I love the Wikipedia already trolling Byslma post:

- Tomahawk

OUCH....

Mason

Coburn, Ghost, Morin, Hagg, Schenn

Giroux, Jake, Simmonds, Couts, Schenn, Read, Laughton, Raffl, Akeson
- PhillySportsGuy

You don't have to protect guys on their first contract in an expansion draft. Just try to pick three more defenders.

Doesn't include guys on ELCs, right?
- Feanor

There are usually some restrictions to who can be on the unprotected/protected lists... but for this exercise, let's just keep it simple.

Here's a fun (maybe) game... assuming you could only protect 1 goalie, 5 D, and 9F in the entire organization for the expansion draft, who would you protect?
- Tomahawk

Mason

Coburn
Schenn
Ghost
Morin
AndyMac

Giroux
Laughton
Voracek
Couturier
Read
Simmonds
Raffl
Schenn
Cousins/Akeson

Mason

Coburn
Schenn
Ghost
Morin
AndyMac

Giroux
Laughton
Voracek
Couturier
Read
Simmonds
Raffl
Schenn
Cousins/Akeson
- mochoson

I'd swap out Hagg for AMac -- I'll take the risk of failed potential over the AMac cap hit -- but other than that, that's how my list would look

No poop his posession numbers were off the charts, he replaced Kris Letang for most of the year. Any competent, top-4 defensemen could have done a similar job. Niskanen has always had offensive ability. The Penguins are a great possession team period.

In no way, shape or form is he a top pairing dman. AndyMac played the majority of the year on a putrid defensive team. His numbers didn't really change here, but to argue he didn't play well would be silly. He'll get acclimated. The Flyers aren't the best posession team as a whole. There is much room for improvement.
- mochoson

The Pens we're a negative possession team in the regular season in close 5v5 situations.

You don't have to protect guys on their first contract in an expansion draft. Just try to pick three more defenders.
- mayorofangrytown

He said the entire organization

The Pens we're a negative possession team in the regular season in close 5v5 situations.
- PhillySportsGuy

And they were the best possession team in the playoffs

He said the entire organization
- PhillySportsGuy

Making up the rules as you go I see. I don't want to have to protect kids who haven't seen a puck drop on NHL ice. So I'm not playing... so there.

What about Barry Trotz to the Pens? That seems like a good match
- PhillySportsGuy

Trotz is as overrated as they come. What's on his resume?

15 years in Nashville:

Missed playoffs 8 times
Eliminated in first round 5 times
Eliminated in second round twice

Who lasts 15 years winning 2 playoff series? That's insane.

And they were the best possession team in the playoffs
- mochoson

We're referencing the regular season as 13 games against 2 teams isn't as reliable as 82 against all teams.

Here's a fun (maybe) game... assuming you could only protect 1 goalie, 5 D, and 9F in the entire organization for the expansion draft, who would you protect?
- Tomahawk

Mason

Coburn Streit Morin Ghost ?Haag

G Jake Couts Read Simmer BSchenn Waffle Laughton ?Leier

had trouble with the 5th guy for D and the 9th forward

Making up the rules as you go I see. I don't want to have to protect kids who haven't seen a puck drop on NHL ice. So I'm not playing... so there.

- mayorofangrytown

Are you taking your ball and going home too?

Trotz is as overrated as they come. What's on his resume?

15 years in Nashville:

Missed playoffs 8 times
Eliminated in first round 5 times
Eliminated in second round twice

Who lasts 15 years winning 2 playoff series? That's insane.
- PLindbergh31

It's Nashville, they're more concerned about their trucks starting in the parking lot than winning playoff series.

The Pens we're a negative possession team in the regular season in close 5v5 situations.
- PhillySportsGuy

I think if you throw out this season's numbers for both of them, Niskanen's still more valuable, but I tend to agree with mochoson in that maybe it's not that wide of a gulf between the two at the end of the day.

Are you taking your ball and going home too?
- PhillySportsGuy

Yes, both of them.

Trotz is as overrated as they come. What's on his resume?

15 years in Nashville:

Missed playoffs 8 times
Eliminated in first round 5 times
Eliminated in second round twice

Who lasts 15 years winning 2 playoff series? That's insane.
- PLindbergh31

Well they started as an expansion team and haven't had much in terms of offensive talent. I don't recall them ever having top line talent.

I think if you throw out this season's numbers for both of them, Niskanen's still more valuable, but I tend to agree with mochoson in that maybe it's not that wide of a gulf between the two at the end of the day.
- Tomahawk

I think Niskanen is noticeably better. I think Niskanen is a #2 and MacDonald is a 3/4. Its not a huge gap, but there is a gap.

We're referencing the regular season as 13 games against 2 teams isn't as reliable as 82 against all teams.
- PhillySportsGuy

So not the 13 games that actually matter, the 82 games where only a fraction of them actually mattered?

Well they started as an expansion team and haven't had much in terms of offensive talent. I don't recall them ever having top line talent.
- PhillySportsGuy

Hartnell and Timmonen are both on their all time top 10 lists.

I think if you throw out this season's numbers for both of them, Niskanen's still more valuable, but I tend to agree with mochoson in that maybe it's not that wide of a gulf between the two at the end of the day.
- Tomahawk

It's not. For christ sakes, he was their 3rd pairing anchor up until this year when they needed somebody with a least competent offensive ability to replace Letangs minutes.

He filled in admirably, but his statistics are inflated because of who he got to play with. This shouldn't even be an argument.

My general point is he's not a 6 million dollar player, putting him in the same echelon as AndyMac; a very good, but by no means "elite" defender.

So not the 13 games that actually matter, the 82 games where only a fraction of them actually mattered?
- mochoson

Im not saying they don't matter. I just don't think a short playoff run is an accurate description of a player. Tbh, Niskanen played well in the playoffs anyway. He struggled over the last couple games against the Rangers though.

Every year, we see articles about how dangerous it is to sign playoff warriors from the year before. Guys like Bickel

Well they started as an expansion team and haven't had much in terms of offensive talent. I don't recall them ever having top line talent.
- PhillySportsGuy

I thought winning teams are built from the crease out? They have had stud dmen for years, and very solid goaltending.

Trotz is as overrated as they come. What's on his resume?

15 years in Nashville:

Missed playoffs 8 times
Eliminated in first round 5 times
Eliminated in second round twice

Who lasts 15 years winning 2 playoff series? That's insane.
- PLindbergh31

Making the playoffs essentially every other year with an internal cap as tight as the Preds is no small feat.

7 playoff births in 15 years on a cap strapped team like the Preds compared to 1 birth on a cap strap team like the Panthers in the same time period helps put it into perspective.

Not only is he not over-rated, he's probably one of the top-3 coaches in the world, which is why he lasted 15 years.

It's not. For christ sakes, he was their 3rd pairing anchor up until this year when they needed somebody with a least competent offensive ability to replace Letangs minutes.

He filled in admirably, but his statistics are inflated because of who he got to play with. This shouldn't even be an argument.

My general point is he's not a 6 million dollar player, putting him in the same echelon as AndyMac; a very good, but by no means "elite" defender.
- mochoson

Pens fans have watched him all year and most of them are advocating trading Letang and re-signing Niskanen