1 more wouldn't have hurt, it's the Florida Panthers for christ sake
- ob18

...who are 1 point behind us with 2 games in hand.

...who are 1 point behind us with 2 games in hand.
- 77rams

And in the end they'll be picking close to Buffalo & Carolina

Nah, there's enough heat on the kid.
- 77rams

I agree, he's not quite ready.

1 more wouldn't have hurt, it's the Florida Panthers for christ sake
- ob18

They're no pushover. They always compete, and one of the better defensive teams in the league. Flyers better be ready to play.

That's simply not accurate. In the first game of the season, Del Zotto played 20:22 of ice time against one of the top teams in the East. 18:55 against NJ, 19:57 against Ana, 18:43 against Dallas. 20:05 against Chicago. His icetime was down against Montreal and Dallas, because he played poorly.
- MJL

Talking about role. He's not a sheltered 3rd-pair guy anymore... he and Schultz are getting a larger % of ES icetime, and facing off against much tougher competition, and starting more in the DZ now.


MDZ ES TOI:

10/30 TB: 18:40
10/28 LA: 23:23
10/25 DET: 19:21
10/22 PIT: 16:18 (last game AMac played)
10/21 CHI: 17:21
10/18 DAL: 15:54
10/14 ANA: 18:09
10/11 MTL: 12:43
10/9 NJ: 16:57
10/8 BOS: 18:15 (last game Coburn played)

Icetime from BOS and CHI were probably influenced by those being the first of back-to-back games.

Edit: Grossmann got knocked out of the ANA game, IIRC.

Talking about role. He's not a sheltered 3rd-pair guy anymore... he and Schultz are getting a larger % of ES icetime, and facing off against much tougher competition now, and starting more in the DZ.


MDZ ES TOI:

10/30 TB: 18:40
10/28 LA: 23:23
10/25 DET: 19:21
10/22 PIT: 16:18 (last game AMac played)
10/21 CHI: 17:21
10/18 DAL: 15:54
10/14 ANA: 18:09
10/11 MTL: 12:43
10/9 NJ: 16:57
10/8 BOS: 18:15 (last game Coburn played)

Icetime from BOS and CHI were probably influenced by those being the first of back-to-back games.
- Tomahawk

That because of the injuries, and they don't have a choice. When Coburn and MacDonald come back, Del Zotto will go back to facing lesser competition, and starting less in the D zone. Which is exactly how a player like Del Zotto should be used. A Coach isn't going to cut icetime because of back to back games in the first couple weeks of the season.
You're premise that Berube didn't know what he had, before the injuries forced him to play Del Zotto more is simply false. In the first game of the season, against a top team, the only defenseman who played more were MacDonald and Streit. They both had 28 shifts to Del Zotto's 27.
Coaches play players more when the earn more. When they don't play well, ice time is cut. Other factors such as injuries come into play.

The pupil has become the teacher
- Giroux_Is_God

be afraid

be very afraid

That because of the injuries, and they don't have a choice.
- MJL

That's my point. Chief doesn't have a choice, and MDZ has played great. He wouldn't be getting this chance otherwise.

That's my point. Chief doesn't have a choice, and MDZ has played great. He wouldn't be getting this chance otherwise.
- Tomahawk

You're point was to criticize Berube. And it was a false criticism. And not recognizing that two of the team's top defenseman who normally would play in those situations are out injured, in addition to Timonen, as the reason for why an offensive puck moving defenseman like Del Zotto is seeing more D zone starts, and more icetime against better competition.

Lord knows I'm as guilty as anyone of slap-fighting, but since we all agree that Del Zotto's done well and taken advantage of an opportunity, can't we just be happy with that?

For example, I offer this topic change:

Last year, Andrew MacDonald's arrival helped stabilize Luke Schenn, to the degree where Schenn looked like a pretty good option for the third pair in going forward -- and yeah, I get it, we traded JVR for a third-pair defenseman, but we can't turn back the clock.

But wouldn't it be great if Coliacovo could do the same thing with Schenn, until Coburn returns? Coliacovo's been around the block and when he's healthy -- ha, ha -- he has roughly the same skillset as MacDonald. Maybe not quite the player MacDonald is now, but at least in the same ballpark.

Does anyone else think Coliacovo might be able to help Schenn stabilize a bit, or is that just me?

For example, I offer this topic change:

Last year, Andrew MacDonald's arrival helped stabilize Luke Schenn, to the degree where Schenn looked like a pretty good option for the third pair in going forward -- and yeah, I get it, we traded JVR for a third-pair defenseman, but we can't turn back the clock.

