The trade made sense in a lot of ways. Nobody expected Umberger to be this bad offensively. Not even the Flyers.
- MJL

Not when you consider the return. Philly could have traded Hartnell for prospects/picks to another team if they really wanted to clear his salary. Hartnell had a down year but by no means was immovable

Now moving him for a guy that was about to be amnestied is bad.

Especially since hextall could have gone and signed him as a UFA to a much more favorable contract if he just waited a couple days

A lot of the stats geeks warned that Umberger was going to be bad. His possession numbers were awful, and while he did score 18 goals, he also enjoyed his highest shooting percentage in 4 or 5 years last season.

If you don't like advanced stats, there were the plentiful rumors that Columbus was seriously considering using a compliance buy out on Umberger before the Flyers made the trade.

Hextall definitely should have had some sense of caveat emptor when considering the trade.
- Jsaquella

If you want to look at it from the perspective of Columbus was looking to buy him out. That has to be looked at from the proper perspective. If Umberger is just a 3rd line player, or worse a 4th line player. That's certainly not worth the contract he has. So it becomes a question of is the player worth his contract.

Not when you consider the return. Philly could have traded Hartnell for prospects/picks to another team if they really wanted to clear his salary. Hartnell had a down year but by no means was immovable

Now moving him for a guy that was about to be amnestied is bad.

Especially since hextall could have gone and signed him as a UFA to a much more favorable contract if he just waited a couple days
- FourFeathers773

This

Not when you consider the return. Philly could have traded Hartnell for prospects/picks to another team if they really wanted to clear his salary. Hartnell had a down year but by no means was immovable

Now moving him for a guy that was about to be amnestied is bad.

Especially since hextall could have gone and signed him as a UFA to a much more favorable contract if he just waited a couple days
- FourFeathers773

Might as well say they could've traded him for Stamkos then. Do you honestly believe that there were better deals out there for Hartnell, and Hextall turned them down in favor of Umberger? The trade made sense in a lot of ways.

It's speculation that Umberger would be bought out. He may not have.

Have the mumps been contained out west...maybe a 'sickness' can relegate a few players to the press box?
- dmorin

The Rangers' Glass has been sidelined with a case. Who knows how many have been exposed?

Still, mumps beats an outbreak of Captain Trips.

This is just doing to be a bad year, worse then what I thought it would be. I have a very hard time watching a complete game. I start watching hoping things will get better quickly realize it isn't. It's gotten to the Point I don't mind not watching games. I have better things to do.

A lot of the stats geeks warned that Umberger was going to be bad. His possession numbers were awful, and while he did score 18 goals, he also enjoyed his highest shooting percentage in 4 or 5 years last season.

If you don't like advanced stats, there were the plentiful rumors that Columbus was seriously considering using a compliance buy out on Umberger before the Flyers made the trade.

Hextall definitely should have had some sense of caveat emptor when considering the trade.
- Jsaquella

Aaron Portzline (@Aportzline) tweeted at 11:20 AM on Mon, Jun 23, 2014:
This is a huge lift off #CBJ GM Kekalainen. Club was contemplating a compliance buyout on Umberger if they couldn't move him before draft.

For all of the bad deals Homer did, Hextall's move for Umberger is just as bad if not worse. The Vinny and Umberger deals were just amateurish.

I know Vinny is Homer's.

Might as well say they could've traded him for Stamkos then. Do you honestly believe that there were better deals out there for Hartnell, and Hextall turned them down in favor of Umberger? The trade made sense in a lot of ways.

It's speculation that Umberger would be bought out. He may not have.
- MJL

It's pretty much known fact and it's the sad truth.

Bob mckenzie, portzline, and freidman all seperately reported hearing that cbj were going to buyout umberger if no one took him off their hands

MacDonald is not the problem. He's a quality defenseman that the team needed. It added a mobile two way 2nd pair defenseman. For now and for the future. None of the Flyers current defenseman are good enough individually to play this team out of this hole. Nor should they be expected to. In a team situation as dyfunctional as it is right now, defenseman are not going to look good.
- MJL

Macdonald is a problem...not the only one....but it's purely delusional to not think his play is a problem.

The Rangers' Glass has been sidelined with a case. Who knows how many have been exposed?

Still, mumps beats an outbreak of Captain Trips.
- tangent_man

Can we expose Umberger and Vinny to both?

A lot of the stats geeks warned that Umberger was going to be bad. His possession numbers were awful, and while he did score 18 goals, he also enjoyed his highest shooting percentage in 4 or 5 years last season.

If you don't like advanced stats, there were the plentiful rumors that Columbus was seriously considering using a compliance buy out on Umberger before the Flyers made the trade.

Hextall definitely should have had some sense of caveat emptor when considering the trade.
- Jsaquella

If a guy has awful possession numbers AND the team is healthy scratching him, you shouldn't expect him to go somewhere else and become a good player.

It's like the same people who thought Vinny would be better this season for some inexplicable reason. Bad players don't just get good after 30.

Macdonald is a problem...not the only one....but it's purely delusional to not think his play is a problem.
- landros 2

At this point it is easier to list those whose play isn't a problem.

It's pretty much known fact and it's the sad truth.

