I don't think you'd get anything for either of them. It's a situation where the best return would be less of an impact on the salary cap-and that's a stretch, too.

Either way it's unlikely. I can't see another team having much interest in either.
- Jsaquella

In 35 years of watching, I would say an Umberger trade, with how he has played this season, would be one of the most stunning things I have ever seen

Would any of you guys consider trading a pick at the draft to get one of these guys off the team? It's really "selling" a pick more than anything. I would certainly entertain the idea so long as we aren't leaving a great pick on the board to do so.

In 35 years of watching, I would say an Umberger trade, with how he has played this season, would be one of the most stunning things I have ever seen
- AllInForFlyers

Gomez trade.

In 35 years of watching, I would say an Umberger trade, with how he has played this season, would be one of the most stunning things I have ever seen
- AllInForFlyers

I could live with Umberger if he was playing solid defense, but he's really been ineffective at both ends of the ice. We know Vinny can't play D, but Umberger has always been more of a two way player. But I don't feel he's playing good defense. He's losing puck battles. He's blowing coverages. He's making dumb and lazy plays with the puck.

I don't think you can fake it with Lecavalier. He either plays on a scoring line, and contributes points, or he is of no value. Even with Umberger not scoring, he can still play on the 4th line and contribute on the PK. Take away Lecavalier's offense, and there is nothing there.
- MJL

I haven't seen nearly enough out of Umberger to even make me pretend that is true -- and worse, his effort and intensity have been questionable at some points

Would any of you guys consider trading a pick at the draft to get one of these guys off the team? It's really "selling" a pick more than anything. I would certainly entertain the idea so long as we aren't leaving a great pick on the board to do so.
- hereticpride

What round?

But the whole point of a team moving a pick for a player is the "it makes us better now/sooner" aspect.
- hereticpride

If the Flyers moved Brayden Coburn to the LA Kings for a second round pick, it's a gamble for us because although we get cap relief, our team doesn't get better. We might draft a pretty good player but then again we might have drafted a career AHLer or a player unlikely to help our team better moving forward. With Coburn going to a place like LA (only for example), we might have potentially given Drew Doughty his new D partner, who might make him even better then what he already is.

On the flipside, I don't recall what the Oilers got in return for Nick Shultz but let's assume it was a draft pick, in which Columbus gave something away to get him and he never resigned with the Jackets.

Would any of you guys consider trading a pick at the draft to get one of these guys off the team? It's really "selling" a pick more than anything. I would certainly entertain the idea so long as we aren't leaving a great pick on the board to do so.
- hereticpride

How much of the contract would they lose? If somebody is willing to eat the entire ticket, I'd consider a pick going the other way. If that can be done, then I'd try to recoup picks by dealing others.

I haven't seen nearly enough out of Umberger to even make me pretend that is true -- and worse, his effort and intensity have been questionable at some points
- AllInForFlyers

He's as good of a defensive player, if not better, as Vandevelde and Rinaldo are. And is just as good if not better on the PK, then those two players are. He joins a long list of players who effort and intensity is to be questioned on this team to this point

What round?
- MJL

Certainly not the 1st. I would think it would have to be a 2nd rounder to entice another team. Maybe a combination of mid-round picks.

If the Flyers moved Brayden Coburn to the LA Kings for a second round pick, it's a gamble for us because although we get cap relief, our team doesn't get better. We might draft a pretty good play but then again we might have drafted a career AHL or a player unlikely to help our team better moving forward. With Coburn going to a place like LA (only for example), we might have potentially given Drew Doughty his new D partner, who might make him even better then what he already is.

On the flipside, I don't recall what the Oilers got in return for Nick Shultz but let's assume it was a draft pick, in which Columbus gave something away to get him and he never resigned with the Jackets.
- SuperSchennBros

If they moved Coburn for a 2nd round pick, I'd be screaming for Hextall's job.

When people talk about moving Coburn, they're talking about a significant return, like a very good prospect or 1st rounder along with other assets. If all Coburn gets you is a 2nd, you don't trade him

Gomez trade.
- MJL

The Gomez deal was horrific, but at less I could fathom the thought process, since he and aGionta had played well together before

What could a team possibly tell themselves to justify taking on Umberger and that contract? Hextall gets a pass because no one knew he would be this damn bad, but if a GM made that move now, I would fire him in a heartbeat, if I were the owner-- and before that deal was done

If they moved Coburn for a 2nd round pick, I'd be screaming for Hextall's job.

When people talk about moving Coburn, they're talking about a significant return, like a very good prospect or 1st rounder along with other assets. If all Coburn gets you is a 2nd, you don't trade him
- Jsaquella

Oh, I understand and I agree but to me a Coburn deal can only go down during the trade deadline if we feel completely out of it or wait until the offseason. Right now it's mid November.

He's as good of a defensive player, if not better, as Vandevelde and Rinaldo are. And is just as good if not better on the PK, then those two players are. He joins a long list of players who effort and intensity is to be questioned on this team to this point
- MJL

The problem with that is VandeVelde shouldn't be on an NHL roster and Rinaldo is a 11-13 forward, at best. And for a contender, neither should be playing

The Gomez deal was horrific, but at less I could fathom the thought process, since he and aGionta had played well together before

What could a team possibly tell themselves to justify taking on Umberger and that contract? Hextall gets a pass because no one knew he would be this damn bad, but if a GM made that move now, I would fire him in a heartbeat, if I were the owner-- and before that deal was done
- AllInForFlyers

Whether or not it could be justified taking on Umberger or not, it still wouldn't come close to the Ranger dealing Gomez and his 7+M cap hit, and getting Ryan MacDonagh in return. That deal is far more stunning then any likely Umberger deal would be.

