I think Sanheim is less raw than Morin. He;s a really smart kid and he's got a really great demeanor on the ice. He doesn;t get rattled and his skating is good enough to recover from most mistakes.

I think Sanheim, while a couple years away, is their best all around D prospect.
- Jsaquella

Yeah, I agree. After seeing his in training camp/pre-season, he seems to have the best shot at filling that #1 d-man role

what's wrong with giroux being 30-33?
- 2Real

Nothing, IMO.

Yeah, I agree. After seeing his in training camp/pre-season, he seems to have the best shot at filling that #1 d-man role
- mcefalu

I'm really excited about him, more than the others even.

You're making a different argument. Your looking at them collectively as a group. Not having that true #1 defenseman, doesn't change what the Flyers defenseman are as players individually.

In the same way that if the Flyers try and use MacDonald as a #1 defenseman, that doesn't make him a #1.
- MJL

Actually, my bad. You were talking to my point that they are each really a 4-6 dman. You are right, my assessment was probably a little low, though I don't think they are all top 4 either. I'll go with JSaq's last post. Coburn is a legit 3. Streit is probably a legit 4, but arguably a 3. The others are 4-6 guys on a contending team.

I think Sanheim is less raw than Morin. He;s a really smart kid and he's got a really great demeanor on the ice. He doesn;t get rattled and his skating is good enough to recover from most mistakes.

I think Sanheim, while a couple years away, is their best all around D prospect.
- Jsaquella

I agree with the gut feeling that Sanheim is their best all around prospect, and seems based on potential to be the best chance to be that top all around #1 guy. But he's not less raw then Morin. If that was the case, Sanheim would still be here, and Morin would've been sent down early. Morin is ahead of Sanheim in development. For a number of reasons.

I'm really excited about him, more than the others even.
- Jsaquella

3 pts in 3 games in his second season in juniors thus far. He won't sustain that all season but I'm excited to see what he ends up with from a production stand point this year.

Edit: Sorry, 3 pts in 2 games, thus far.

Streit was barely used by that team on the pk and was 4th on that team among dmen in non pp ice time. That is not a #1 dman
- BiggE

I said Streit has shown this preseason that he's poised to show he's this team's number one. He's trying to make an argument for himself. I agree that Coburn is our number but neither guy is a legitimate number one.

As for his time with the Islanders, Streit will be in a different role in the upcoming season. What are we to do if one of Coburn, Grossmann, MacDonald or Schenn go to the box?

PP time still counts as time on the ice.

what's wrong with giroux being 30-33?
- 2Real

That's the point where he is statistically more likely to decline. Think, Danny Briere. I think he'll still be good in that window. But given the young kids coming up over next 5 years, he may not be a top 10-15 forward.

Thats not what I said (sigh) all I said was that if Mark Streit is your top guy on D you are likely to be a lottery team. Since Coburn is clearly the Flyers top guy when it comes to all around D, it doesn't apply to them anyway.
- BiggE

I know exactly what you said (sigh). How is having Striet as the de facto #1 any different then not having a #1? It's the same thing.

I think that's bull that it's a sign that you are likely to be a lottery team. And I'm not so sure if Streit isn't the Flyers best all around D man.

I said Streit has shown this preseason that he's poised to show he's this team's number one. He's trying to make an argument for himself. I agree that Coburn is our number but neither guy is a legitimate number one.

As for his time with the Islanders, Streit will be in a different role in the upcoming season. What are we to do if one of Coburn, Grossmann, MacDonald or Schenn go to the box?

PP time still counts as time on the ice.
- SuperSchennBros

(the thud you hear is my head slowly banging against the wall)

I agree with the gut feeling that Sanheim is their best all around prospect, and seems based on potential to be the best chance to be that top all around #1 guy. But he's not less raw then Morin. If that was the case, Sanheim would still be here, and Morin would've been sent down early. Morin is ahead of Sanheim in development. For a number of reasons.
- MJL

That's not necessarily true. With Sanheim being a year younger, and likely 2 years away from the minors, you take the longer term view and not worry about trying to coach him up yet. With Morin only one year away, he benefits more from the extended look and extra time with the coaches.

Yeah, I agree. After seeing his in training camp/pre-season, he seems to have the best shot at filling that #1 d-man role
- mcefalu

When he fills out around 215 lbs?

3 pts in 3 games in his second season in juniors thus far. He won't sustain that all season but I'm excited to see what he ends up with from a production stand point this year.

Edit: Sorry, 3 pts in 2 games, thus far.
- mcefalu

Yeah, he's off to a good start and his confidence can't be hurt by anything he did while in camp with the Flyers. He'll need a couple years, but he's got all the tools to make it.

I know exactly what you said (sigh). How is having Striet as the de facto #1 any different then not having a #1? It's the same thing.