But wouldn't it be great if Coliacovo could do the same thing with Schenn, until Coburn returns? Coliacovo's been around the block and when he's healthy -- ha, ha -- he has roughly the same skillset as MacDonald. Maybe not quite the player MacDonald is now, but at least in the same ballpark.

Does anyone else think Coliacovo might be able to help Schenn stabilize a bit, or is that just me?
- AllInForFlyers

Wait and see. I personally think it is on Schenn. He's been just okay and average. Time for him to step up and raise his game.

Wait and see. I personally think it is on Schenn. He's been just okay and average. Time for him to step up and raise his game.
- MJL

Agree with that -- I wish the Flyers were past that with him, but he's getting to the age where I have to wonder if he's ever going to be a "set-and-forget" defenseman.

He's getting to the age where I'm starting to wonder if he's always going to need to play with someone who can help him play better, not vice versa.

Lord knows I'm as guilty as anyone of slap-fighting, but since we all agree that Del Zotto's done well and taken advantage of an opportunity, can't we just be happy with that?
- AllInForFlyers

Not until we try ghost at 4th line wing

Agree with that -- I wish the Flyers were past that with him, but he's getting to the age where I have to wonder if he's ever going to be a "set-and-forget" defenseman.

He's getting to the age where I'm starting to wonder if he's always going to need to play with someone who can help him play better, not vice versa.
- AllInForFlyers

My sand clock of patience with Luke Schenn is very low right now.

You're point was to criticize Berube. And it was a false criticism. And not recognizing that two of the team's top defenseman who normally would play in those situations are out injured, in addition to Timonen, as the reason for why an offensive puck moving defenseman like Del Zotto is seeing more D zone starts, and more icetime against better competition.
- MJL

Turns out that "offensive puck moving" guy can actually play two-way hockey... to your and Mr Berube's apparent surprise.

My sand clock of patience with Luke Schenn is very low right now.
- MJL

Still solid trade though

Grimaldi and Trocheck recalled by the Panthers. Bolland, Barkov and Pirri probably out.

Still solid trade though
- Just5

If Schenn was set-and-forget, consistent at 18 minutes a night, I wouldn't say a word. I really wouldn't. Because we can all see that defensemen are hard to get, and he plays a tough, hard game.

That's not me saying that it's completely fair value; I'm honest enough to admit that JVR's doing more things to help Toronto win than Schenn is doing for the Flyers.

But it's just tougher when Schenn looks so shaky that you have to acknowledge that a guy signed in August and a guy signed to be the seventh defenseman have CLEARLY outplayed him.

That makes it tougher to swallow.

That makes it tougher to swallow.
- AllInForFlyers

Hate that he's the lone, essential RH shot, too... makes it that much worse.

If Schenn was set-and-forget, consistent at 18 minutes a night, I wouldn't say a word. I really wouldn't. Because we can all see that defensemen are hard to get, and he plays a tough, hard game.

That's not me saying that it's completely fair value; I'm honest enough to admit that JVR's doing more things to help Toronto win than Schenn is doing for the Flyers.

But it's just tougher when Schenn looks so shaky that you have to acknowledge that a guy signed in August and a guy signed to be the seventh defenseman have CLEARLY outplayed him.

That makes it tougher to swallow.
- AllInForFlyers

D men are hard to get. Especially the slow plodding type. They are never available in the summer. To say that you can just go out and find a dman in free agency that bring the qualities that Luke brings, it can't be done

D men are hard to get. Especially the slow plodding type. They are never available in the summer. To say that you can just go out and find a dman in free agency that bring the qualities that Luke brings, it can't be done
- Just5

Your cruelty knows no bounds, I see.

Grimaldi and Trocheck recalled by the Panthers. Bolland, Barkov and Pirri probably out.
- Tomahawk

Barkov hurt?
I wanted to watch him.

Drouin, well in 2 years look out.
And that little Johnson, darting past guys. I guess they don't miss Marty StL that bad with him around.

Barkov hurt?
I wanted to watch him.

Drouin, well in 2 years look out.
And that little Johnson, darting past guys. I guess they don't miss Marty StL that bad with him around.
- Marc D

They will likely be enjoying those first round picks they got for him in a few years as well

Tune into the Wings/Kings game. Wings are just embarrassing the Kings...with quick in net...just not quick enough...