I'm still don't buy it. The things the players have said essentially amount to this:

"We're still losing, but dammit do we feel better about ourselves!"

Moral victories hold no bearing to me.
- buffalofan19

Good thing you are not the GM then . Because players develop on different timetables . Just because one player may take longer . He still may turn out to be a valuable asset. Rushing players to the NHL has ruined a lot more careers than keeping them in the AHL or Junior an extra year .

It's not that though. Case in point Grigorenko. There was no clear cut development path with him. He was part of Darcy's poor attempt at appeasing the fans during the rebuild and it ended up hurting his development. Now I agree, if Grigorenko is going to end up a good player it will happen regardless. However I think rushing him set him back at least a year.

For guys like Reinhart, Risto, Armia or Pysyk, putting them in the AHL is sending a message that they still have stuff to work on and it gives them ampile opportunity to do so in the AHL while the Sabres lose regardless.

Edit: I know Reinhart can't go to the AHL
- sbroads24

I don't think we have a need for many of those players to be here. We have the Depth players that can fill out the bottom pairings and roles and allow our "talented" players to hone their skills.

I trust that Murray knows what is best and will ensure that the players will be where he feels they are best served.

EDIT: like when Grigorenko, Risto, Zads, etc. were all put back when Nolan came in. I see that Murray will likely lean towards the player's success and encouraging their game. If he can ice a decent team and still finish in the bottom, it doesn't look like a tank job.

I don't think the return will be great, but if it is for the betterment of the team (which I think Murray knows what will work) then I am all for it. I don't expect 1st round picks or highly touted prospects. Murray has his eyes open on prospects like Delauries and Fasching. If he wants something, he will get it or the other team will not get the players they want and that's totally okay with me.

I truly see Stafford being offered an extension.
- thatsapickle

I hope not. Don't get me wrong, I hope Staff has a decent year..build those stats so that they trade him at the deadline.
I Just see him going flat after a new contract. Hard to change those leopard spots...so I suspect he will revert and we will all be going nuts (again). I do wish him well..just in another town.

I hope not. Don't get me wrong, I hope Staff has a decent year..build those stats so that they trade him at the deadline.
I Just see him going flat after a new contract. Hard to change those leopard spots...so I suspect he will revert and we will all be going nuts (again). I do wish him well..just in another town.
- IonSabres

If he leaves, I think it's for Minnesota and I felt this way as soon as Parise signed there. They are best friends and neighbors and all of that.

I also think he's buying into the changes here and he may be given an opportunity he won't get anywhere else. You're right though, the stigma for how he didn't live up to this contract is hard to remove.

If he leaves, I think it's for Minnesota and I felt this way as soon as Parise signed there. They are best friends and neighbors and all of that.

I also think he's buying into the changes here and he may be given an opportunity he won't get anywhere else. You're right though, the stigma for how he didn't live up to this contract is hard to remove.
- thatsapickle

Seems like the Wild is.a.landing spot.for.a.number of former Sabres. Maybe that is why they haven't won the big.one yet. I wish Buffalo would become the landing spot for good Kings, Bruins, Hawks players, lol.

Good thing you are not the GM then . Because players develop on different timetables . Just because one player may take longer . He still may turn out to be a valuable asset. Rushing players to the NHL has ruined a lot more careers than keeping them in the AHL or Junior an extra year .
- Maximum Signal

Nobody's disputing that certain players can benefit from more time in the minors, or Juniors. However, where Ted Nolan fails the test of basic logic is that just because going the ultra-safe route with a player doesn't end up being a regrettable result automatically means that it's the best route. I've said it before, the only question they should be asking about a player is "is my team better if he is on the roster?". If the answer is "yes", then keep him here, if it's "no", then send him elsewhere. That's how I want my team to operate. That's how championship teams operate.

Nobody's disputing that certain players can benefit from more time in the minors, or Juniors. However, where Ted Nolan fails the test of basic logic is that just because going the ultra-safe route with a player doesn't end up being a regrettable result automatically means that it's the best route. I've said it before, the only question they should be asking about a player is "is my team better if he is on the roster?". If the answer is "yes", then keep him here, if it's "no", then send him elsewhere. That's how I want my team to operate. That's how championship teams operate.
- buffalofan19

And how do you know exactly what their plan is?

