The porn world could not contain him.
- jmatchett383

After all the talk about wanting to be more disciplined from both the coach and general manager, and then make a trade where you send away an undisciplined scoring line player only to follow it up by re-signing probably the most on December the discipline player on your team, it sends a strange and inconsistent message.

Yes it's a minor contract that can be buried in the minor-league without any kind of Penalty. However at the same time, it rewards a guy who regressed badly and I think that's where the problem lies for me. I just don't see the need to reword a guy after he's coming off a year where he took a big step backwards, especially since it was in an area that you've identified as a issue for the team in general
- Jsaquella

Nail on the head man. I honestly don't see him being sent the minors. Has he spent one day with the Phantoms the last few years? I don't know, when I look around the NHL I don't see players like Rinaldo on contending teams. I don't think his assets play well in the playoffs. Is he going to agitate players into taking penalties? Highly doubtful. A perfect way to describe Rinaldo is this... He's got a good motor, zero skill, and even less brains.

Nail on the head man. I honestly don't see him being sent the minors. Has he spent one day with the Phantoms the last few years? I don't know, when I look around the NHL I don't see players like Rinaldo on contending teams. I don't think his assets play well in the playoffs. Is he going to agitate players into taking penalties? Highly doubtful. A perfect way to describe Rinaldo is this... He's got a good motor, zero skill, and even less brains.
- PLindbergh31

Yeah, about 3 months worth.

Nail on the head man. I honestly don't see him being sent the minors. Has he spent one day with the Phantoms the last few years? I don't know, when I look around the NHL I don't see players like Rinaldo on contending teams. I don't think his assets play well in the playoffs. Is he going to agitate players into taking penalties? Highly doubtful. A perfect way to describe Rinaldo is this... He's got a good motor, zero skill, and even less brains.
- PLindbergh31

You undervalue the energy he brings. For a team that looked lethargic a lot last year, having someone who can get the team/fans into the game with big hits and fights is a big plus. If he can round out the other aspects of his game (mainly defensively), he could be one of the best energy guys in the league.

He is only 24 and the will to win/improve is evident, so I expect him to get better if he is given a chance.

Like who? Good players know they will get paid as long as they keep producing. Bottom six players will get contracts as long as they can produce or provide a quality the team wants.


Could the message also be if you play hard and work hard we reward you?


I am not defending or saying the deal is great just that i don't see why everyoneis hating on it like we just signed George Parros toa 3 year 12 million dollar deal
- J35Bacher

I'm viewing it more from the angle that they say they want more discipline and then turn around and extend their most undisciplined player a year early, coming off a bad year.

Saying one thing & doing the opposite is not a good way to do business

Nail on the head man. I honestly don't see him being sent the minors. Has he spent one day with the Phantoms the last few years? I don't know, when I look around the NHL I don't see players like Rinaldo on contending teams. I don't think his assets play well in the playoffs. Is he going to agitate players into taking penalties? Highly doubtful. A perfect way to describe Rinaldo is this... He's got a good motor, zero skill, and even less brains.
- PLindbergh31

Shawn Thorton
Ryan Reeves
Daniel Carcillo
Tanner Glass
Paul Bissonette
Patrck Bordeleau


Are all these guys significantly better then Rinaldo? They seem to do fine on winning teams.

Parros' stache alone, in its heyday, was worth 3 years @ $12M...per year.
- jmatchett383

Is Ray Whitney retired yet?

He's got to take that ice time from someone. Giroux will keep his, Couts will stay high against the other teams top line, now he and Vinny are battling for around 20 minutes even strength and Vinny gets the better line mates.
- aflyerpower8

Put our best six forwards on the top two lines with BSchenn-Giroux-Voracek and Read-Couturier-Simmonds and let them (hopefully) dominate. Coots will still get a lot of tough matchups, but that shouldn't be the only minutes he gets.

Then I would like to see the 3rd and 4th lines get similar amounts of ice time. Send Umberger-Lecavalier-Akeson out against the weaker opposition, and see if they can cook up some chemistry as a secondary scoring line. Then send out Raffl-Laughton-Bellemare/Rinaldo for the tougher matchups where defense/grit is more important.

You undervalue the energy he brings. For a team that looked lethargic a lot last year, having someone who can get the team/fans into the game with big hits and fights is a big plus. If he can round out the other aspects of his game (mainly defensively), he could be one of the best energy guys in the league.

He is only 24 and the will to win/improve is evident, so I expect him to get better if he is given a chance.
- aflyerpower8

If his will to win/improve is evident, then why did he regress last year? Given that, what leads you to believe he will not regress further or stagnate?

And while energy is important, so is not hurting your team with stupid penalties, back hockey skills, and suspensions.

I'm viewing it more from the angle that they say they want more discipline and then turn around and extend their most undisciplined player a year early, coming off a bad year.

