Homer built a pretty good team. People forget Homer brought in Voracek, Simmonds, B.Schenn, Coots Pronger and got all those great D propsects we continuously drool over. Homer also built this D which isn't great but what can you expect when your two best Dmen get career ending injuries. There is no way to replace a Chris Pronger, Homer tried to fix the D the best he could. He took a gamble on L.Schenn hoping he'd live up to the hype of his draft year, unfortunately didn't work that way. Despite some of the "bad" moves Homer still was a good GM. The unfair bit is when all these Dmen come up and the Flyers are good again Hextall will get all the credit when Homer drafted these guys.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

I think he made some really good trades starting out with moving Forsberg who wasn't sure about coming back, Coburn right down to what he got for frick and frack but at some point the pressure to win made for some bad moves and bad contracts. I wouldn't say overall he was a bad GM but where he has left this team is not exactly stellar. Yes they have a nice core and bright prospects but ths is a bad mix and they are stuck with some of it

I think he made some really good trades starting out with moving Forsberg who wasn't sure about coming back, Coburn right down to what he got for frick and frack but at some point the pressure to win made for some bad moves and bad contracts. I wouldn't say overall he was a bad GM but where he has left this team is not exactly stellar. Yes they have a nice core and bright prospects but ths is a bad mix and they are stuck with some of it
- nastyflyergirl

Coburn deal was a Clarke special wasn't it?

EDIT: Nope...one of Homer's first moves ...2/24/2007. Guess we can't blame this mess on 16

Coburn deal was a Clarke special wasn't it?

EDIT: Nope...one of Homer's first moves ...2/24/2007. Guess we can't blame this mess on 16
- Lexington Flyer

Coburn was a steal for Homer.

I think he made some really good trades starting out with moving Forsberg who wasn't sure about coming back, Coburn right down to what he got for frick and frack but at some point the pressure to win made for some bad moves and bad contracts. I wouldn't say overall he was a bad GM but where he has left this team is not exactly stellar. Yes they have a nice core and bright prospects but ths is a bad mix and they are stuck with some of it
- nastyflyergirl

Holmgren put a lot of eggs in the Pronger basket, when they broke, he scrambled. Trying to stay competitive, and not bite the bullet, led to some short sighted deals.

Hextall is now tasked with evaluating the organization. He wants to stay competitive, but he's not dumb. He realizes there's going to be some rebuilding pains. He also knows that simply firing Berube or making one trade won't fix things.

Like it or not we are in rebuild mode. Our core of forwards are young enough to still be in their prime when our 4 d prospects arrive and are playing a noral nhl shift. We basically have to wait this d core out. We should be giving d men away for picks and prospects. Coburn Macdonald schenn Grossman should all be available. 2 years from now we will have a pretty amazing team once the d prospects arrive. We also have aub kabul limbohlm to help bolster O in a couple years. We need 2 more solid drafts and we will be set for long term succes.
No question about it we need to be patient and wait it out instead of making playoffs losing in first round and getting a 15 or later pick we need a top 5 pick in the next two drafts and really bolster the farm. We need a couple elite prospects. A nun 1 pick this year would go a very very long way.

Yea, Homer built a stellar team.

The team he built is posed to miss the PO's twice since 2012. Last year when they did make it, they bow out in the first round. And he has a glut of questionable signings and immovable contracts on his resume.

How he missed winning the GM Of The Year award the past two years, I'll never know.
- 77rams

Looks like it went right over your head....... If Pronger does not get hurt, This team is a top contender for the Cup. He got hurt and is irreplaceable. Homer did his best to put a Band-Aid on the situation but you can't fix the hole Pronger left. Homer had the guys who were going to make the D better, they are still the guys in the minors

Didn't Downie get concussed in that Washington game and miss the little winning streak that followed?
- jmatchett383

No idea. Either way I don't see Steve Downie holding the Penguins back from much of anything. They have much bigger pieces that put them over the top. When I have see him play, he was playing well for the most part.

