How can a team not show up though? And if they can, how is that acceptable?

As for the chicken and the egg argument, it can work both ways.
- NickTheKid87

It's not acceptable. But it happens. I wish I knew why.

If the Flyers play with more intensity, their chances of winning increase.

The Flyers roster, currently, is not more than a bubble playoff team.

Everyone agreed?

It's pretty easy to tell the difference between players or a team competing or not competing, versus simply making mistakes. As an example, the Flyers competed against NJ. But they just had so many breakdowns and mistakes in coverage, that it cost them the game. There is a clear difference.
- MJL

Also easy to tell the difference between playing a decent team and a great team.

NJ is not Chicago. This is where the emphasis on compete (imo) goes out the window. Its less about "rah rah lets go get'em", and more about smart execution and limiting mistakes. The Flyers did compete for the final 40 minutes of the hawks game. Hell, you could even say the final 50 minutes, but they still didnt sniff the Hawks.

If the Flyers play with more intensity, their chances of winning increase.

The Flyers roster, currently, is not more than a bubble playoff team.

Everyone agreed?
- jmatchett383

NO SHUT UP

Jesus guy.. the point is that they should not have to always "get up". That is what we have been trying to say for the past 26 hours. If you have team that needs to get up to have a good game you have a problem. Good teams execute night in and out. Not just about playing with intensity and compete. They get by with talent and smarts. What the hawks did to us had as much to do with their skill level throughout their line-up, their team wide commitment/execution within a two way game and fantastic coaching as it did with us not having high competitive drive. There is a reason they have that effect on teams. They execute so well it makes teams look slow and disinterested. They are the cream of the crop.

If you want to see a team nearly implode, watch the way the Flyers played immediately following that goal. I never said they imploded. They were able to hang on and get that empty netter, but it wasnt a breezy go of it.
- jak521

The Hawks didn't make the Flyers look disinterested. They were disinterested from the opening puck drop. It was obvious. And it snowballed from there. And yes, you do have to come out and play with jump from the opening puck drop. Especially when you're the team that is undrmanned and under gunned talent wise.
The Flyers didn't nearly implode. They played a solid game through 60 minutes. Not a perfect game, but a solid game.

YEEHAW! Last night was fun.

Maybe, but at least make it difficult for the opposing team. Don't just roll over and die after you lose the opening faceoff.
- MBFlyerfan

The Flyers sucked for 10 minutes.. The first 10 minutes of that game. They got better as the game went on. The problem is that for 10 minutes they were scatterbrained and all over the place, except for where they should be and you simply cannot do that against the Hawks.

If the Flyers play with more intensity, their chances of winning increase.

The Flyers roster, currently, is not more than a bubble playoff team.

Everyone agreed?
- jmatchett383

If they play with ANY intensity, their chances increase. Its seems that they lose games and get behind because they lack any intensity at all. This is what is most maddening.

But yes, they are a bubble team.

YEEHAW! Last night was fun.

- FlyersGrace

It's not acceptable. But it happens. I wish I knew why.
- MJL

Which is why I believe that the intensity level is more of an effect of execution (of course, when the intensity level drops from the previously poor execution, the execution will be further influenced. A cycle if you will). Because a causal relationship can be established. I just can't believe, based on nothing, that an entire team of NHL players who have worked their tails off to get to where they are would all not have a high compete level in games. I can understand a few guys here and there having bad games and the team having a bad game once and while, it happens. But for 15 of 18 players or whatever to just not have any "compete" for no known or understandable reason seems a bit out there.

Which is why I believe that the intensity level is more of an effect of execution (of course, when the intensity level drops from the previously poor execution, the execution will be further influenced. A cycle if you will). Because a causal relationship can be established. I just can't believe, based on nothing, that an entire team of NHL players who have worked their tails off to get to where they are would all not have a high compete level in games. I can understand a few guys here and there having bad games and the team having a bad game once and while, it happens. But for 15 of 18 players or whatever to just not have any "compete" for no known or understandable reason seems a bit out there.
- NickTheKid87

I don't think it's out there at all. This a long, grinding 82-game season. Those December-January days are nothing but a grind, and there's tons of games where teams just can't "get up" for them. Also, based on how rested you are, what the score is, how you practiced, how you've been playing, what's going on in your personal life...there's tons of reasons why players have trouble getting up for games. Sometimes, usually when it's a team-related issue, it spreads across the team, sometimes stemming from 1-2 guys and cascading.

I agree. My meaning was if the team came out to start the game with a low intensity level, that would be unacceptable. I can understand losing it because of poor execution and such or having it increase because of good execution. But if the Flyers came out of the locker room for the 1st period in Chicago and simply had a low compete level, that would not be ok.

I think against Chicago, they were outplayed early by Chicago plus were making their own mistakes and lost that edge, the intensity level. In Pittsburgh, they executed well to start the game and had some good PKs and that caused them to gain confidence and keep the intensity level up.

"Wanting it more" and "wanting it less" are more effects of execution, etc. than they are causes of it, IMO.
- NickTheKid87

I just think it's all about confidence. They know they can beat the Pens even if they fall behind by 3 goals. They went into that Chicago game feeling like they couldn't beat the Hawks.

Which is why I believe that the intensity level is more of an effect of execution (of course, when the intensity level drops from the previously poor execution, the execution will be further influenced. A cycle if you will). Because a causal relationship can be established. I just can't believe, based on nothing, that an entire team of NHL players who have worked their tails off to get to where they are would all not have a high compete level in games. I can understand a few guys here and there having bad games and the team having a bad game once and while, it happens. But for 15 of 18 players or whatever to just not have any "compete" for no known or understandable reason seems a bit out there.
- NickTheKid87

Yeah, it's not a monolithic thing. Intensity varies between individuals and is heavily influenced by feelings of confidence and morale. The good teams execute so well they can sap you of your team cohesion, and feelings of hopelessness can take over. They often even carry a mental edge into the game, and can have the other team on pins and needles before the puck is even dropped, making an early collapse all the more likely.

New blob

I'm not surprised by what I am reading, but at the same time, I am.

That looked like nearly every game the Flyers have played against Pittsburgh ever since Consol opened: Pens dominant for 10 minutes, get a goal. Flyers hold on, manage to tie goal despite looking like a vastly inferior team to that point.

Pittsburgh goes into a funk. Flyers play better. Pittsburgh ties, Flyers respond and win.

It was a nice win, and they needed it. But this is what they do against Pittsburgh. "Hunger" and "compete levels" we're laughable in those first ten minutes, when they couldn't even touch the puck on that one sequence.

New blob
- PhillySportsGuy

thank baby jesus

Yeah, it's not a monolithic thing. Intensity varies between individuals and is heavily influenced by feelings of confidence and morale. The good teams execute so well they can sap you of your team cohesion, and feelings of hopelessness can take over. They often even carry a mental edge into the game, and can have the other team on pins and needles before the puck is even dropped, making an early collapse all the more likely.
- Tomahawk

None of that explains how the Flyers can be the better team for 2 periods and carry a 3-0 lead into the 3rd period of a game, and then stop skating while the opposition, has a shooting gallery on your net, and you give up a 3-0 lead in the 3rd period of a game. What happened to the team cohesion, morale and confidence that should have been built up in the first two periods?

..


wrong thread nm