Thanks for the spelling lesson. I am not really concerned about that, just getting opinions. But thanks! I missed both names by a letter so thanks for the shaming.
- crebar

Just thought it was going to be fun

I think this lineup is extremely strong if Kapenen could make it...

Kunitz - Crosby - Dupuis
Hornqvist - Malkin - Kapenen
Bennett - Sutter - Downie
Spalding - Goc - Comeau
Adams

Martin - Letang
Erhoff - Maata
Despres - Scudari
Bortozzo - Doumalin
Harrington - Pouliet

Fleury - Greiss
Zatkoff

Otherwise I think you have to look at Penner, Mueller, or Booth or to trade Martin or Sutter for a 1/2 line wing
- crebar

Martin for Neidereitter +4th (becomes a 2nd if Martin resigns or MIN makes it to the final 4) makes way too much sense for both teams. Thoughts?

One thing to keep in mind re Kapanen as it relates to his chances of sticking with the big club. Agreed that it will be harder for him to play against men with bigger size and skill compared to prospects camp... But playing with high end talent will also make him better IMO. Also speed can help compensate for a lack of relative size/strength.

One thing to keep in mind re Kapanen as it relates to his chances of sticking with the big club. Agreed that it will be harder for him to play against men with bigger size and skill compared to prospects camp... But playing with high end talent will also make him better IMO. Also speed can help compensate for a lack of relative size/strength.
- PENS FAN in CANADA

No matter how he looks coming out of camp, I would think that he'd at least see some AHL time to start the season. Has he ever played in a competitive game on NHL sized ice?

And we were worried about Maatta hitting the wall late in the season (he might have or the shoulder injury was the problem), but Maatta played a top pairing role in 78 OHL games on a top OHL team. Kapanen played 47 on a last place team in a Finnish pro league, where AHL castoffs and even his 41 year old dad put up better or comparable numbers. Let's pump the brakes on him being a full time top 6 NHL wing this season.

No matter how he looks coming out of camp, I would think that he'd at least see some AHL time to start the season. Has he ever played in a competitive game on NHL sized ice?

And we were worried about Maatta hitting the wall late in the season (he might have or the shoulder injury was the problem), but Maatta played a top pairing role in 78 OHL games on a top OHL team. Kapanen played 47 on a last place team in a Finnish pro league, where AHL castoffs and even his 41 year old dad put up better or comparable numbers. Let's pump the brakes on him being a full time top 6 NHL wing this season.
- rival22

Agreed. The original assessment of 1-2 years away by Rutherford et al seems to be appropriate. I like my idea of trading Martin for Neidereiter...saves cap space and helps out our top 6 with a young gritty forward. MIN gets some much needed D help...I think Martin can pair well with Suter, or be a solid #3.

See my thing is that having Stemp in the lineup would tempt the staff to play him in the top 6 and keep Bennett down on the third line. I think that during this season it is imperative to give Bennett significant top 6 minutes to see if he actually is a potential answer moving forward. Keeping him on the third line (if he proves he can produce and play a high level of hockey) is detrimental to his development and we will never be able to answer the BB question of whether or not he's Crosby's (or Geno's) right winger of the future.

I would also much rather have a healthy Duper on Crosby's wing than Stemp, so I wouldn't be for signing him and moving Dupuis down. I just don't know, I think our bottom 6 is strong enough now that we don't really need Stempniak, and having him on the roster will just make lineup decisions confusing.
- Victoro311

You raise a good point man. When I first saw what Stemp signed for I just jumped to the conclusion that he would be great depth and value at that price. I wouldn't want him in the top 6 though. Which means he would bump up Dupuis/Downie/Spaling/etc to the top 6....which I don't think is the answer.

See my thing is that having Stemp in the lineup would tempt the staff to play him in the top 6 and keep Bennett down on the third line. I think that during this season it is imperative to give Bennett significant top 6 minutes to see if he actually is a potential answer moving forward. Keeping him on the third line (if he proves he can produce and play a high level of hockey) is detrimental to his development and we will never be able to answer the BB question of whether or not he's Crosby's (or Geno's) right winger of the future.

I would also much rather have a healthy Duper on Crosby's wing than Stemp, so I wouldn't be for signing him and moving Dupuis down. I just don't know, I think our bottom 6 is strong enough now that we don't really need Stempniak, and having him on the roster will just make lineup decisions confusing.
- Victoro311

1st line, 3rd line, dont matter. He'll have broken one or both his wrists by game 10.