Bob mckenzie, portzline, and freidman all seperately reported hearing that cbj were going to buyout umberger if no one took him off their hands
- FourFeathers773

It was not a known fact. It was simply speculation. The quote you posted above by Portzline said that the Columbus GM was "contemplating" buying out Umberger

My guess?

1. Hextall knew he needed more cap flexibility when it came to the summer that Voracek, Couturier, Schenn & Coburn need to be re-signed.

2. Hextall figured that Schenn, Couturier and Read could up their games and assume Hartnell's scoring and Umberger could be a solid guy who could lessen their defensive roles.

3. Berube and Hartnell clashed, and the contract mess combined with age made him the easiest guy to move.
- Jsaquella

That all sounds about right....the Flyers hoped that some of these young guys were ready for more responsibility....the amount of term left on Hartnell's deal was scary....much like the biggest arguement against Vinny last year.....if he was this bad this early ? What the heck does the end of the deal look like?

It was not a known fact. It was simply speculation. The quote you posted above by Portzline said that the Columbus GM was "contemplating" buying out Umberger
- MJL

You're really delusional here

I know you're trying to find a silver lining here, but it's an all around terrible trade and the fact that the front office leaked to the press that they were going to buy him out if they couldn't trade him makes the move by hextall 1000000x worse with that information floating out there

Macdonald is a problem...not the only one....but it's purely delusional to not think his play is a problem.
- landros 2

You're looking at the statement from the wrong context. In terms of players that are signed long term, for now and the future, is what the statement refers to.

Right now, with the way the team is playing overall currently. Pretty much every player's current level of play, with the obvious exceptions, is a problem right now. And there's lots of players who deserve a game off.

It was not a known fact. It was simply speculation. The quote you posted above by Portzline said that the Columbus GM was "contemplating" buying out Umberger
- MJL

Even still its a bad trade to go and trade a perennial 20+ goal scoring power forward,part of your leadership group, for an injury prone, deteriorating player on the buyout block

At this point it is easier to list those whose play isn't a problem.
- LJF

Sad but true....but this was a long term free agent signing...to go south this quickly, is alarming.

Sad but true....but this was a long term free agent signing...to go south this quickly, is alarming.
- landros 2

So glad we didn't get sucked into the niskanen sweepstakes

You're really delusional here

I know you're trying to find a silver lining here, but it's an all around terrible trade and the fact that the front office leaked to the press that they were going to buy him out if they couldn't trade him makes the move by hextall 1000000x worse with that information floating out there
- FourFeathers773

Nothing delusional. You're just assuming incorrectly that they Blue Jackets were definitely going to buy him out. You also assumed that Hextall could've gotten pick and prospects instead. I haven't said that in hindsight, it's not a bad trade. I'm only looking at the situation at the time, and why I think it made sense is some ways. And why Hextall may have thought it made sense at the time. It's called being objective.

FWIW, one man's grades at the quarter pole:

Mason B+ : has been solid for the most part, occasionally spectacular. Not sure how much more he can do.

Emery B: Has done a good job in his role. Goaltending is not a problem for this team no matter what the national media thinks

Coburn D+ : Giving him a bit of leeway due to the time missed to injury, but overall his play has been seriously subpar.

MacDonald D: Maybe it's the pressure of the contract, more likely they are just asking too much of him. Either way he's been a big disappointment.

Streit B+ : Makes the occasional bad play defensively, but overall he's been the best of a bad bunch when it comes to the Flyer's D

Grossmann C: Been ok, not great, not awful, just ok

MDZ C+ : Has exceeded expectations, but, outside of a few strong games, he's been nothing special

L Schenn C-: Overall he's been ok, but seems to always make at least one bad mistake per game.

Schultz B- : Has done much more than expected, but seems to be tailing off over the last 2 weeks or so.

Colaiacovo Incomplete: Hasn't played enough to merit a grade.

Next up, the forwards.

Can we expose Umberger and Vinny to both?
- BiggE

That would be cruel and unusual...


Sure.

The hardest thing for me is that at the root of all this: this is for the most part the same team as last year.

You still have the core of G, Jake, Simmonds, Read, Couturier, the Schenns, Mason, Sreit. You can't tell me that Umberger, Del Zotto, and Shultz alone could phuck things up this bad?

Is Berube getting the most out of this team? Very debatable. I'll admit I was on the record that firing him wouldn't make much of a difference. Now, I don't know?

I just keep telling myself that these are professional athletes who need to man up and play their way out of this. To see guys aside from G, Voracek, and Mason take drastic steps backwards from just a year ago is mind boggling to me.

Seriously time to start considering trading Coburn, Read, and maybe even Grossman or Schenn. Get value for these parts while we can. None of those 3 guys are going to be apart of a solution here by the time Hextall finally gets an opportunity to sort this mess out. We obviously have some time before we may have to do this, but these are moves we at least need to start considering.

As much as I'd love to keep Coburn, we gave way too much of his money to AndyMac (who we are stuck with IMO). We would certainly get a healthy return for a player of his caliber. Ditto Matt Read. Both players would be huge additions to contending teams. A guy like Grossman may only net us some draft picks, but we'll get good value and it will clear us some cap space this summer.

This obviously doesn't help the whole Umberger/Lecavalier problem, but it's a start.