I dont understand the hate for MacDonald. He is probably the best option we have to play with Coby. He is solid defensively and can skate and move the puck. Streit cant handle defending top lines and neither can MDZ. Grossmann and Coby would be too slow and cant get the puck up to the forwards fast enough.
- GOA88

MacDonald did a pretty bad job as the top pairing guy in New York. Ideally he's on your 2nd or 3rd pair.

So I was trying to think of a a player that might make a mark this year that is not expected too. I am picking Taylor Leirer. I think back to Andrew Shaw with the Blackhawks and he provided som energy and timely goals. Leirer might not be as physical as Shaw but I have seen him play and his skating and 200ft game could be something that helps the Flyers.

love that 2nd line
- -davies-

Oh yeah. When Just 5 posted it I was in love

Ideally he's on your 2nd or 3rd pair.
- Jsaquella

Ideally he'd be on somebody else's 1st pair... so G and Jake could eat him alive.

So I was trying to think of a a player that might make a mark this year that is not expected too. I am picking Taylor Leirer. I think back to Andrew Shaw with the Blackhawks and he provided som energy and timely goals. Leirer might not be as physical as Shaw but I have seen him play and his skating and 200ft game could be something that helps the Flyers.
- J35Bacher

Good choice. Brandon Alderson is a good sleeper to

Ideally he'd be on somebody else's 1st pair... so G and Jake could eat him alive.


- Tomahawk

CSN Philly and HockeyBuzz writer Tim Panaccio noted the other day that Voracek (a player whose conditioning has been called in question in the past) arrived in Voorhees having dropped about 10 pounds after an off-season change to his diet.
- bmeltzer

Mama's dumplings...

I posted this lineup in mid-July (I forgot about Akeson).

Schenn-G-Voracek
Read-Couturier-Simmonds
Umberger-Vinny-Raffl
Bellemare-Laughton-Rinaldo
- Feanor

How dare you forget about Art Ross Akeson!

Holy crap, Berube's been reading my posts!

Schenn-Giroux-Voracek
Read-Couturier-Simmonds
Umberger-Lecavalier-Akeson
Raffl-Laughton-Bellemare/Rinaldo

Well, technically, it was Just5's post originally, but I liked his line combos and stole them
- Jsaquella

MacDonald did a pretty bad job as the top pairing guy in New York. Ideally he's on your 2nd or 3rd pair.
- Jsaquella

I agree. I'm just saying we dont have really any better options IMO.

Bill Meltzer: Meltzer's Musings: Rookie Camp Finalized, Projected Lines, Quick Hits
- bmeltzer

Bill, You say a few young defenseman will get a long look. What do you think it would take to bring them into the fold? Would have to out play somebody, or just be ready for NHL (ie. shows potential but needs NHL experience, but not necessarily out play anyone). IF they decide to bring one into the fold... Who's on the bubble that could lose their spot? I assume Coburn, Mac, and Streit are a lock. And, depending on pre-season - Grossmann, Del Zotto, and Schenn are on the bubble (or demoted to 7th and knock Schultz out)?

Bill, You say a few young defenseman will get a long look. What do you think it would take to bring them into the fold? Would have to out play somebody, or just be ready for NHL (ie. shows potential but needs NHL experience, but not necessarily out play anyone). IF they decide to bring one into the fold... Who's on the bubble that could lose their spot? I assume Coburn, Mac, and Streit are a lock. And, depending on pre-season - Grossmann, Del Zotto, and Schenn are on the bubble (or demoted to 7th and knock Schultz out)?
- leon neon

I'm thinking Ghost has to outplay MDZ and Morin has to outplay Grossmann. The rest are staying.

MacDonald did a pretty bad job as the top pairing guy in New York. Ideally he's on your 2nd or 3rd pair.
- Jsaquella

Agreed.

On the other hand, I doubt HB denizens are the only people in the world that know about Andy MacDonald's shortcomings (I know, SO HARD TO BELIEVE, AMIRITE?) and I'm hoping they can be worked on either with the player himself or through coaching tactics.

He's not a complete disaster, but yeah.....he needs work.

I'm thinking Ghost has to outplay MDZ and Morin has to outplay Grossmann. The rest are staying.
- GOA88

Pretty much and they would have to clearly outplay them by a lot too. Hextall seems pretty committed to not rushing prospects.

Pretty much and they would have to clearly outplay them by a lot too. Hextall seems pretty committed to not rushing prospects.
- BiggE

Grossmann seems like he is on the decline. He is getting banged up and also getting slower than he was before. Just my observation.

Bill Meltzer: Meltzer's Musings: Rookie Camp Finalized, Projected Lines, Quick Hits
- bmeltzer

Bill, you are a true class act. Thanks so much for all of your hard work. The first thing I do every morning is read your work. It's such a breath of fresh air to read a blog that helps make me a more intelligent Flyers and hockey fan. Happy belated birthday!