One thing to keep in mind re Kapanen as it relates to his chances of sticking with the big club. Agreed that it will be harder for him to play against men with bigger size and skill compared to prospects camp... But playing with high end talent will also make him better IMO. Also speed can help compensate for a lack of relative size/strength.
- PENS FAN in CANADA

If Kasper the friendly ghost CAN make some miracle move and play this year..does he play top 6? Here's why I ask -- He's a top 6 winger. His game is not suited for bottom 6..so he can't really be "brought along slowly to the top 6 like Bennett was". Could we trust a young inexperienced kid on Sids wing? Playing against top NHL competition? That's why I'm leaning towards him not ready for the NHL this season.

Martin for Neidereitter +4th (becomes a 2nd if Martin resigns or MIN makes it to the final 4) makes way too much sense for both teams. Thoughts?
- mventres

Nino is a bit of a gamble, IMO. I would target Coyle. But either could succeed here with Sid or Geno. I would do it if management is comfortable with Dumo/Pouliot/Harrington holding down a roster spot in the bottom pairing.

I'm still not convinced Min would do the deal though.

You raise a good point man. When I first saw what Stemp signed for I just jumped to the conclusion that he would be great depth and value at that price. I wouldn't want him in the top 6 though. Which means he would bump up Dupuis/Downie/Spaling/etc to the top 6....which I don't think is the answer.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

I don't know... I look at him as the perfect cheap cost player to fill in IF Dupius isn't cutting it, or Bennett gets hurt. Hes more suited to the top 2 lines then any of the other bottom 6 players we have, since hes played a decent amount of time with them last season.

And with him on the 3rd line, yes, it does bump down someone who we either just signed on, or knock away a younger player's chance... but still, for that cost, who can't argue against it? Maybe even use his signing to try and package a deal with even less return for some of our players for a top 6 winger that we know can already perform (I know this is horrid to say, but with Stemp signed, package Sutter and Bennett for a top 6 winger in that scenario).

But of course, far too late for any of this to even try to happen, but just a passing thought.

Edit: In this scenario as well, I'd have preferably signed him for 2 or 3 years, between 1 and 1.5 mil each year. Still think thats a HUGE steal for him.

For a long time the WHL was considered the "Goon" league of the CHL. Even the guys who were drafted for their skill had to learn to play a rougher brand of hockey and overtime it evolved into a brand of physical two way hockey. It's why a lot of the top end guys who come from the WHL are guys like Getzlaf, E. Kane, and Milan Lucic.

Then the defensemen have to be guys who can handle those types of forwards so they started to develope your Shea Webers, Brent Seabrooks, even big Zdeno Chara spent time in the WHL.
- Ben37

Absolutely. The QMJHL always had the flashy French Canadiens and no defense/goaltending, while the OHL was a mix of the 2. It's pretty evened out now, but it still seems like WHL skaters are more of a safe b due to the relative size they need to handle.

Dea would definitely be one of the darkest of dark horses if he turns into something. Heard good things about Blaine Byron, Troy Josephs and Anton Zlobin as well. Then I realize these were all 5-7th rd draft picks and just assume they are guys that most likely will only look good in the minor leagues. It would be more than great if 1 of them turns into a useful pro player.

My darkhorse is Marcantuoni. He's probably the fastest guy in all of minor league hockey. I think you can coach him to be an effective bottom 6/PK player in the NHL.

First step is to see guys like Dea, Marcanuoni, Archibald, etc. have success at WBS.

I forget which article it was that talked about the WBS scoring leaders the last couple of years being Tom Kostopolous and Trevor Smith. Old guys, far from prospects.

But it wasn't just at the top of the leaderboard. WBS has depended on guys like that down their roster, from Ryan Craig to Bryan Lerg to Chuck Kobasew, it's been quite some time since a Penguins' forward prospect really had a ton of success at WBS. Sure, guys like Jeffrey and Letestu put up some nice numbers, but they were a bit older than the Penguins' current group of prospect. Really, you'd have to go back to Tangrandi.

First step is to see guys like Dea, Marcanuoni, Archibald, etc. have success at WBS.

I forget which article it was that talked about the WBS scoring leaders the last couple of years being Tom Kostopolous and Trevor Smith. Old guys, far from prospects.

