate. Rather then have somebody else have to stand up and take on a Colton Orr of John Scott.

Enforcers cannot, and never have prevented players from being cheapshotted.
- MJL

As usual you missed the point entirely as you seem to see everything as black or white. Sure cheap shots happen, and they've always happened. My POINT was that in the pre instigator/3rd man era, they happened with much less frequency. You can argue that if you want, but from 74-90 I attended over 500 Flyer games and watched hundreds more on TV so I'm pretty sure that my observations are correct.

But that was my point. When Carkner was out of the lineup, he did take liberties. When Carkner was in the lineup (even after having been ejected), he was able to prevent it from happening. Please tell me why you think Boyle didn't continue to do it after Game 1.
- jmatchett383

I think the bigger problem is that they never should have had to enforce the game. The nhl really needs to step up their game. With all the cameras on the ice we can see a hit from twelve different angles. But they really can't fine players for taking cheap shots behind the refs? I'm sure as he'll a player wouldn't slash a guy behind the pay is it cost him ten grand.

Well if Rinaldo is out their options for the 4th line are pretty limited: Rosehill, VDV, McGinn, Holmstrom; pick your poison.
- BiggE

Has Holmstrom even played an Nhl game this season?

Well if Rinaldo is out their options for the 4th line are pretty limited: Rosehill, VDV, McGinn, Holmstrom; pick your poison.
- BiggE

Yup.... Pretty much all drek. The best playoff lineup would be a healthy/disciplined Downie and a disciplined Rinaldo. Not sure if that is possible.

Reformed Cooke is still a good defensive player and primary PK'er and able to finish off some plays.

Take Rinaldo off the tightrope and he's almost completely useless. If he's not launching his body at high-velocity, he's not really impacting the game.
- Tomahawk

Pretty much. He's a player who's only effective when he's walking the line. He's never had any significant offensive production at any stage of his career. He is what he is, and sometimes, he's gonna burn you.

That whole "woe is me" routine from Rinaldo during the post-game was appalling.
- countreeman28

Better than saying it was an accident.

We don't know exactly what he meant, but I took it as him realizing he needs to settle down. "This always happens- I work and work and get rewarded, then I do something stupid". Not exactly woe is me. Getting suspended here after playing well and being rewarded might be exactly what he needs.