I'm saying the possession numbers of almost every player decreased when with Umberger and increased when with Hartnell.

If you want to make other arguments for why this trade will work then I understand. You really cant make any case based on Corsi though.
- PhillySportsGuy

If Umberger plays mainly with Giroux and Voracek this season, and Hartnell plays half of the time with Johanssen (assuming he signs) who will have better Corsi numbers?

Not really. Stanley Cup ring, and a SCF GWG on his resume.
- KGBflyers10

He was in the right place at the right time for both of those.

Rupp is pretty much a 4th liner. He has no business lording anything over Jody Shelley.

If Umberger plays mainly with Giroux and Voracek this season, and Hartnell plays half of the time with Johanssen (assuming he signs) who will have better Corsi numbers?
- Feanor

The point I'm making is that Hartnell seemed to raise the possession numbers of the players around him. Umberger appeared to lower them.

If Johansson had a Corsi of 55 w/o Umberger and 50.4 with Umberger then it suggests Umberger isn't helping much.

Just thinking of Pronger and all the years we lost watching him play makes me

If Umberger plays mainly with Giroux and Voracek this season, and Hartnell plays half of the time with Johanssen (assuming he signs) who will have better Corsi numbers?
- Feanor

Trick question. Universe will implode.

It appears Subban's arbitration was a bit testy. Arbitrator will rule within next 48 hours. Both sides requested 1 year deal.
- PhillySportsGuy

Why Montreal hasn't traded him and gotten all they can at this point is beyond me.

When he walks as an UFA they're going to be devastated. Either that or they were hoping someone would sign him to an offer sheet at a decent rate?

If Umberger plays mainly with Giroux and Voracek this season, and Hartnell plays half of the time with Johanssen (assuming he signs) who will have better Corsi numbers?
- Feanor

That is going to be interesting to watch.

The point I'm making is that Hartnell seemed to raise the possession numbers of the players around him. Umberger appeared to lower them.

If Johansson had a Corsi of 55 w/o Umberger and 50.4 with Umberger then it suggests Umberger isn't helping much.
- PhillySportsGuy

Agreed, it was a bad trade that all of us are crossing our fingers it turns out better then it looks.

Why Montreal hasn't traded him and gotten all they can at this point is beyond me.

When he walks as an UFA they're going to be devastated. Either that or they were hoping someone would sign him to an offer sheet at a decent rate?
- Flyersgod

They'll sign him eventually. They have to. He and Price are, by far, their best players.

Of course there was also Luke Richardson firing the puck at Bill Boughner's chest (sp) to save Keith Jones from extinction in the 2000 playoffs.

One of my best regular season memories of Pronger was humiliating the Lightning playing the 1-3-1 or whatever they employed when he and Lavvy were making a point about the defensive system they employed. Pronger just kept going behind the net with the puck to embarass them and they kept peeling off. That was the last coach with the scar on his face

Of course the Flyers lost the game, but it was national news for hockey.
- Steelmanpa

that was so strange to watch

It appears Subban's arbitration was a bit testy. Arbitrator will rule within next 48 hours. Both sides requested 1 year deal.
- PhillySportsGuy

If he gets one year, next year he can accept the qualifying offer and be a UFA at 27.

Pronger was a world changer. Having a Dman like that changes everything.

If Pronger was a 25 year old in the league right now, there isn't a player on the team i wouldn't trade to get him.
- Flyersgod

This!

Well...uh...compared to all the other star players' paychecks, they do.

So..

There's that....
- Giroux_Is_God

Well...Uh...I was never saying that he wasnt a bargain.

So..

Theres that...

Why Montreal hasn't traded him and gotten all they can at this point is beyond me.

When he walks as an UFA they're going to be devastated. Either that or they were hoping someone would sign him to an offer sheet at a decent rate?
- Flyersgod

He wouldn't sign "at a decent rate" because it would essentially be signing with MTL for that rate.

Was reading about the Islanders on NHL.com when I saw this little gem:

The Islanders finished last season 22nd in the NHL in Corsi for percentage at even strength (49.1%), but there was an uptick near the end of the season. A big reason for that was the trade of Andrew MacDonald to the Philadelphia Flyers in early March. MacDonald logged a ton of minutes for the Islanders, but he was also one of the worst possession anchors in the League and has been for a few seasons.