I think that's bull that it's a sign that you are likely to be a lottery team. And I'm not so sure if Streit isn't the Flyers best all around D man.
- MJL

thud, thud, thud

I said Streit has shown this preseason that he's poised to show he's this team's number one. He's trying to make an argument for himself. I agree that Coburn is our number but neither guy is a legitimate number one.

As for his time with the Islanders, Streit will be in a different role in the upcoming season. What are we to do if one of Coburn, Grossmann, MacDonald or Schenn go to the box?

PP time still counts as time on the ice.
- SuperSchennBros

I think back to what Murray said about Ghost. It's not what he does in the 2 minutes that he has the puck on his stick that determines how good a player he is. It's what he does the other 20 minutes when the puck is not on his stick.

With Streit, it's not what he does in his 4-5 minutes of PP time a game. It's the other 18 minutes of ice time.

Actually, my bad. You were talking to my point that they are each really a 4-6 dman. You are right, my assessment was probably a little low, though I don't think they are all top 4 either. I'll go with JSaq's last post. Coburn is a legit 3. Streit is probably a legit 4, but arguably a 3. The others are 4-6 guys on a contending team.
- TheGreat28

If you put a player like Andrew MacDonald on a team like LA, with their strong puck possession and team defense. He'd flourish there. Same thing with a team like Boston.

When he fills out around 215 lbs?
- 77rams

Oh for sure. As long as his skating stays where it is now, can you imagine staring down that freight train as it comes at you from across the rink?

That's not necessarily true. With Sanheim being a year younger, and likely 2 years away from the minors, you take the longer term view and not worry about trying to coach him up yet. With Morin only one year away, he benefits more from the extended look and extra time with the coaches.
- TheGreat28

He's definitely less raw than Morin was in his first NHL camp, and it's debatable who is more raw at this juncture. I still feel Morin could use another couple years, one in junior and one in the AHL. The progress he's made in a year is stellar, but there's more to be done.

Sanheim looked a lot more polished and more poised in the games I saw him play than Morin has in some of the games I have seen him play this camp. Both have work to do, and I hope Morin, assuming he sticks around to open the season, is back in Rimouski before too long.

If you put a player like Andrew MacDonald on a team like LA, with their strong puck possession and team defense. He'd flourish there. Same thing with a team like Boston.
- MJL

But we don't have Doughty or Chara, or any combination of 2-3 other guys they have.

That's not necessarily true. With Sanheim being a year younger, and likely 2 years away from the minors, you take the longer term view and not worry about trying to coach him up yet. With Morin only one year away, he benefits more from the extended look and extra time with the coaches.
- TheGreat28

It is true. They didn't give any consideration to giving Sanheim an extended look. In terms of rawness, he is behind Morin. And age has a lot to do with it. It's only natural.
If Morin stays with the team after camp breaks, it's because they think he may be able to help them, and make them better, and they want an extended look to see if that is true in regular season NHL action.

But we don't have Doughty or Chara, or any combination of 2-3 other guys they have.
- TheGreat28

Exactly. But they do, and with the team play they have. It's why they can play Jake Muzzin on the top pair with King Doughty.

I think back to what Murray said about Ghost. It's not what he does in the 2 minutes that he has the puck on his stick that determines how good a player he is. It's what he does the other 20 minutes when the puck is not on his stick.

With Streit, it's not what he does in his 4-5 minutes of PP time a game. It's the other 18 minutes of ice time.
- TheGreat28

And Streit after adjusting in the early season, showed me that his game away from the puck, was a lot better then I thought it would be overall. Especially after some early season struggles.

- Crimsoninja

Hi

He's definitely less raw than Morin was in his first NHL camp, and it's debatable who is more raw at this juncture. I still feel Morin could use another couple years, one in junior and one in the AHL. The progress he's made in a year is stellar, but there's more to be done.

Sanheim looked a lot more polished and more poised in the games I saw him play than Morin has in some of the games I have seen him play this camp. Both have work to do, and I hope Morin, assuming he sticks around to open the season, is back in Rimouski before too long.
- Jsaquella

I agree. Really they all need some solid seasoning in juniors/AHL and then a couple of years of some ups and downs in the league before they truly blossom. That was the whole point on my hypothetical G for McDavid trade. If I remember you're not big on hypothetical discussions like that tho

I agree. Really they all need some solid seasoning in juniors/AHL and then a couple of years of some ups and downs in the league before they truly blossom. That was the whole point on my hypothetical G for McDavid trade. If I remember you're not big on hypothetical discussions like that tho
- TheGreat28

I wouldn;t move Giroux, because i think he can still produce at superstar levels as he gets older, barring injury.

He's a little guy, but he doesn't really rely on out and out speed as much as vision and quickness. He's at his most dangerous on set plays where he can set up and find holes in the defense. Age shouldn't have a huge impact on that