The market could change enough between now and the TDL...that Coburn could garner a first round pick...it depends on who the buyers are and how many teams stay in contention including the Flyers...Teams will over pay even more if there's no one else out there or the price for someone else is higher then they want to pay....
- landros 2

Flyers need to wait it out til the deadline. Teams will overpay for d it happens every year

Given Berube's affinity for Grossmann, I think the asking price may be more than teams will want to give up. Schenn on the other hand is still young and teams may be willing to take a flier out on him for a 2nd or 3rd.
- NickTheKid87

i hope to god that at this stage in the game berube has no say on who gets moved and for what price.

Flyers recall Ryan White.

Who is the odd man out?

Flyers recall Ryan White.

Who is the odd man out?
- hereticpride

MDZ probably gets waived, lol.

Why is Lappy still coaching? He hasnt even tried to change up this atrocious pk. Why did he switch up the strategy weren't they a top 10 unit last year? He should be the first player/coach out the door
- Just5

Feanor, you are right: Someone did (frank) up the PK, but the players still need to be better than this -- and if Lappy did it and can't figure out how to fix it, then yeah, no one should be safe

Flyers recall Ryan White.

Who is the odd man out?
- hereticpride

giroux

Flyers need to wait it out til the deadline. Teams will overpay for d it happens every year
- Just5

Agreed. I think Bill is way off the mark with his comments regarding the value of our D men.

i hope to god that at this stage in the game berube has no say on who gets moved and for what price.
- JoeRussomanno

I was thinking the same thing. Hexy should trade Grossmann for a GoPro camera and give it to Berube so he can film his trip home when he's shown the door this summer.

MDZ probably gets waived, lol.
- Tomahawk

Hopefully they dump Rinaldo for a 3rd or 4th.

Given Berube's affinity for Grossmann, I think the asking price may be more than teams will want to give up. Schenn on the other hand is still young and teams may be willing to take a flier out on him for a 2nd or 3rd.
- NickTheKid87

If the flyers waived Luke schenn today he'd go unclaimed

MDZ probably gets waived, lol.
- Tomahawk

Wonder if Giroux does go on the IR...tbh, nothing would surprise me today. Nothing

If this team is approaching Edmonton level, how do you expect young guys like B Schenn or Couturier to improve? Good players on bad teams don't look like good players. If the defensemen can't get them the puck, and there's no secondary scoring players on their lines, then they become much easier to defend.
- jmatchett383

I agree 100% but you can't fix the defense except thru the draft. Adding the last couple years of Seabrook prime isn't going to make the other 5 defensemen competent. The Flyers lost the cup to Chicago not just because of goaltending was crap, as Leighton wasn't all that worst than Niemi, but they couldn't out their 3rd on the ice seemingly without a goal going in. And that was with one of the best top 4 in the league at the time. Realistically you need 5 competent defenders to win a cup with a couple of elite ones in that mix. You can usually hide one guy like Chicago did with a young Leddy but the games are too close. I believe the last 5 cups winners all won a game 7 in overtime on their way to winning the cup.

I know every cites Edmonton as the example of a loser culture hurting players but IMO it is a better example of poor team creation. Edmonton tried to build a champion on the wings instead of down the middle and on defense. Also no ufas actual want to go to Edmonton and you need to supplement the young core with veterans. LA and Chicago each were as bad as Edmonton and have won 4 cups in 5 years.

But the whole winning culture crap is a farce. I thought the Flyers built a winning culture by winning all those meaningless games at the end of the 2013 season and fall out of the bottom 4 to the 11th pick. They promptly went 1-7 to start the next season. I think Seth Jones or even Sean Monahan would be helping more.

I was thinking the same thing. Hexy should trade Grossmann for a GoPro camera and give it to Berube so he can film his trip home when he's shown the door this summer.
- tangent_man

If the flyers waived Luke schenn today he'd go unclaimed
- Just5

With his salary and term, i definitely wouldn't bet he would

Wonder if Giroux does go on the IR...tbh, nothing would surprise me today. Nothing
- AllInForFlyers

Or Laughton.

I really wish injury and contract disclosure was more like the NFL.

Agreed. I think Bill is way off the mark with his comments regarding the value of our D men.
- hereticpride

Individually some of them have value and would be fine in a niche role on a playoff team. Except for Luke schenn. No one wants him

Or Laughton.

I really wish injury and contract disclosure was more like the NFL.
- Tomahawk

Exactly -- Giroux's cut has to be something that is going to need some time to heal, right? And I have no clue what is truly up with Laughton

In theory and/or NHL15, that's true. But the package for star player type trades are few and far between. The most recent example is probably the James Neal for Hornqvist/Spaling trade, and I really can't think of one before then in recent memory.
- jmatchett383

I would bruing up the Seguin deal. Boston got Riley Smith, Prospect Joe Morrow and Loui Erikson.

I guess what I am trying to say by using Simmonds as example is unless your moving the two stars or your young core their really isn't much that brings back great value. Simmonds could fetch a nice return to help bring in solid value.