The Gomez deal was horrific, but at less I could fathom the thought process, since he and aGionta had played well together before

What could a team possibly tell themselves to justify taking on Umberger and that contract? Hextall gets a pass because no one knew he would be this damn bad, but if a GM made that move now, I would fire him in a heartbeat, if I were the owner-- and before that deal was done
- AllInForFlyers

Gomez was also coming off a season where he was productive. He was tied for the team lead in scoring, averaged the most ice time among Ranger forwards, and on a team that was outscored 178 to 162 at ES, he was only a -2.

RJ has basically been an empty uniform for most of the season.

I don't know that any difference in the return would point to one player or the other. I disagree that Umberger has brought zero to the team. I'm not saying he's playing well. But even if he isn't scoring, he can still contribute. He can still play a checking role on the 4th line, and play on the PK.
If Lecavalier isn't scoring, he has no value to a team.
- MJL

Umberger isn't scoring nor is he playing an effective defensive role. He can't win board battles, looks lazy, and actually seems totally disinterested.
If he worked hard and was playing a solid defensive game, I would have more patience with him. He has done nothing so far. Laughton deserves more ice next game. RJ has no business being on PP, I know it's the coaches call but RJ is a waste out there.
I agree.. Vinny has to score too be effective. I still believe he can get 20 this year and if that was the case I would be fine with that

Oh, I understand and I agree but to me a Coburn deal can only go down during the trade deadline if we feel completely out of it or wait until the offseason. Right now it's mid November.
- SuperSchennBros

Are the Flyers playing on November 42nd?

The problem with that is VandeVelde shouldn't be on an NHL roster and Rinaldo is a 11-13 forward, at best. And for a contender, neither should be playing
- AllInForFlyers

You're making my point. So then it is true that Umberger could still help this team and contribute in a 4th line role. Because he is better than those two players are.

How much of the contract would they lose? If somebody is willing to eat the entire ticket, I'd consider a pick going the other way. If that can be done, then I'd try to recoup picks by dealing others.
- Jsaquella

They would need to take the nearly the whole contract I would think.

If Buffalo did end up with McDavid then Vinny wouldn't be that terrible of a guy to have around the kid. And they get a pick out of it too.

Idk, I was just thinking how Hexy said we might have to take a step back to go forward and I came of with the idea of "selling" a pick to get free'd from one of these deals.

Oh, I understand and I agree but to me a Coburn deal can only go down during the trade deadline if we feel completely out of it or wait until the offseason. Right now it's mid November.
- SuperSchennBros

I agree that, unless somebody comes to you and knocks your socks off with an offer, that the only time to deal Coburn is the TDL or summer...unless the tailspin continues and you can make a good value trade in the next few weeks.

Whether or not it could be justified taking on Umberger or not, it still wouldn't come close to the Ranger dealing Gomez and his 7+M cap hit, and getting Ryan MacDonagh in return. That deal is far more stunning then any likely Umberger deal would be.
- MJL

We can agree to disagree on that -- as bad as the Gomez deal turned out to be, taking two more years of Umberger at 4.6 is worse

Umberger isn't scoring nor is he playing an effective defensive role. He can't win board battles, looks lazy, and actually seems totally disinterested.
If he worked hard and was playing a solid defensive game, I would have more patience with him. He has done nothing so far. Laughton deserves more ice next game. RJ has no business being on PP, I know it's the coaches call but RJ is a waste out there.
I agree.. Vinny has to score too be effective. I still believe he can get 20 this year and if that was the case I would be fine with that
- 3flyerkids

I don't think Umberger has played well overall, but I disagree on not being able to win board battles, or that he's lazy or disinterested. I think he's extremely frustrated, and is in a deep funk. We'll see if he can come out of it. There's certainly been times where I wasn't happy at all with his play. But he's still a decent depth defensive forward. Although certainly not worth his cap hit. And I don't think he should be on the PP either.

Umberger had 2 points in the game against Pittsburgh, that means he has 1 point in the other 17 games. That's impossibly bad. I know it's not all about goals and assists, but he isn't bringing anything else to the table. Lecavalier when not putting up points is a tremendous liability. The Flyers are stuck with these players. There isn't any team out there that would touch either one with a ten foot pole.
- PLindbergh31

I guarantee you that if Akeson had the minutes RJ got, he would have done a lot more with them in terms of production... probably would have had at least 6 or 7 points, quite possibly more. RJ looks cooked...a bad pass here, a poor shot there, turnovers, bad coverage, failure to react/get to the play quick enough, losing puck races and battles...these are the kinds of things that are usually happening when a player is losing it...I hope he can pull out if it , but again, I cant help but think of the points that Akeson (or Laughton for that matter) probably would have put up in RJ's role...it. could have been the difference in some of these close games. It's a bit unfair to criticize based purely on hindsight after 20 games but things aren't looking to good the way they've been going for RJ ....so how long do you wait before demoting or finding a way to cut bait?

As for Akeson, he's so far and Berube's dog house, that he's in the dog house that's in the doghouse! Through some miracle I'm hoping that they find a way to get Vinny and RJ off the books and promote Akeson and Laughton...some needed cap space and better play and accelerated development of NHL ready prospects would be the likely result. I don't think flyers brass would have the gumption, let alone the opportunity, to pull that off at this juncture.... but it's a dream I have

They would need to take the nearly the whole contract I would think.

If Buffalo did end up with McDavid then Vinny wouldn't be that terrible of a guy to have around the kid. And they get a pick out of it too.

Idk, I was just think how Hexy said we might have to take a step back to go forward and I came of with the idea of "selling" a pick to get free'd from one of these deals.
- hereticpride

I'd consider it if they were free and clear of the contract.