He even tailed off a bit because of the injury. What do I win?
- PhillySportsGuy

A photograph of a new Tesla you can download and use as your desktop background.

If he gets one year, next year he can accept the qualifying offer and be a UFA at 27.
- aflyerpower8

It's a smart move on his agent's part.

Agreed, it was a bad trade that all of us are crossing our fingers it turns out better then it looks.
- coffee junkie

I think theyre hoping Umberger bounces back and was just suffering from lingering injuries.

Pretty much the consensus among CBJ fans was that they should buy him out. We'll have to wait and see.

Perhaps, the Flyers feel he can have a better statistical year and will become more tradeable with only 2 years left on his deal.

Was reading about the Islanders on NHL.com when I saw this little gem:

The Islanders finished last season 22nd in the NHL in Corsi for percentage at even strength (49.1%), but there was an uptick near the end of the season. A big reason for that was the trade of Andrew MacDonald to the Philadelphia Flyers in early March. MacDonald logged a ton of minutes for the Islanders, but he was also one of the worst possession anchors in the League and has been for a few seasons.
- aflyerpower8

The bolded part is likely their problem there.

I remember one time Pronger lining up and firing away at one of the agitating forwards. He was on his side of the blue line and fired away. It was so funny. The broadcasters tried to pretend it was unintentional. Pronger could dot an i from 200 feet away though and everyone knew it
- PhillySportsGuy

I remember that, it was hysterical!!

I'm going to guess and say Klode, Gagne, or maybe Barber or Kerr?
- Giroux_Is_God

This is late most likely, but I'll go with Clarke

However if Al Hill had retired after one game, he would have won this easily with 5.0!!

Was reading about the Islanders on NHL.com when I saw this little gem:

The Islanders finished last season 22nd in the NHL in Corsi for percentage at even strength (49.1%), but there was an uptick near the end of the season. A big reason for that was the trade of Andrew MacDonald to the Philadelphia Flyers in early March. MacDonald logged a ton of minutes for the Islanders, but he was also one of the worst possession anchors in the League and has been for a few seasons.
- aflyerpower8

MacDonald is just one of those players where the possession metrics don't jibe with what I actually see with my own eyes.

He was in the right place at the right time for both of those.

Rupp is pretty much a 4th liner. He has no business lording anything over Jody Shelley.
- johndewar

Shelley made Rupp look irrelevant in the Winter Classic.

Was reading about the Islanders on NHL.com when I saw this little gem:

The Islanders finished last season 22nd in the NHL in Corsi for percentage at even strength (49.1%), but there was an uptick near the end of the season. A big reason for that was the trade of Andrew MacDonald to the Philadelphia Flyers in early March. MacDonald logged a ton of minutes for the Islanders, but he was also one of the worst possession anchors in the League and has been for a few seasons.
- aflyerpower8

Numbers be damned. MacDonald is a stud!

The point I'm making is that Hartnell seemed to raise the possession numbers of the players around him. Umberger appeared to lower them.

If Johansson had a Corsi of 55 w/o Umberger and 50.4 with Umberger then it suggests Umberger isn't helping much.
- PhillySportsGuy

It was 50.8% without Umberger and 50.2% with. It seems like RJ's struggles happened where when he was demoted down the lineup. Possibly his assortment of injuries contributed to that. If he has a CF% in the low 40s playing down the lineup here as well it will be a pretty big problem, and I certainly can't rule it out happening. If he plays with Couts and Read I think it's very unlikely, though.

As for Hartnell raising his teammates possession numbers, I don't think it's that simple. He spent roughly 65% of his ES time playing with Giroux and Voracek, our two elite forwards. And their CF% was actually slightly higher when they played with Austrian rookie Michael Raffl.

Most of the rest of Hartnell's ES ice time was spent playing with BSchenn and Simmonds, and they did much better playing with him than without him. But, and this is a 6'4" 215 pound but, when they were playing without him they were usually playing with Vinny Lecavalier. And Vinny was a Corsi black hole this season.

Giroux, Voracek, BSchenn and Wayne Simmonds all had a higher CF% playing with Raffl than they did playing with Hartnell.