Gostisbehere, Laughton and Morin... the time for change is NOW!!!
- mayorofangrytown

- jmatchett383

Reaching for the handle to open the door to our future.

I think that's a serious possibility if our blueline doesn't change. If 44's play drops off or he gets hurt, gotta think AMac is a prime candidate to get the bump.
- BulliesPhan87

I do also. And that was part of the problem with MacDonald in NY. He's not a first pair shutdown defender. If the Flyers can much better as a team defensively, that will go a long way.

Reaching for the handle to open the door to our future.

- mayorofangrytown

Politics talk...it's on mother(frank)ers!

Politics talk...it's on mother(frank)ers!


- wolfhounds

I meant the Flyers future.

I do also. And that was part of the problem with MacDonald in NY. He's not a first pair shutdown defender. If the Flyers can much better as a team defensively, that will go a long way.
- MJL

If Amac improves his neutral zone gap control, he will be a much more effective player. One reason he was so good with Schenn is that Schenn almost always holds the blueline and where Amac stands in the defensive zone (three steps behind the line) is good for quick puck retrieval. Last year, forwards coming down Amac's side had a free three steps to get into the offensive zone.

No doubt it's possible, just like it's possible for Streit to get 50+ points on the Flyers' first PP unit, but not likely. Still, it could happen if everything clicks, and Ehrhoff will definitely be busting his ass to throw up a bunch of points because as a 32 year old, he's not going to take another 1 year deal but rather is going to look to cash in on this coming season's performance.

Why do you think Letang will miss time, the heart issue, or just random injuries?
- wolfhounds

Streit had 40 points last year while not playing on the Flyers 1st PP. If he gets regular (at least 60 games) 1st PP minutes Streit will get 50 points relatively easily.

The Flyers first unit will still be really good without Hartnell. They might be better if they have Vinny pulling the trigger on the Hartnell slot play.

Well, with Neal gone, they'll probably play Crosby on the right side...so that he can actually shoot the puck. That would help the PP immensely.
- jmatchett383

yeah. although i like malkin on the right side. its seldom been used anymore, but he has a bomb of a one timer. i like crosby roving on that side down lower. he can facilitate, but still be crafty for his tip ins/rebounds.

the madness of crosby/malkin up top must end. put ehrhoff there.

If Amac improves his neutral zone gap control, he will be a much more effective player. One reason he was so good with Schenn is that Schenn almost always holds the blueline and where Amac stands in the defensive zone (three steps behind the line) is good for quick puck retrieval. Last year, forwards coming down Amac's side had a free three steps to get into the offensive zone.
- aflyerpower8

I'm not really concerned about that, I think each player has his own style. MacDonald is not a physical player who is going to stand up players at the blueline. He's more of a containment type player.

I'm not really concerned about that, I think each player has his own style. MacDonald is not a physical player who is going to stand up players at the blueline. He's more of a containment type player.
- MJL

Timonen isn't physical but he challenges forwards and forces them to dump the puck in a lot more often. Allowing players to carry the puck in at such a high rate is what hurts Amacs production. The chances of allowing a scoring chance greatly increase when a player enters the offensive zone with possession of the puck

Timonen isn't physical but he challenges forwards and forces them to dump the puck in a lot more often. Allowing players to carry the puck in at such a high rate is what hurts Amacs production. The chances of allowing a scoring chance greatly increase when a player enters the offensive zone with possession of the puck
- PhillySportsGuy

I'm not saying that McDonald can't improve in any one area. I just don't think it's a big issue with his game. What's more important is if the right read is made or not. It's not a black and white issue where every defenseman can be compared. Each situation on the ice is different. What's more important is if the defenseman made the right read on a play. If he's outnumbered and doesn't have the back pressure support, then he has to back in. The zone entry stat doesn't tell that, it just blindly looks at what happened on a rush, and if the opposition entered the zone successfully, it's just blamed on the defenseman who happens to be on that side of the ice. Whether he made the right read or not.

Timonen isn't physical but he challenges forwards and forces them to dump the puck in a lot more often. Allowing players to carry the puck in at such a high rate is what hurts Amacs production. The chances of allowing a scoring chance greatly increase when a player enters the offensive zone with possession of the puck
- PhillySportsGuy

You'd think a guy with that kind of mobility to recover would pressure up more... could be gun shy from all that abuse he took on the Island. Or he just has bad habits.

You'd think a guy with that kind of mobility to recover would pressure up more... could be gun shy from all that abuse he took on the Island. Or he just has bad habits.
- Tomahawk

hes never going to be a super stud, but i still think he is a solid second pair guy. his versatility enables him to contribute on special teams, as well as help out luke schenn.

hes never going to be a super stud, but i still think he is a solid second pair guy. his versatility enables him to contribute on special teams, as well as help out luke schenn.
- stayinthefnnet

With games being basically won and lost at the blue lines, if AMac can't improve on that critical aspect, the rest of his contribution is rendered moot.

