I was wondering if it was irony or the need to start an argument that led to his replies.
- Jsaquella

I don't want him in the line-up, period.

Give me 4 lines like the ones above and there's no need at all to under utilize anybody. If I have Umberger-Laughton-Bellemare as my 4th line, they're going to see as much time as a Vinny-Raffl-Akeson line, if not more. They're not really a 4th line, it's basically having two very solid third lines, instead of a good third line and a 4th line that can only play 7 minutes.
- Jsaquella

With you there, but I think they are committed to starting Laughton in the "A"

Did you read my whole post? I would have Umberger, who I don't think is as good a player as Mike Richards, playing 13-15 minutes per night. That's not exactly typical 4th line minutes.
- BiggE

I don't see it playing out that way. Berube isn't going to coach that way in my opinion. Umberger should be one of the higher forwards in ES icetime, on this team, not towards the bottom. That was the entire reason for acquiring him. To get a veteran player who plays both sides of the puck well, along with the ability to provide sceondary offense. His role should be more then a 4th line player, and it is a mistake to put him on the 4th line.

With you there, but I think they are committed to starting Laughton in the "A"
- BiggE

Sure seems like that. I get the idea, but I think they should give him a shot. Seems like they're proceeding like it's a fait accompli that he'll need AHL time.

I don't see it playing out that way. Berube isn't going to coach that way in my opinion. Umberger should be one of the higher forwards in ES icetime, on this team, not towards the bottom. That was the entire reason for acquiring him. To get a veteran player who plays both sides of the puck well, along with the ability to provide sceondary offense. His role should be more then a 4th line player, and it is a mistake to put him on the 4th line.
- MJL

Well, so far in camp he's playing with VLC and Akeson, I doubt that line is going to see a huge amount of ES icetime, but whatever

I was wondering if it was irony or the need to start an argument that led to his replies.

I've made several posts saying that it'd be a "fourth" line in name only without using the specific wording.
- Jsaquella

A 4th line is a 4th line. And I know you supposedly don't read my posts, but if you're referring to me, I'm giving my opinion. But I know to some, if there is a difference of opinion offered, then it's starting an argument. My view is the posts such as the above, that are about posters, instead of the subject being discussed, then that's looking for an argument.

Sure seems like that. I get the idea, but I think they should give him a shot. Seems like they're proceeding like it's a fait accompli that he'll need AHL time.
- Jsaquella

Agreed
Hopefully if he plays well in the preseason, they keep him on the big club, but I'm not holding my breath.

Well, so far in camp he's playing with VLC and Akeson, I doubt that line is going to see a huge amount of ES icetime, but whatever
- BiggE

It would depend on their effectiveness. An injured and ineffective Lecavalier at ES last year, still saw almost 13 minutes a game at ES.

Agreed
Hopefully if he plays well in the preseason, they keep him on the big club, but I'm not holding my breath.
- BiggE

It's more important that he has a long career than plays right now. I also would lean towards the AHL if he didn't come in and play as one of the best 9 forwards in camp. Nobody's talking about handing him a job, but based on what I've seen he can handle the NHL at this point. Might have some growing pains, but he's a smart, hard working kid with a nasty streak.

A 4th line is a 4th line. And I know you supposedly don't read my posts, but if you're referring to me, I'm giving my opinion. But I know to some, if there is a difference of opinion offered, then it's starting an argument. My view is the posts such as the above, that are about posters, instead of the subject being discussed, then that's looking for an argument.
- MJL

Actually, that is not true. It depends on game situations. A 4th line of Umberger, Laughton and Raffl may see more ice time in the 3rd period of a tied game or a game in which the Flyers are leading than a line of Bellemare, VLC and Akeson. And, when you consider that over a 1/3 of a typical game is spent either on the pp, pk or 4 on 4, the line designations become even less important.

edit: and playoff icetime is usually inflated to some degree due to OT
- BiggE

Mike Richards ES ice time was pretty much the same in both the playoffs and the regular season. According to ice time, Richards was really a 3rd line player, not a 4th line player.