Didn't Downie get concussed in that Washington game and miss the little winning streak that followed?
- jmatchett383

i think downie and vinny both missed some time after that game

Hextall has shown his frustration with this team ( NYR game) now it is time to do something. They have to realize this is not a playoff calibre team. If there is a smart hockey trade... Make it. I would rather see him make some deals for picks at this point and not be gun shy considering he was roasted on the RJ deal.
- 3flyerkids

At some point within the year, we're going to need results. Whether it's a coaching change, Brayden Schenn and/ Sean Couturier putting up bigger offensive numbers or moves. Some are down on Homer and I feel it's a little unfair. I saw a GM who started the youth movement and did everything in his power to win. The trade deadline that brought us Coburn, Upshall, Biron, Parent and Kukkonen were all stroke of genius moves. Kyle Calder (worst trade in recent years) was gone quick. He made up for his mistakes. The following offseason that brought up Briere, Timonen, Hartnell, Lupul and Smith was the single greatest turn around I've ever seen in sports history. We went from last place to the Eastern conference finals.

Looks like it went right over your head....... If Pronger does not get hurt, This team is a top contender for the Cup. He got hurt and is irreplaceable. Homer did his best to put a Band-Aid on the situation but you can't fix the hole Pronger left. Homer had the guys who were going to make the D better, they are still the guys in the minors
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

True, but Holmgren basically bet farm on two 35 year old defensemen not only staying healthy, but continuing to be elite level players. After Pronger got hurt, he really scrambled to stay decent, when a rebuild was probably a better course of action

True, but Holmgren basically bet farm on two 35 year old defensemen not only staying healthy, but continuing to be elite level players. After Pronger got hurt, he really scrambled to stay decent, when a rebuild was probably a better course of action
- Jsaquella

It definitely unraveled for him at the end. And clearly there were (are) gaps in his team building strategy.

At some point within the year, we're going to need results. Whether it's a coaching change, Brayden Schenn and/ Sean Couturier putting up bigger offensive numbers or moves. Some are down on Homer and I feel it's a little unfair. I saw a GM who started the youth movement and did everything in his power to win. The trade deadline that brought us Coburn, Upshall, Biron, Parent and Kukkonen were all stroke of genius moves. Kyle Calder (worst trade in recent years) was gone quick. He made up for his mistakes. The following offseason that brought up Briere, Timonen, Hartnell, Lupul and Smith was the single greatest turn around I've ever seen in sports history. We went from last place to the Eastern conference finals.
- SuperSchennBros

I agree but like Jasq mentioned he did put all of his eggs in the pronger basket and when Pronger was lost for good the patch work really led the team to where they are now on defense. up until now the Flyers haven't had home grown dmen ready to step in. lets hope Sanheim, Ghost, Morin, Hagg and even Alt as a 5-7 changes that.

I am okay with writing off this season at this point if it means they move any of the following to significantly improve the team..thta improvement could come in the form of picks, prospects or players.

1. Defensemen 1-10 ..of all the dmen the only 1 i might consider keeping is MDZ just because he brings something this team lacks and that is a little attitude and fire. It's a shame because Streit is a really solid 3-4 guy at this stage in his career and he has actually played well for us. I know some shortsited people will point out the play yesterday and ignore the reality of his performance.

2. Every forward not named KevlarSocks, Voracek, Simmonds and Laughton.

3. Couturier only if he is in a package to get a legit number 1 dman or number 1 left wing under the age of 30.

4. I dont think anything needs to change with the goalies for the next couple of seasons TBH. Emery seems like a solid backup.

5. Add a little fire to this team. Cry all you want about playing a controlled game but they are essentially eliminated with how they are playing.. For a game or two dress Rinaldo, call up Rosehill , go insane and call up Stortini and say at least throw a hit or don't skate around like a bunch of cups of oatmeal out there. Other than Giroux, Voracek, Simmonds and Laughton that is how I feel when I see anyone on this team skating with the puck..Oatmeal in a cup. Just nothing exciting about them. "Oh look someone just nailed our captain and best player from behind 57 times,herp derp Im oatmeal and cant respond"

6. Berube isn't the right coach for this bunch but what does firing him now accomplish.

I am okay with writing off this season at this point if it means they move any of the following to significantly improve the team..thta improvement could come in the form of picks, prospects or players.

1. Defensemen 1-10 ..of all the dmen the only 1 i might consider keeping is MDZ just because he brings something this team lacks and that is a little attitude and fire. It's a shame because Streit is a really solid 3-4 guy at this stage in his career and he has actually played well for us. I know some shortsited people will point out the play yesterday and ignore the reality of his performance.

2. Every forward not named KevlarSocks, Voracek, Simmonds and Laughton.

3. Couturier only if he is in a package to get a legit number 1 dman or number 1 left wing under the age of 30.

4. I dont think anything needs to change with the goalies for the next couple of seasons TBH. Emery seems like a solid backup.

