So is it pretty pointless now to trade their rights?

Carrying this over from the last thread. The talk of B.Pouliot pricing himself out of our plans because he was played in the cup finals (and played well) is true. I agree. We need to find the "next" guy like that and buy low. I really like Peter Mueller as a dark horse, zero risk candidate. Also, M. Foligno is another guy who I'd consider trading for at a low cost.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Kind lf like Scuds. Wins a cup here, gets paid in LA, wins a cup here, gets over paid again. Of the D men on the cup team I would put his contribution as #5, #4 tops for Pens D.

After reading this I think so. With more support and shorter passes I think the right decision becomes more clear and quickly
- dbell646

This is music to my ears. I think there will be many other benefactors other than just Letang.

Max Talbot was the most underrated loss in the past 5 years

His pregame ritual with Fleury, energy, and he was a team guy

1.7 million per looking like a steal

(I read his camp offered Shero 3 years 3.5 Total and Shero refused)
- TheGame316

STOP.... it still hurts

So is it pretty pointless now to trade their rights?
- drummer829

that window has passed

Each one of these I see, including several I have done, have cemented the fact that although most of these fantasy lineups do indeed improve the roster, I have yet to look at one and say "that's a cup team right there".

As I have said many times, this may be a 2-3 year mini-rebuild.
- 87_71_11_29

First, I think you are being a little pessimistic. The Penguins are still one of the elite teams in the Eastern Conference & were 2nd in the conference w/ the D being a mess due to injuries, Letang having a sub-par year, and losing Bennett and Dupuis from a shallow F group. If you can make the finals, then you have a shot (though against the studs in the W, it wouldn't be a great one). Just saying it isn't all doom an gloom over the roster that is in place right now.

Second, I also think its a bit of two-year project. This offseason & next the Penguins should be able to use a lot of their new Cap space for depth purposes. Crosby, Malkin, Neal, & Letang are all signed to deals that will be more and more Cap friendly as time goes on. W/ the new TV deal next offseason they could have an additional $12M/yr they didn't this season. You can get some serious depth for that amount.

We shouldn't lose sight of what the Penguins have and what they do not. Other than maybe the Bruins, not sure who has a better Cap situation going forward in the East. Montreal, maybe? But they have to pay Subban this offseason and who knows what that deal will look like? The NYR are going to lose some people and have to pay Brassard, Kreider, and Zucarello a bit of cash too. M. Staal, Haglin, and Stepan the next w/ St. Louis likely retiring then too.

that window has passed
- nelson911

I just don't understand how you can hold onto his rights, especially if he's considered the highest rated D man. If Boyle got a 5th, nisk could have easily gotten that or more

I just don't understand how you can hold onto his rights, especially if he's considered the highest rated D man. If Boyle got a 5th, nisk could have easily gotten that or more
- drummer829

I know.... Orpik and Niskanen are worth 4th picks or whatever... they probably didn't want to add to the media circus with the coaching search. Who knows, Orpik could still receive an offer from them

For the sake of discussion, is there a chance that Scuderi may not look nearly as bad under Johnston's system? He played for DB during the Cup run but than left LA right after. Any chance he less dumpster fire and more savy veteran?
- Incredible Malk

No. Johnston's proposed system is the targeted for guys exactly opposite of players like Scuderi.

No. Johnston's proposed system is the targeted for guys exactly opposite of players like Scuderi.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Yep.... ya know all those guys Shero drafted but Bylsma and him didn't want to play because of slugs like Engelland Orpik and Scuderi.... They can now be utilized.

Despres..... I still like this kids game.... just give him some confidence and he will make it hard not to play him in the top 4.

I just don't understand how you can hold onto his rights, especially if he's considered the highest rated D man. If Boyle got a 5th, nisk could have easily gotten that or more
- drummer829

Maybe nobody made an offer for his rights? You would have to imagine that most teams understand he'll be testing FA with lots of options. I think with a guy like Boyle, you have guy with less options heading into FA and the Isle thinks they may be able to tempt him with an over-payment.

I think Engo is getting phone calls because of his versatility. Someone is going to use him as a guy that can play some 4th line time and then pop back to defense if a D-man goes down or gets ejected or is called for a major or something rather than playing the rest of the game with only 5 D-men. He also has some hands playing down low and isn't afraid to go to the net when he's on offense.

He's a guy that I could definitely see the Pens re-signing, but only if he accepts that he's going to see 99% 4th line minutes and only see the blue line when crossing it or out of necessity.

I've never watched a full soccer game. It's incredible that your team is down by one, you finally get a quality chance and while doing so you take a bump in the nose. Team is still on attack and you're waving for a trainer and a timeout. Two minutes later you're playing again. Amazingly female dogy, whiny, selfish people.

For the sake of discussion, is there a chance that Scuderi may not look nearly as bad under Johnston's system? He played for DB during the Cup run but than left LA right after. Any chance he less dumpster fire and more savy veteran?
- Incredible Malk

I think there's a LOT of a chance. He didn't suck it up in LA and probably would have re-signed there had they not decided to bring up some of their youth as well. But under DB/Therrien in 09 and during the 4 years in LA, he played in a system that a least feigned as though it gave a flying fornication about preventing goals. Dan's system post-09 (and it got progressively worse every year since then) gave zero poops about the forwards backchecking to help out the defense.

I think Johnston's philosophy is a lot more pragmatic than Dan's was and will be a little more on the side of "possess the puck as much as you can. And when you don't have it, all 5 guys on the ice have the job of getting it back as quickly as possible" instead of Dan's where only 3 skaters (the 2 defensemen and 1 of the forwards) had any responsibility for regaining possession.