Saying one thing & doing the opposite is not a good way to do business
- Jsaquella

Yes. But you have to also let him try and improve too. Yes he had a down year. The year before he seemed to play solid and draw a lot of penalties. You also can't send the message that one mistep and your gone. He is 24. If he struggles again this year in camp or in the ice time he dos get I don't think they will hesitate to send him down or park him in the suite.

It does send a message, they're making a two year commitment to a guy coming off a season where he regressed and faltered when given more to do. Granted it's not a huge deal, but it clearly says they're willing to continue the relationship
- Jsaquella

They're making a two year commitment to a young player that they like, and feel has some potential. What it doesn't say is that they feel Rinaldo doesn't have to improve, or get better. Teams make future commitments to young players that had a down year all the time. There is not big message being sent that Rinaldo's regression last year was okay. Simply not the case, and really it's being overblown.

If his will to win/improve is evident, then why did he regress last year? Given that, what leads you to believe he will not regress further or stagnate?

And while energy is important, so is not hurting your team with stupid penalties, back hockey skills, and suspensions.
- jmatchett383

Because guys never have bad seasons?

So then there should not be any complaints about Hartnell being traded. He regressed. Never got back to 30 goals.

Shawn Thorton
Ryan Reeves
Daniel Carcillo
Tanner Glass
Paul Bissonette
Patrck Bordeleau


Are all these guys significantly better then Rinaldo? They seem to do fine on winning teams.
- J35Bacher

Guess you could include the current-day Jamal Mayers as well.

Because guys never have bad seasons?

So then there should not be any complaints about Hartnell being traded. He regressed. Never got back to 30 goals.
- J35Bacher

I'm not saying he can/can't improve. I'm saying it's not a given that he will improve. Two very different things. But enjoy the twist and shout.

You basically said he will improve, and I said he didn't improve last season. I never said it's impossible to improve in the future, just that I don't see it as a fate-driven given the way yo do,

Guess you could include the current-day Jamal Mayers as well.
- jmatchett383

Not sure if your agreeing or not. But also I think each one of these guys makes more then Rinaldo. Not exact but I think

If his will to win/improve is evident, then why did he regress last year? Given that, what leads you to believe he will not regress further or stagnate?

And while energy is important, so is not hurting your team with stupid penalties, back hockey skills, and suspensions.
- jmatchett383

Couts regressed two years ago and I didn't think that was a lost cause either. Watch his interviews, think about why coaches like him, and watch the effort he puts into every shift. He may stagnate, but it won't be because of a lack of effort on his part.

I'm not saying he can/can't improve. I'm saying it's not a given that he will improve. Two very different things. But enjoy the twist and shout.
- jmatchett383

If he doesn't improve I am all for cutting bait. His deal doesn't affect that at all.

Not sure if your agreeing or not. But also I think each one of these guys makes more then Rinaldo. Not exact but I think
- J35Bacher

I'm saying there are players in the same vein as him on winning teams...but most of them have a lot more restraint to their game, and all of them have a bit more overall skill than he does.

That's it exactly. If you could just be less reckless, he could be an effective player. The discipline is not just in avoiding penalties. It's also playing with in the structure of the system. He's out there running around trying to hit everybody and taking himself out of position which affects his defense negatively.
- Jsaquella

Rinaldo was given a chance to play on the PK, and even that didn't get him to stop taking so many penalties. Like he didn't get that being in the penalty box precluded him from killing penalties.

I'm saying there are players in the same vein as him on winning teams...but most of them have a lot more restraint to their game, and all of them have a bit more overall skill than he does.
- jmatchett383

You might want to take Ryan Reaves off the list then.

If he doesn't improve I am all for cutting bait. His deal doesn't affect that at all.
- J35Bacher

The only issue I have with the deal is that it restricts them (a bit) from offseason UFA shopping and it takes up one of the 50 contract slots. Other than that, I don't care one way or another.

I'm saying there are players in the same vein as him on winning teams...but most of them have a lot more restraint to their game, and all of them have a bit more overall skill than he does.
- jmatchett383

And some are older and have learned to harness that. At 24 he can still have some time to become a better player.

BUt thanks for the conversation. I am out and off to soccer practice.

Yes. But you have to also let him try and improve too. Yes he had a down year. The year before he seemed to play solid and draw a lot of penalties. You also can't send the message that one mistep and your gone. He is 24. If he struggles again this year in camp or in the ice time he dos get I don't think they will hesitate to send him down or park him in the suite.
- J35Bacher

He's had 3 NHL seasons. He's shown improvement in one if those seasons in one area-avoidance of penalties. He didn't play better defensively or provide more production. He wasn't a better player in terms of hockey, he just did a better job in drawing & avoiding penalties.

That's my issue. He skates fast & hits, and does nothing else especially well

You might want to take Ryan Reaves off the list then.
- aflyerpower8

I said a bit more. Reaves career highs, while paltry, top Rinaldo's.