5. Add a little fire to this team. Cry all you want about playing a controlled game but they are essentially eliminated with how they are playing.. For a game or two dress Rinaldo, call up Rosehill , go insane and call up Stortini and say at least throw a hit or don't skate around like a bunch of cups of oatmeal out there. Other than Giroux, Voracek, Simmonds and Laughton that is how I feel when I see anyone on this team skating with the puck..Oatmeal in a cup.

6. Berube isn't the right coach for this bunch but what does firing him now accomplish.
- opeth_pa

Yup, there should definitely be some moves before the TDL to acquire picks/prospects, especially on the D side of things.

I have no problem with Berube as I can't on one hand acknowledge how many holes/problems there are on this team and on the other blame him for not having a better record. Further, we have no idea what actually happens on the ice at practice, in the locker room, or the influence of Hexy/management on personnel decisions like benchings and the sort.

A bit blunt, but if anyone cant for one (frank)ing time sit through a proper rebuild and some tough years, they deserve to have the ineptitude and chronic inconsistency we are so used to continually shoved up their ass.

That is all.

Yup, there should definitely be some moves before the TDL to acquire picks/prospects, especially on the D side of things.

I have no problem with Berube as I can't on one hand acknowledge how many holes/problems there are on this team and on the other blame him for not having a better record. Further, we have no idea what actually happens on the ice at practice, in the locker room, or the influence of Hexy/management on personnel decisions like benchings and the sort.
- wolfhounds

When they show up with no energy or effort it is on Berube, whether it is directly his fault or not. HC gets more credit in wins and more blame in losses, especially if they look inprepared or with lack of effort

When they show up with no energy or effort it is on Berube, whether it is directly his fault or not. HC gets more credit in wins and more blame in losses, especially if they look inprepared or with lack of effort
- CACannon18

So they panic and fire Berube now.

The question of who replaces him, and how much of a better chance are they going to have with this club arise. Don't get me wrong, I despise Berube on near J Stevens levels. The red flags started to rise with his handling of ice time in the playoffs last year.

Imo there is an opportune moment for these things. Its not now. Off-season when there is a better selection of coaches.

I see the same problems as everyone else, and unfortunately, a look at the standings makes it painfully obvious that we are at the point where only divine intervention gets them out of the lottery.

That sucks, but I get it now. After Giroux got cut last night, it was crystal clear where this franchise truly is.

But my concern is this: the Flyers have two elite players, and a quality starting goaltender. They have what I consider to be, at a minimum, a high-end two-way center.

They have a potent Power Play, with one forward who excels there more than at even strength. They have other complementary forwards. The defense is weak.

But it frustrates me that this year's team is not better defensively, as a whole.

It's OK if you're not a difference-maker offensively. There are only a limited number of Girouxs and Voraceks.

But what I don't see are guys who are killing themselves to make a difference defensively. If you aren't scoring, then you had better not be getting scored on. That is one of the most fundamental rules of two-way sports, and my concern is that there are too many Flyers who either can't or don't understand that, or are physically unable to execute a defensive system that keeps them in hockey games and helps them win them.

They literally have no attitude. No energy. No aggression.
Im not just talking about fighting either, I know it's not the NHL of the 90s and back anymore.
you can literally take every single player other than Griroux, Voracek, Laughton and Simmonds..throw them up in the air right now and say they are basically the same..

Almost good enough at something to be good.
Couturier ..excuses a plenty in year 4 why he cant do more. Almost good enough to be a 2 way center.
B Schenn..Line flopping and plays out of position..almost good enough to be a top 6 player.
Read.. Almost good enough to be a top 6 player.
Seriously beyond those 4 I listed above and one of them is a rookie..lines 2-4 are made up of almost good enough players and not a single one plays with an edge.

The only strong point this team has beyond Giroux , Voracek and Mason is the fact that the core of their almost good enough lineup is early to mid 20s and if we eat a season or two now should all be in their prime still when the D prospects get here.

So they panic and fire Berube now.

The question of who replaces him, and how much of a better chance are they going to have with this club arise. Don't get me wrong, I despise Berube on near J Stevens levels. The red flags started to rise with his handling of ice time in the playoffs last year.

