- Tomahawk

damn straight, mutha(frank)a.

Sure, but their contracts didn't matter to the US selection team.



That's what made it particularly weird.
- Feanor

i thought they both should have made it.

Toronto may way to stop trading with Boston - Rask for Raycroft and and 2010 first (Seguin), 2nd (knight) and 2011 first (Hamilton) for Kessel. not that Kessel is a bust but I think I would have preferred to draft a Seguin and Hamilton than have Kessel
- nastyflyergirl

I argue this with Leaf fans weekly. Segueing and Hamilton...no question.

I argue this with Leaf fans weekly. Segueing and Hamilton...no question.
- 3flyerkids

yeah. obviously hindsight is clearer, but i dont think toronto expected to be as bad as the did once receiving kessel.

I feel sorry for Carlyle. They will never do anything with Phil and Dion as their core. Two players who should not be the centre of attention on any team especially in this market.
Nonnis should have taken the fall.

Since we're discussing ancient history, I'm still unhappy that the Flyers fired Ken Hitchcock. Should've never made that move. He got the shaft there. Discuss.
- MJL

If there's a man who is always evolving with the times and will always be relevant, it's Hitch. Apparently the guy went from initially being "offended" by statistical representations to fully embracing the movement and employing WOWY analysis to set his lines and matchups:

About the most candid response you might get from somebody associated with the NHL was something like what St. Louis Blues coach Ken Hitchcock offered before the season. He talked about how he used WOWY numbers (how a player performs with and without certain teammates) to help build line combinations and to figure out which groups were working and which ones were not. In an article written by Craig Custance of ESPN.com back in September, Hitchcock said this about line combinations and chemistry: "Chemistry is huge. It tells you basically how you're coaching. For instance, last year there were three players I played together that I thought had good chemistry. The data showed me otherwise. When I looked back at their shifts, the data was right. I kept putting it back together thinking it was working or would work, but it didn't work."

This is an example of a coach using analytics as a useful tool. The numbers told him a combination that he thought was useful actually wasn't, and upon taking a second look at their play, realized that the numbers were right. So, presumably, he changed it. If nothing else the numbers should give a coach or a general manager a reason to take a second look at a player, whether it be an internal evaluation or as a scouting tool for potential trades or free agent signings, to pick up on something they may have otherwise missed.

does it? i don't know. he's pretty much a fat (frank).
- hammarby31

that is beginner beer league fat tho

If there's a man who is always evolving with the times and will always be relevant, it's Hitch. Apparently the guy went from initially being "offended" by statistical representations to fully embracing the movement and employing WOWY analysis to set his lines and matchups:




- Tomahawk

Hitch is one of my favorite coaches in any sport. Smart guy and always a good interview.

If there's a man who is always evolving with the times and will always be relevant, it's Hitch. Apparently the guy went from initially being "offended" by statistical representations to fully embracing the movement and employing WOWY analysis to set his lines and matchups:




- Tomahawk

oh stahp. we all know its mumbo jumbo hocus pocus fruity magic.

that is beginner beer league fat tho
- nastyflyergirl

beginner beer league makes me angry too. man, do i need therapy.

Happy for Biggio. He'd be recognized as an all time great if he played in New York or Boston.

Who the (frank) didn't vote for Randy Johnson or Pedro?
- PhillySportsGuy

Don Zimmer?

Happy for Biggio as well. Jersey guy. I've met him and his wife down in Spring Lake, really nice people. A Seton Hall Pirate. A lot of people forgot he was a catcher early in his career. 3000 hits is no joke.

Hitch is one of my favorite coaches in any sport. Smart guy and always a good interview.
- johndewar

More Hitch, if anybody's interested:

http://www.stltoday.com/s...ec-8677-8a7eae054189.html

“The players wanted the line together,” he said. “We put it together thinking it was going to work. The data after 10 games said, get away from this line. It doesn’t work. Get away from it quickly because it’s a disaster. Three games later I finally stopped putting the line together because the data was off the charts bad. But visually, I thought it works. It didn’t get backed up by data and the analytical information was right on the mark. And it was stuff, I guarantee if I mention the names, you’d say that’s a great line. It should work. We’ve seen it before and (the line) was a nightmare.”

.

i thought they both should have made it.
- stayinthefnnet

Yeah, me too.