On the flip side, the single biggest reason why they could never afford to trade Coburn is that he's a beast at the blues, even though he doesn't play the PP and doesn't provide much O.

I'm not really concerned about that, I think each player has his own style. MacDonald is not a physical player who is going to stand up players at the blueline. He's more of a containment type player.
- MJL

He would be better at containing if he kept the gap close, so the other team needs to dump the puck (or at least slow down). He is a good enough skater that he shouldn't have to play so far back.

With games being basically won and lost at the blue lines, if AMac can't improve on that critical aspect, the rest of his contribution is rendered moot.

On the flip side, the single biggest reason why they could never afford to trade Coburn is that he's a beast at the blues, even though he doesn't play the PP and doesn't provide much O.
- Tomahawk

rendered moot seems a bit harsh to me.

rendered moot seems a bit harsh to me.
- stayinthefnnet

Not only harsh, but non sensical. And games aren't won and lost at the blueline. They're won and lost at the net.

Not only harsh, but non sensical. And games aren't won and lost at the blueline. They're won and lost at the net.
- MJL

If you can't get into the zone first, you won't be getting to the net.

If you can't get into the zone first, you won't be getting to the net.
- Tomahawk

Nonsense

If you can't get into the zone first, you won't be getting to the net.
- Tomahawk

You may be interested in this. I had a discussion for several minutes with Bill Clement about this topic a few months ago, specifically as relates to MacDonald.

Paraphrased slightly, Clement said, "People want the defensemen to stand everyone up at the blueline. Well, yeah, but when the other team attacks with speed through the neutral zone, the defensemen have no choice but to back in and try to contain. Gap control is everyone's responsibility. Actually, I really like MacDonald's positioning most of the time, and he makes a good first pass when he has to go back and retrieve the puck."

If you can't get into the zone first, you won't be getting to the net.
- Tomahawk

i understand. but even the best at standing up at their own blueline still are forced to play within their own zone from time to time.

if this wasnt the case, the game could simply be a competition between dumping and chasing it in.

once its there, you still have to do something with it.

again, this isnt disparaging the skill of preventing zone entries. its an invaluable one. but like everything else, it cant be viewed as simply an all or nothing evalution

I'm not saying that McDonald can't improve in any one area. I just don't think it's a big issue with his game. What's more important is if the right read is made or not. It's not a black and white issue where every defenseman can be compared. Each situation on the ice is different. What's more important is if the defenseman made the right read on a play. If he's outnumbered and doesn't have the back pressure support, then he has to back in. The zone entry stat doesn't tell that, it just blindly looks at what happened on a rush, and if the opposition entered the zone successfully, it's just blamed on the defenseman who happens to be on that side of the ice. Whether he made the right read or not.
- MJL

I think a big difference will be learning the system. He seemed just ok when he first arrived, but seem to settle in when he learned the system. The more he plays in this system the better he'll get.... Because to your point, the read will be easier.

He would be better at containing if he kept the gap close, so the other team needs to dump the puck (or at least slow down). He is a good enough skater that he shouldn't have to play so far back.
- aflyerpower8

But if he keeps the gaps closer, who retrieves the puck, Schenn on his moped?
I would be interested to see what kind of quality shots were generated from those who entered on Mac's side.
Did they gain the interior of the zone on his side, or was he able to contain them to the outside?

I think a big difference will be learning the system. He seemed just ok when he first arrived, but seem to settle in when he learned the system. The more he plays in this system the better he'll get.... Because to your point, the read will be easier.
- leon neon

I think the biggest problem with this team is that they, as a group, do not always commit to the system. When the forwards back check, every defenseman looks 100x better.

I'm not saying that McDonald can't improve in any one area. I just don't think it's a big issue with his game. What's more important is if the right read is made or not. It's not a black and white issue where every defenseman can be compared. Each situation on the ice is different. What's more important is if the defenseman made the right read on a play. If he's outnumbered and doesn't have the back pressure support, then he has to back in. The zone entry stat doesn't tell that, it just blindly looks at what happened on a rush, and if the opposition entered the zone successfully, it's just blamed on the defenseman who happens to be on that side of the ice. Whether he made the right read or not.
- MJL

The thing about statistics is they take this into account. Over a period of time (the season) there are hundreds of different situations where easy stops at the blue line get missed by a defender and usually just as many hard stops by the defender at the blue line where a good play is made.

So to disregard the stats completely just because you don't like how they quantified one play, one time is not a valid "discredit" to the stat.

I think MacDonald has played his whole career on a team that has been lackadaisical at best with puck support and back checking and that has severely hurt his confidence to step up on a play at the blue line. Hopefully this can be improved upon and he will not have to stand in the way of so many shot attempts next season.