Imo there is an opportune moment for these things. Its not now. Off-season when there is a better selection of coaches.
- flyer_nutter

I obviously do not know what's going on behind closed doors with the team, or how chief is viewed by management, but the effort looks bad, and that is the responsibility of the HC and his staff to motivate and teach, and neither looks like it's happening. Berube might be a great coach, but, IMO, not for this team, bc they have tuned him or the coaching staff out by the effort that they put on the ice

I obviously do not know what's going on behind closed doors with the team, or how chief is viewed by management, but the effort looks bad, and that is the responsibility of the HC and his staff to motivate and teach, and neither looks like it's happening. Berube might be a great coach, but, IMO, not for this team, bc they have tuned him or the coaching staff out by the effort that they put on the ice
- CACannon18

Not the coach's job to motivate his players. They need to motivate themselves.

That being said, I don't believe effort is their problem. They simply lack talent.

I see the same problems as everyone else, and unfortunately, a look at the standings makes it painfully obvious that we are at the point where only divine intervention gets them out of the lottery.

That sucks, but I get it now. After Giroux got cut last night, it was crystal clear where this franchise truly is.

But my concern is this: the Flyers have two elite players, and a quality starting goaltender. They have what I consider to be, at a minimum, a high-end two-way center.

They have a potent Power Play, with one forward who excels there more than at even strength. They have other complementary forwards. The defense is weak.

But it frustrates me that this year's team is not better defensively, as a whole.

It's OK if you're not a difference-maker offensively. There are only a limited number of Girouxs and Voraceks.

But what I don't see are guys who are killing themselves to make a difference defensively. If you aren't scoring, then you had better not be getting scored on. That is one of the most fundamental rules of two-way sports, and my concern is that there are too many Flyers who either can't or don't understand that, or are physically unable to execute a defensive system that keeps them in hockey games and helps them win them.
- AllInForFlyers

The good thing is that in a few years most of these guys wont be here. The poopty part of that is that during this cleansing you essentially burn the best years of G and V. That's the unfortunate thing but I don't see another realistic option.

In a cap era there are windows that open and close for each club. Sure a team may make the playoffs many years in a row but to have a realistic chance at the cup, that's the window. Flyers need to set a path to being an elite club for a few years, not this praying on hot streaks nonsense.

I for one, used heavy work hours to avoid watching them this year as an excuse. I've seen the least amount of games since the season that shall not be named. I'm not going to be spending my free time wasting it on poopty entertainment employing a boring hockey system by design. G an V are fun though, along with Mason.

I agree but like Jasq mentioned he did put all of his eggs in the pronger basket and when Pronger was lost for good the patch work really led the team to where they are now on defense. up until now the Flyers haven't had home grown dmen ready to step in. lets hope Sanheim, Ghost, Morin, Hagg and even Alt as a 5-7 changes that.
- nastyflyergirl

Yeah, except the only draft pick that belongs to Hextall is Travis Sanheim. Holmgren again caught his mistake took action by laying the ground work drafting much needed defensemen.

Let me ask, was trading for Chris Pronger a mistake? He put all his eggs into that basket but did Holmgren take a gamble and truly lose? You could make the argument that the last time a number one defenseman was on the market, the Flyers made an offer and got him. What is the market value on a number one stud defenseman these days? I have no idea because they're nolonger for sale. Heck, Holmgren may have brought up two true number one defensemen when you count Kimmo Timonen. Things change in a hurry.

I obviously do not know what's going on behind closed doors with the team, or how chief is viewed by management, but the effort looks bad, and that is the responsibility of the HC and his staff to motivate and teach, and neither looks like it's happening. Berube might be a great coach, but, IMO, not for this team, bc they have tuned him or the coaching staff out by the effort that they put on the ice
- CACannon18

Tuned him or out or not the time of blaming coaches (even though I do agree Craig is the wrong guy), and players needs to come to an end.

The turnover from coaches, to general philosophy (offense heavy/ d -first ), along with player turnover has been laughable. The one constant during that time was management, and the golden boy behind those teams is promoted to club president. Snider is still involved.

Now you have to hope that with Hextall a new approach will be taken, and he will have the final say into what happens with the team. Not sure that's the case with Holmgren and Snider still in the picture, but you have to hope I guess. We shall see.

I just find it comical when the owner and management publically rip their players, and go down to the dressing room to yell at them. You built the poopshow yourselves. This Berubian concept of the guys just having to "try harder and skate more" is foolish imo. Talent is the issue, not effort.

A bit blunt, but if anyone cant for one (frank)ing time sit through a proper rebuild and some tough years, they deserve to have the ineptitude and chronic inconsistency we are so used to continually shoved up their ass.

That is all.
- flyer_nutter

you da man