Nobody's disputing that certain players can benefit from more time in the minors, or Juniors. However, where Ted Nolan fails the test of basic logic is that just because going the ultra-safe route with a player doesn't end up being a regrettable result automatically means that it's the best route. I've said it before, the only question they should be asking about a player is "is my team better if he is on the roster?". If the answer is "yes", then keep him here, if it's "no", then send him elsewhere. That's how I want my team to operate. That's how championship teams operate.
- buffalofan19

That's not really true though. You can find examples on most teams of players that are in the minors, that are better than current roster players.

LA has just recently done this with Tyler Toffoli and Tanner Pearson. Detroit famously leaves players in the minors.

That's not really true though. You can find examples on most teams of players that are in the minors, that are better than current roster players.

LA has just recently done this with Tyler Toffoli and Tanner Pearson. Detroit famously leaves players in the minors.
- sbroads24

The improvement in Toffoli and Pearson for this season has been well documented. They struggled in the NHL in their initial trips up in the league, and were outplayed by their peers.

At the time Detroit was famous for that, they had about 6 first ballot hall-of-famers on that squad, a luxury most teams don't have.

Nobody's disputing that certain players can benefit from more time in the minors, or Juniors. However, where Ted Nolan fails the test of basic logic is that just because going the ultra-safe route with a player doesn't end up being a regrettable result automatically means that it's the best route. I've said it before, the only question they should be asking about a player is "is my team better if he is on the roster?". If the answer is "yes", then keep him here, if it's "no", then send him elsewhere. That's how I want my team to operate. That's how championship teams operate.
- buffalofan19

Very selfish fan view . The question that should be asked is - Will this players development be hindered by rushing him to the NHL too soon? Is he physically ready for the grind of an NHL Season ? Is he ready to take the pounding physically night in and night out from Bigger faster players ? Will the player be better for us in the long run by additional development in junior or the minors. Not nearly as simple as you would like to believe.

Those are all the questions championship organizations ask .

The improvement in Toffoli and Pearson for this season has been well documented. They struggled in the NHL in their initial trips up in the league, and were outplayed by their peers.

At the time Detroit was famous for that, they had about 6 first ballot hall-of-famers on that squad, a luxury most teams don't have.
- buffalofan19

You could absolutely argue they were better than players that were currently on that roster. Toffoli had 5 points in his first 10 games and was sent back to the minors. Then spent 20 games in the minors the next season.


Tanner Pearson had 47 points in the AHL (in 64 games) in 2013 as a 21 year old. He was a better option to start the season than some of the other Kings forwards but didn't get called up until later in the year.

Your narrative of what championship teams do is not really true.

Very selfish fan view . The question that should be asked is - Will this players development be hindered by rushing him to the NHL too soon? Is he physically ready for the grind of an NHL Season ? Is he ready to take the pounding physically night in and night out from Bigger faster players ? Will the player be better for us in the long run by additional development in junior or the minors. Not nearly as simple as you would like to believe.

Those are all the questions championship organizations ask .
- Maximum Signal

If the answer to those questions to one or more of those questions is "no", then he doesn't make your team better with him on it. If the answer is no to one or more of those questions, he's going to be a liability to your team. There are more and more players now that can handle it. These players are bigger, train better, and have much better nutrition than they did back then. The gap isn't nearly as wide as it once was. There are plenty of younger players that fit in just fine immediately, and they don't all have Crosby-type talent either.

You could absolutely argue they were better than players that were currently on that roster. Toffoli had 5 points in his first 10 games and was sent back to the minors. Then spent 20 games in the minors the next season.


Tanner Pearson had 47 points in the AHL (in 64 games) in 2013 as a 21 year old. He was a better option to start the season than some of the other Kings forwards but didn't get called up until later in the year.

Your narrative of what championship teams do is not really true.
- sbroads24

There's still the notion that they aren't best served at bottom six roles, which they were not. And they didn't believe Pearson was a better option at the time. It was only when they were struggling offensively that he was called up in 2013. They realized they made a mistake and corrected it.