Maybe the Flyers have finally gotten some good fortune and have found a 2nd round gem in Aube-Kubel? Still too early to really tell, but let's hope so.
- MJL

Well first they have to actually make 2nd rd picks to find a gem. Before Robert Hagg was chosen two drafts ago, the Flyers have used their league issued 2nd rd pick once since 1999 (Denis Bodrov in 2006). They have made 5 2nd rd picks total in that time between the 1999 draft thru 20012 with 4 of them acquired thru trades. 3 of those 5 occurred in only one draft in 2006. So in 14 drafts, they used their own 2nd rd pick once and picked in the 2nd rd in only 3 drafts total. No wonder they can't find gems.

MacDonald did a pretty bad job as the top pairing guy in New York. Ideally he's on your 2nd or 3rd pair.
- Jsaquella

As GOA88 said, it's about choosing from the options that the team has. MacDonald is ideally a 2nd pair defenseman. But he's much, much better then a 3rd pair defenseman. And I bet that MacDonald, like all defenseman would. Would've faired much better with better team support around him.

Agreed.

On the other hand, I doubt HB denizens are the only people in the world that know about Andy MacDonald's shortcomings (I know, SO HARD TO BELIEVE, AMIRITE?) and I'm hoping they can be worked on either with the player himself or through coaching tactics.

He's not a complete disaster, but yeah.....he needs work.
- johndewar

MacDonald is going to significantly upgrade the Flyers defense corps, as a Flyer. And if Del Zotto can find his game again, he'll also do the same.

Well first they have to actually make 2nd rd picks to find a gem. Before Robert Hagg was chosen two drafts ago, the Flyers have used their league issued 2nd rd pick once since 1999 (Denis Bodrov in 2006). They have made 5 2nd rd picks total in that time between the 1999 draft thru 20012 with 4 of them acquired thru trades. 3 of those 5 occurred in only one draft in 2006. So in 14 drafts, they used their own 2nd rd pick once and picked in the 2nd rd in only 3 drafts total. No wonder they can't find gems.
- psuhockey

No doubt that the more picks you make, the better the odds.

MacDonald is going to significantly upgrade the Flyers defense corps, as a Flyer. And if Del Zotto can find his game again, he'll also do the same.
- MJL

I have a little faith that, despite all of our collective hand wringing over MacDonald, that he'll either get coached up and be put in a better position to succeed.

It's not like the people here or other sites have some SECRET ANDREW MACDONALD KNOWLEDGE that only they know. I'm sure the team sees it and will try to correct it.

I have a little faith that, despite all of our collective hand wringing over MacDonald, that he'll either get coached up and be put in a better position to succeed.

It's not like the people here or other sites have some SECRET ANDREW MACDONALD KNOWLEDGE that only they know. I'm sure the team sees it and will try to correct it.
- johndewar

MacDonalds Corsi rating is bad mostly because he isnt agressive at the blue line with attacking forwards. They can 9 out of 10 times carry the puck into the zone on his side but that may be his style of play as he is rarely ever beat wide, and he is very good at staying between the shooter and the goalie and is hardly ever out of position. He isnt physical so he uses his strengths to his advantage which are intelligence in reading the play, skating, passing, and a good stick. Thats my impression when I watch him play.

I have a little faith that, despite all of our collective hand wringing over MacDonald, that he'll either get coached up and be put in a better position to succeed.

It's not like the people here or other sites have some SECRET ANDREW MACDONALD KNOWLEDGE that only they know. I'm sure the team sees it and will try to correct it.
- johndewar

What would they be trying to correct specifically? Is there some serious flaw in his game? I think from what I've seen, he's a pretty darn good defenseman. Not a top pair guy, but a real solid puck moving #3 NHL defenseman. I think there are some physical limitations to his game, in that he's not real physical. But if he was, the Flyers wouldn't have gotten him for the picks they gave up, or for the deal they signed him to.

Pretty much and they would have to clearly outplay them by a lot too. Hextall seems pretty committed to not rushing prospects.
- BiggE

Yeah, they're not going to be slaves to any conventional timetables either. If guys like Morin and Sanheim don't ever make a strong case for a spot with their play, they won't get a sniff despite their draft status (see: Hickey, Teubert, Forbort). Even guys who continually had good camps for the Kings kept getting sent down (see: Voynov, Bernier, Schenn, Loktionov, Moller)...

Bill (and everyone else),

Do you see Schultz as an emergency 7th defenseman, kind of like Hal Gill was? What I mean is that, say a defender (let's use Grossmann for example) goes down in camp/preseason. Do you see Schultz stepping into a full-time top-6 role, or would they promote from the AHL and keep Schultz around as a quick, short-term fill-in?

Also, whether or not he makes the roster, I'd like them to give Morin the 9-game tryout (cap allowing). I feel like spending 9 games, or even 4-5 games, with the big club, even if he's not playing, would be a valuable experience for him moving forward.

Lastly, I will be attending rookie camp on Saturday for about an hour, as long as my little girl doesn't get too fussy. If any of you would like to say hi, let me know, would love to meet some of you.