I suspect that, all things being equal, the guy that played in the US NDTP program will likely make it over the dude who played in the CHL if you're putting together a Team USA roster, however.

Fred Shero got the shaft. Flyers should have never let him go.

beginner beer league makes me angry too. man, do i need therapy.
- hammarby31

I think you need to start with the things that don't make you angry and work from there.

Don Zimmer?

Happy for Biggio as well. Jersey guy. I've met him and his wife down in Spring Lake, really nice people. A Seton Hall Pirate. A lot of people forgot he was a catcher early in his career. 3000 hits is no joke.
- PLindbergh31

Just grabs his whole (frank)ing head

Just grabs his whole (frank)ing head
- PhillySportsGuy

The crap Pedro took for that always puzzled me.

Was he just supposed to get his ass kicked by an 80 year old man?

yeah. obviously hindsight is clearer, but i dont think toronto expected to be as bad as the did once receiving kessel.
- stayinthefnnet

well maybe no 2nd but they did draft 7th the season before and the 2011 pick was 9th so they were already a pretty bad team and not sure how much Kessel alone was going to improve them. I guess I am just one to not want to trade top 10 picks. Granted Kessel was still young but still.

Just grabs his whole (frank)ing head
- PhillySportsGuy

I thought this was funny. I despise the Yankees. I was watching that game in a bar in Central NJ surrounded by these type of POS Yankee fans. They were all irate.

I thought this was funny. I despise the Yankees. I was watching that game in a bar in Central NJ surrounded by these type of POS Yankee fans. They were all irate.


- PLindbergh31

Back in those days, I worked with ALOT of Yankees fans. Just the worst.

I rooted HARD for the Red Sox during those playoff series. I celebrated the Sox winning that Series in 2004 like it was Phillies that won it.

Back in those days, I worked with ALOT of Yankees fans. Just the worst.

I rooted HARD for the Red Sox during those playoff series. I celebrated the Sox winning that Series in 2004 like it was Phillies that won it.
- johndewar

Yankee fans are the worst. An entitled group of dbags. If they don't have an all-star at every position with a 200+ million dollar payroll they cry like little infants.

Just grabs his whole (frank)ing head
- PhillySportsGuy

I want to put Darryl Strawberry in the HOF just for tackling Armando Benitez into the dugout. Jump to the 6:00 mark.

Back in those days, I worked with ALOT of Yankees fans. Just the worst.

I rooted HARD for the Red Sox during those playoff series. I celebrated the Sox winning that Series in 2004 like it was Phillies that won it.
- johndewar

I hate "Red Sox Nation." It's really more anti-Yankess nation. Everybody cried boo hoo for the Red Sox because they hadn't won in 580 years, so they're the popular team to like.

Then, all of "Red Sox Nation" cries boo hoo because the "Yankess buy their championships." So what do the Red Sox do? Go out and buy some championships. And it's totally cool that they do it. Bunch of whiny hypocrites.

I hate "Red Sox Nation." It's really more anti-Yankess nation. Everybody cried boo hoo for the Red Sox because they hadn't won in 580 years, so they're the popular team to like.

Then, all of "Red Sox Nation" cries boo hoo because the "Yankess buy their championships." So what do the Red Sox do? Go out and buy some championships. And it's totally cool that they do it. Bunch of whiny hypocrites.
- jmatchett383

My temporary Red Sox fandom was all about the obnoxious Yankee fans I worked with and schadenfreude. The horrible "THHAAA YANKEES WIN!" thing their radio guy does. And don't forget this guy who, to me, embodied every Yankees fan:



And it has been funny to watch the Red Sox become everything that Red Sox fans, themselves, used to abhor.

My temporary Red Sox fandom was all about the obnoxious Yankee fans I worked with and schadenfreude. The horrible "THHAAA YANKEES WIN!" thing their radio guy does. And don't forget this guy who, to me, embodied every Yankees fan:



And it has been funny to watch the Red Sox become everything that Red Sox fans, themselves, used to abhor.
- johndewar

I'm not gonna deny that Yankees fans are the most arrogant, obnoxious fans in North America after Montreal Canadiens fans. But the fact that everyone jumped on "Red Sox Nation" and Nomar Garciaparra was everyone's favorite player just made no sense to me. Joke's on them now, they are the new Yankees.