There's still the notion that they aren't best served at bottom six roles, which they were not. And they didn't believe Pearson was a better option at the time. It was only when they were struggling offensively that he was called up in 2013. They realized they made a mistake and corrected it.
- buffalofan19

Good to know that you have a better handle on the situation than the GM of the Stanley Cup champions , 2 of the last 3 years.

There's still the notion that they aren't best served at bottom six roles, which they were not. And they didn't believe Pearson was a better option at the time. It was only when they were struggling offensively that he was called up in 2013. They realized they made a mistake and corrected it.
- buffalofan19

Right, and whos to say the Sabres don't do the same with someone like Armia mid-season?

Theres a huge difference in what you are accusing them of doing, and what they are actually are doing

Good to know that you have a better handle on the situation than the GM of the Stanley Cup champions , 2 of the last 3 years.





- Maximum Signal

If he was dead set on the players' development, he would have left them in the minors instead of calling them up mid-season. I don't need to "have a better handle" on the situation. It's pretty easy to see what he did.

Right, and whos to say the Sabres don't do the same with someone like Armia mid-season?

Theres a huge difference in what you are accusing them of doing, and what they are actually are doing
- sbroads24

They could, but given Nolan's track record, I'm not too optimistic, unless this team is decimated with injuries, which isn't out of the realm of possibility.

They could, but given Nolan's track record, I'm not too optimistic, unless this team is decimated with injuries, which isn't out of the realm of possibility.
- buffalofan19

Which is how most AHL'ers make the jump anyway. It's there job to play well enough and force them to keep them up.

I'm not so sure Armia or Grigorenko is ready to make that impression. Now Pysyk on the other hand should absolutely be here, and I will be annoyed if he's sent down. He has had his seasoning and is one of the top 6 defensemen we have.

He's right. Especially for this current team.

I have changed my opinion on this topic. I used to agree with you. But after last year and hearing what a lot of the players had to say changed how I thought about it.

Having a stable environment here and in Rochester is better for this team long term.
- sbroads24

Here is the problem. Great talent should play in the NHl right away. The rest don't.
Everybody talks about championship teams that's fine. How many games did Toews Kane Crosby Malkin, Drew Doughty play in the minors. For the most part your elite talent stays and plays. Reinhart should stay and play if he is elite talent. The rest its all a crap shoot. Style of play and system for young players is huge for development. Big worry about Nolan he doesn't believe in analytics. He sounded like it was a fancy compueter

Which is how most AHL'ers make the jump anyway. It's there job to play well enough and force them to keep them up.

I'm not so sure Armia or Grigorenko is ready to make that impression. Now Pysyk on the other hand should absolutely be here, and I will be annoyed if he's sent down. He has had his seasoning and is one of the top 6 defensemen we have.
- sbroads24

Why is pysyk better than Risto

Changing the subject. I'm watching the Kraft Hockeyville game on CBC. The new dry-scrape before overtime rule is a bad, bad idea. The delay is way, way too long.

Here is the problem. Great talent should play in the NHl right away. The rest don't.
Everybody talks about championship teams that's fine. How many games did Toews Kane Crosby Malkin, Drew Doughty play in the minors. For the most part your elite talent stays and plays. Reinhart should stay and play if he is elite talent. The rest its all a crap shoot. Style of play and system for young players is huge for development. Big worry about Nolan he doesn't believe in analytics. He sounded like it was a fancy compueter
- hafgod

Jonathon Drouin played in juniors last year and he's an elite talent.

Why is pysyk better than Risto
- hafgod

No, but Risto could use the time in Rochester. Even if it's only a half a season.

Pysyk has a lot of AHL games under his belt

Jonathon Drouin played in juniors last year and he's an elite talent.
- sbroads24

Maybe. Did that extra year in juniors Destroying kids with way less talent make him a better hockey player.

No, but Risto could use the time in Rochester. Even if it's only a half a season.

Pysyk has a lot of AHL games under his belt
- sbroads24

I like pysyk but why. Risto in my opininion is nhl ready to play as 4th def.
Next year when we get MCEichel how many rookies are we going to play.
Potentially McEichel, Reinhart Grigerenko Risto, McCabe could be here next year.
Do you really want 5 rookies in your lineup.