It's more important that he has a long career than plays right now. I also would lean towards the AHL if he didn't come in and play as one of the best 9 forwards in camp. Nobody's talking about handing him a job, but based on what I've seen he can handle the NHL at this point. Might have some growing pains, but he's a smart, hard working kid with a nasty streak.
- Jsaquella

No doubt and I definitely think he's in the lineup before the end of the season.

Actually, that is not true. It depends on game situations. A 4th line of Umberger, Laughton and Raffl may see more ice time in the 3rd period of a tied game or a game in which the Flyers are leading than a line of Bellemare, VLC and Akeson. And, when you consider that over a 1/3 of a typical game is spent either on the pp, pk or 4 on 4, the line designations become even less important.
- BiggE

Nope. The Kings can have a 4th liner in name only, like Richards, but on the Flyers a 4th line is a 4th line...because you know, opinion

Mike Richards ES ice time was pretty much the same in both the playoffs and the regular season. According to ice time, Richards was really a 3rd line player, not a 4th line player.
- MJL

ok, you win. I'm tired of going back and forth on this.

Nope. The Kings can have a 4th liner in name only, like Richards, but on the Flyers a 4th line is a 4th line...because you know, opinion
- Jsaquella

Actually, that is not true. It depends on game situations. A 4th line of Umberger, Laughton and Raffl may see more ice time in the 3rd period of a tied game or a game in which the Flyers are leading than a line of Bellemare, VLC and Akeson. And, when you consider that over a 1/3 of a typical game is spent either on the pp, pk or 4 on 4, the line designations become even less important.
- BiggE

Disagree completely. The Flyers biggest issue last year was ES play. That is the key to the game, and the key to how well the Flyers will do this year. Especially with the loss of Timonen. The Flyers 5 on 5 play, and their team defense had better be drastically improved. Umberger, if he is healthy, can have an impact on that for this team. And it shouldn't be as a 4th line player.
The Flyers pretty much always have good special teams. It's ES play where the issue is.
And really, nobody can foresee how much time a team is going to play with the lead or with the game tied.

Disagree completely. The Flyers biggest issue last year was ES play. That is the key to the game, and the key to how well the Flyers will do this year. Especially with the loss of Timonen. The Flyers 5 on 5 play, and their team defense had better be drastically improved. Umberger, if he is healthy, can have an impact on that for this team. And it shouldn't be as a 4th line player.
The Flyers pretty much always have good special teams. It's ES play where the issue is.
And really, nobody can foresee how much time a team is going to play with the lead or with the game tied.
- MJL

ok, you win

Nope. The Kings can have a 4th liner in name only, like Richards, but on the Flyers a 4th line is a 4th line...because you know, opinion
- Jsaquella

I'll stick to hockey and the actual subject. The Flyers have enough good role players on this team to put a good 4th line together, without having to play Umberger on the 4th line. They have Bellemare, Raffl, Laughton, White, when he is ready to play, and yes, even Rinaldo if he is surrounded by the right players.

Now if training camp and pre season shows that other players such as Akeson, are outplaying Umberger, and deserves the spot on an upper line, then by all means play the best players who are playing the best. And demote those that aren't to lesser lines. But all things being equal, by design, in my opinion, Umberger does not belong on the 4th line if he is healthy, and playing to the best of his ability.

ok, you win
- BiggE

- Jsaquella

Awesome

Enough goofing off, time to head to the gym and work off the beer I'm going to drink during the Eagles game!

Enough goofing off, time to head to the gym and work off the beer I'm going to drink during the Eagles game!
- BiggE

I'm stuck at a kid's party up in North Jersey...actually looking forward to it now

I'm stuck at a kid's party up in North Jersey...actually looking forward to it now
- Jsaquella

Earlier this week, enforcer Jay Rosehill surprisingly won the NHL squad's fastest skater competition.
- bmeltzer

Giroux's replacement.