But it wasn't just at the top of the leaderboard. WBS has depended on guys like that down their roster, from Ryan Craig to Bryan Lerg to Chuck Kobasew, it's been quite some time since a Penguins' forward prospect really had a ton of success at WBS. Sure, guys like Jeffrey and Letestu put up some nice numbers, but they were a bit older than the Penguins' current group of prospect. Really, you'd have to go back to Tangrandi.
- hardnosed

I realize that we were fully in win-now mode but it was so bad it was almost sad. I still don't quite get the love affair for NCAA hockey. Talent can come from anywhere but it just seems we are stocked full of mediocre college forwards. I'm excited for these new guys to get their shot in the AHL. That said, again, very few have top 6 potential. Also, besides Kapanen, they are longshots. I would like to infuse the NHL bottom 6 with these guys over the next few years. As the cap goes up, we can have plenty of youth on defense and bottom 6. That leaves a ton of money to shoot for the moon in the top 6 if we want to.

Interesting bit on Kapanen...especially the bolded part which I was unaware of...

"A final thought: Kapanen has a real shot to make this team out of training camp. More because of how thin the Pens are with their top-6 forwards, and the fact that he would have to go back to Finland if he doesn’t stick. He’s too young to play in the AHL (20 is the minimum), and he is not property of any Canadian junior team. My guess, the Penguins treat him the way they treated Olli Maatta last season. He’ll stick with the team out of camp for the first nine games, at which point GM Jim Rutherford will have to make a decision on keeping him or sending back to Finland. My gut says they keep him."

Interesting bit on Kapanen...especially the bolded part which I was unaware of...

"A final thought: Kapanen has a real shot to make this team out of training camp. More because of how thin the Pens are with their top-6 forwards, and the fact that he would have to go back to Finland if he doesn’t stick. He’s too young to play in the AHL (20 is the minimum), and he is not property of any Canadian junior team. My guess, the Penguins treat him the way they treated Olli Maatta last season. He’ll stick with the team out of camp for the first nine games, at which point GM Jim Rutherford will have to make a decision on keeping him or sending back to Finland. My gut says they keep him."
- YouMeAndDupuis9

That isn't true. He can play in the AHL. He's not a slave to the CHL transfer agreement nonsense.

What is the minimum age for an AHL player?
Per AHL By-Laws, the age limit for eligibility to compete in the American Hockey League is 18 years or over, on or before September 15 of each season of competition.

http://theahl.com/faq-p137653

That isn't true. He can play in the AHL. He's not a slave to the CHL transfer agreement nonsense.



http://theahl.com/faq-p137653
- Ryan_Wilson

Thanks for the clarification.

So can he still do the nine game trial and go back to the AHL or Finland if he doesn't cut it? (transfer rules and contract stipulations are confusing for a dummy like me)

Booth or Mueller. Booth or Mueller.

Sign one of them and move on. They'll be good choices to jump up and down the lineup.

Booth or Mueller. Booth or Mueller.

Sign one of them and move on. They'll be good choices to jump up and down the lineup.
- Barnaby36

Mueller

Wasn't around this weekend, but extremely happy with the Despres deal. Kid deserves a real shot, and i hope he runs with it. He's got all the tools to be a great NHL defenseman. Also excited about Kapanen. He may not be ready this year (unrealistic to count on him to be a top 6), but he's not very far away. He will add to the top 6 in the next 2-3 years. GMJR has been knocking it out the park with the FA signings.

Thanks for the clarification.

So can he still do the nine game trial and go back to the AHL or Finland if he doesn't cut it? (transfer rules and contract stipulations are confusing for a dummy like me)
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Yes... the CBA only refers to NHL games. Since he isn't a CHL player, he can play in the AHL this year without burning a year of his ELC. I was a little unclear about it, but looking at a recent guy like Hampus Lindholm, he spent a year in the AHL and still slid his ELC.

That isn't true. He can play in the AHL. He's not a slave to the CHL transfer agreement nonsense.



http://theahl.com/faq-p137653
- Ryan_Wilson

I strongly dislike that CHL transfer agreement. I'm not holding my breath for it to go away, but I really hates it.

I am starting to go a little crazy with the lack of hockey and what not. At least we are getting close to football coming back which will help a little.

I am starting to go a little crazy with the lack of hockey and what not. At least we are getting close to football coming back which will help a little.
- PensFan1103

I wish there was any sort of hockey to watch over the summer. Even if it was a summer prospects league, or an international tournament, anything.

Hey women's hockey, I think I found a niche for you!

I strongly dislike that CHL transfer agreement. I'm not holding my breath for it to go away, but I really hates it.
- BulliesPhan87

You'd think a country like Canada that prides itself on its love for hockey wouldn't need some cheap rule to prop up their junior programs so fans show up. It is an absurd agreement and should have ended by now.

They are also hypocrites.

I wrote this last year about the agreement.

http://hockeyhurts.com/ry...the-chl-s-double-standard