I agree 100% but you can't fix the defense except thru the draft. Adding the last couple years of Seabrook prime isn't going to make the other 5 defensemen competent. The Flyers lost the cup to Chicago not just because of goaltending was crap, as Leighton wasn't all that worst than Niemi, but they couldn't out their 3rd on the ice seemingly without a goal going in. And that was with one of the best top 4 in the league at the time. Realistically you need 5 competent defenders to win a cup with a couple of elite ones in that mix. You can usually hide one guy like Chicago did with a young Leddy but the games are too close. I believe the last 5 cups winners all won a game 7 in overtime on their way to winning the cup.

I know every cites Edmonton as the example of a loser culture hurting players but IMO it is a better example of poor team creation. Edmonton tried to build a champion on the wings instead of down the middle and on defense. Also no ufas actual want to go to Edmonton and you need to supplement the young core with veterans. LA and Chicago each were as bad as Edmonton and have won 4 cups in 5 years.

But the whole winning culture crap is a farce. I thought the Flyers built a winning culture by winning all those meaningless games at the end of the 2013 season and fall out of the bottom 4 to the 11th pick. They promptly went 1-7 to start the next season. I think Seth Jones or even Sean Monahan would be helping more.
- psuhockey

Berube is captaining this tanker. Let's hope he's not overthrown

Flyers recall Ryan White.

Who is the odd man out?
- hereticpride

Dmen moved at the TDL:

2013-14
Raphael Diaz for a 5th
Meszaros for a 3rd
Schultz for a 5th
Rundblad + Brisebois for a 2nd
MacDonald for a 2nd, 3rd and Mangene
Robidas for a conditional 4th
Weaver for a 5th

2012-13
Regehr for two 2nds
Bouwmeester for Cundari, Berra, cond. 1st and cond. 4th
MA Bergeron for Hall and a 7th
Drewiske for a 5th
Hannan for a cond. 6th or 7th
O'Byrne for a 4th
Redden for a 7th

2011-12
Grossmann for a 2nd and 3rd
Kubina for Kalinski, cond. 2nd and a 4th
Quincey for Piche and a 1st
Zidlicky for Foster, Palmieri, Veilleux, a 2nd and a cond. 3rd
Commodore for a cond. 7th
N. Schultz for Gilbert
Aulie for Ashton
Oduya for a 2nd and 3rd
Zanon for Kampfer
Scott for a 5th


Obviously, situations are different from year to year because of the number of suitors on a player, contract lengths, salary cap, etc. so exact matches are next to impossible but this at least gives a rough idea of the last 3 years.

The problem is that they can't be worse.

You are last on the penalty kill. You are 23rd in goals against. Some of the only teams behind you are simply horrific defensively, like Toronto or Edmonton, or have had massive injuries or goaltending woes, like Columbus and Arizona.

The Flyers are absolutely trying to play defense and are only in front of some of the worst teams in the league who have clear issues.

I wanted these guys to play better, and thought they would. I hoped they would.

But they can't. For whatever reason, this is what they are, and the Flyers need to let them go as quickly as they can. Because they are not going to miraculously improve.
- AllInForFlyers

There is where I don't buy in. A fire sale of all the Flyers defenseman isn't the way to go. The problem isn't that the Flyers defenseman aren't good players. it's that they lack a legitimate top pair. If, and it's a big if, the Flyers had a legitimate #1 defenseman, the rest of the defense slotted correctly, the Flyers would have a solid defense. it's the mix of players, rather then the players as individuals that are the issue. As an example, Coburn as complimentary partner to a #1 is a strong player. As the lead defenseman on the team, not so strong. Grossmann as a top 4 2nd pair defenseman is just adequate at best due to his puck skill limitations. As a 3rd pair physical defensive defenseman, while overpaid for that role, is a solid player.
If they can get returns that make sense for a player, then go ahead and get it done. They shouldn't be trading any of the defenseman because the Flyers are forced to use them incorrectly in the wrong roles.

Or Laughton.

I really wish injury and contract disclosure was more like the NFL.
- Tomahawk

Injury disclosure in the NFL is all about gambling.

I strongly agree. But, this may be the year that a really smart GM really cashes in by going the other way. This draft has legendary expectations attached to it. Nobody wants to deal picks. Everyone wants gain more picks. Selling at the top can be a smart market strategy. If you have a potential top 5 pick (maybe win the lottery), you are going to want a huge return.
- spatso

tell that to the pens who just moved their #1.

Was it a popular trade when the Flyers moved Recchi to Montreal in '95? Or did that deal help them moving forward? There aren't a whole lot of attractive pieces on this team unless your moving your youth core of Schenn, Couturier, and Laughton or your two best players in Giroux and Voracek.

I am not saying Simmonds is Recchi but he could be a piece or a pice in a package to bring back value to make this club better.
- J35Bacher

I was talking from the perspective that a trade of Simmonds wouldn't net the return that Recchi did. I wasn't necessarily objecting to trading Simmonds as much as I was objecting to the reasoning of Simmonds not being a good ES player, as a reason to trade him.