I've never watched a full soccer game. It's incredible that your team is down by one, you finally get a quality chance and while doing so you take a bump in the nose. Team is still on attack and you're waving for a trainer and a timeout. Two minutes later you're playing again. Amazingly female dogy, whiny, selfish people.
- Topshelf Mountain

If you don't like the Sport don't watch it. I love soccer. That doesn't mean I have to like some of the BS some players do on the pitch.

I'm brazilian but I really like Dempsey's style.

Btw I love hockey just as much and ser a lot of similarities between the Sports.

If you don't like the Sport don't watch it. I love soccer. That doesn't mean I have to like some of the BS some players do on the pitch.

I'm brazilian but I really like Dempsey's style.

Btw I love hockey just as much and ser a lot of similarities between the Sports.
- Orpik44

I decided to give it a try today. Probably not my sorta thing.

I agree about some similarities, so long as toughness isn't one of them. The stamina is impressive.

I decided to give it a try today. Probably not my sorta thing.

I agree about some similarities, so long as toughness isn't one of them. The stamina is impressive.
- Topshelf Mountain

Wanna hear one similarity? Crosby in the start of his carreer was accused of diving (and still is by some). Neymar (from Brazil) has amazing skills and I hate his Style because he likes to dive. But he's very very good and might be the best soon.

Americans, Congrats! You advanced to the 2nd round of the world cup.

First, I think you are being a little pessimistic. The Penguins are still one of the elite teams in the Eastern Conference & were 2nd in the conference w/ the D being a mess due to injuries, Letang having a sub-par year, and losing Bennett and Dupuis from a shallow F group. If you can make the finals, then you have a shot (though against the studs in the W, it wouldn't be a great one). Just saying it isn't all doom an gloom over the roster that is in place right now.

Second, I also think its a bit of two-year project. This offseason & next the Penguins should be able to use a lot of their new Cap space for depth purposes. Crosby, Malkin, Neal, & Letang are all signed to deals that will be more and more Cap friendly as time goes on. W/ the new TV deal next offseason they could have an additional $12M/yr they didn't this season. You can get some serious depth for that amount.

We shouldn't lose sight of what the Penguins have and what they do not. Other than maybe the Bruins, not sure who has a better Cap situation going forward in the East. Montreal, maybe? But they have to pay Subban this offseason and who knows what that deal will look like? The NYR are going to lose some people and have to pay Brassard, Kreider, and Zucarello a bit of cash too. M. Staal, Haglin, and Stepan the next w/ St. Louis likely retiring then too.
- s0rcerer1984

Good post back.

Yes I am indeed pessimistic but also a realist. Sometimes the two get confused.

Agree with your points on Pens cap situation moving forward. Next year at this time, I hope they are 1 or 2 players away from setting themselves up for Cup runs for the last 3-4 years of 87/71 primes. That's why I hope they don't do something stupid for short-term gain.

Next, look at the B's cap situation. Actually, they are in a world or hurt because they have to sign quite a few guys in the next little while and no way they are going to fit them all under the cap. That's why there is lots of talk on their board about moving different pieces.

I think you are spot on about the Habs. Even with PK's new deal, they have some nice pieces. They are 1-2 players away from being a serious contender. They have the goalie. They have the D stud. Depth at FW. Bit more size gets added, look out.

Americans, Congrats! You advanced to the 2nd round of the world cup.
- Orpik44

Yeah but their game was weak

Americans, Congrats! You advanced to the 2nd round of the world cup.
- Orpik44

Did not see that coming at all. Pretty impressive

Wanna hear one similarity? Crosby in the start of his carreer was accused of diving (and still is by some). Neymar (from Brazil) has amazing skills and I hate his Style because he likes to dive. But he's very very good and might be the best soon.
- Orpik44

Yeah I agree there's diving in hockey also, it was the one thing I couldn't stand about Lemieux. My specific problems with the game I just watched were the players acting like ref's and embellishing just about everything, and the one play where Jones for the U.S. stopped an offensive zone attack due to a bloody nose.
It was my first time watching and I'm not used to that behavior.

Yeah but their game was weak
- Ledgermain

BE HAPPY! Portugal and Ghana are OUT!

Coming from a person who understands the game: you've played against a Top 3 team today. You lost 1-0 and could have tied it.

I like the hard nosed american style. Wish you luck (beat Argentina!)

Maybe nobody made an offer for his rights? You would have to imagine that most teams understand he'll be testing FA with lots of options. I think with a guy like Boyle, you have guy with less options heading into FA and the Isle thinks they may be able to tempt him with an over-payment.
- madmike71

Not a whole lot of rights being moved, and Islanders in the recent past are the one team who seem to be active on that front.

With this free agent "talking" window, it is almost pointless to do. Maybe Rutherford just ran out of time with the coach search and everything. You figure once you trade someone's rights, you very likely aren't getting that player back. So, you need to be sure that you can't/won't sign him.

Good post back.

Yes I am indeed pessimistic but also a realist. Sometimes the two get confused.

Agree with your points on Pens cap situation moving forward. Next year at this time, I hope they are 1 or 2 players away from setting themselves up for Cup runs for the last 3-4 years of 87/71 primes. That's why I hope they don't do something stupid for short-term gain.

Next, look at the B's cap situation. Actually, they are in a world or hurt because they have to sign quite a few guys in the next little while and no way they are going to fit them all under the cap. That's why there is lots of talk on their board about moving different pieces.

I think you are spot on about the Habs. Even with PK's new deal, they have some nice pieces. They are 1-2 players away from being a serious contender. They have the goalie. They have the D stud. Depth at FW. Bit more size gets added, look out.
- 87_71_11_29

As far as up and coming teams, Tampa and Columbus are not far off. Both have excellent management and solid rosters and both are quickly climbing the Eastern ladder.