Leddy doesn't kill penalties, he is not used in a shutdown role and he is not used in a defensive role at the end of a game to hold a lead. If you watch the Islanders play as you say, you know that.

As for how "Cappy" manages his team vs how Quenneville manages his team .... Do you really want to go there? I mean my first comment will be a guaranteed Hall of Fame coach, third in all time wins with two cups and "Cappy"?????????
- paulr

As I said, circular argument with you Paul.
I'm out.

Curious, you didn't address the points that weren't subjective. If Leddy is even remotely good defensively why isn't he in a more prominent defensive role on a terrible defensive team, ie: he doesn't kill penalties, he isn't used in a shutdown role and he isn't on the ice in the final minutes of a game where the Isles are trying to hold a lead?
- paulr

Wasn't trying to start a fire over Leddy. Just saying Oduya's drop off continues to be a serious problem and, if he does not improve, an argument could be made Leddy would have been the better player to keep (in spite of his RFA status and agent) this year over JO.

If Oduya doesn't pick up his play then he will be walking for nothing this OS unless he takes a massive discount. An argument could be made trading JO would have brought a return last OS and Leddy could have still been traded next OS if he was asking for too much $$$. If Stan had a crystal ball IMO he would have jettisoned JO.

Woulda coulda shoulda. Leddy is gone.

At this point, Stan may need to target a 4d so Oduya can drop down. A lot of talk about a vet 5-6-7 D but the need looks greater to me.

Wasn't trying to start a fire over Leddy. Just saying Oduya's drop off continues to be a serious problem and, if he does not improve, an argument could be made Leddy would have been the better player to keep (in spite of his RFA status and agent) this year over JO.

If Oduya doesn't pick up his play then he will be walking for nothing this OS unless he takes a massive discount. An argument could be made trading JO would have brought a return last OS and Leddy could have still been traded next OS if he was asking for too much $$$. If Stan had a crystal ball IMO he would have jettisoned JO.

Woulda coulda shoulda. Leddy is gone.

At this point, Stan may need to target a 4d so Oduya can drop down. A lot of talk about a vet 5-6-7 D but the need looks greater to me.
- tredbrta

The Hawks defense has been top two all season with Oduya. The Isles defense has been at or near the bottom of the league all season with Leddy not playing a defensive role. The Hawks made the correct decision.

I will not disagree.

But if you've ever played a team sport and you have a guy routinely failing at critical times due to what appears to be a lack of focus/effort, it's not a good thing.

Also, his +16 is a real eye-opener, surprising, but I suspect also he is somewhat sheltered. And that there are stats that prove it. Certainly not going out agains the top lines in the league.
- John Jaeckel

Of course he is sheltered. To an extent. Mostly in TOI. He has less than a 100 games of experience. Who is being sheltered is Oduya. That is the real issue with the D. Well, relatively. They are still second in GA.

Don't get me started! I'm still upset Phil Esposito wasn't given a chance by Billy Reay and was traded for Pit Martin.
- paulr

The late Eddie Gold used to cover the Blackhawks in the 60s and 70s. He told me that Esposito was traded for doing impersonations of Rocky's uncle - and it was not flattering. Wirtz came into the locker room and overheard it - and the next thing you know - Phil was traded.

A must listen to

https://www.youtube.com/w...34&list=RD0iZDSsUTU34#t=0

Leddy struggled with his defensive responsibilities as a third pair dman

He certainly wasnt ready to be promoted as a no.4

You think Leddy is flourishing in NY right now? Wait until NYI get to the playoffs and other teams REALLY start bringing the heat on the forecheck again

Q trusted him a lot in season, but he clearly saw something he didnt like in Leddys play once the playoffs arrived
- FourFeathers773

i disagree, leddy could have done with hammer what he does with boychuk. was rozy serviceable or did leddy carry him? pretty valid argument imo.

not playing protected minutes and leading the islanders in relative corsi which is pretty cool stuff.

i buy the money argument but otherwise i think the islanders came out way ahead

oh well.

Great take JJ. My frustration.. besides the love of carbomb and Rundlad is the lack of size and physical players.

Is that Bowman or Q?

And who chose to massively over pay 51 and 29 without thinking thru the future caps?

A must listen to

https://www.youtube.com/w...34&list=RD0iZDSsUTU34#t=0
- Colbyboy

Yes it is! Thanks!!

The Hawks defense has been top two all season with Oduya. The Isles defense has been at or near the bottom of the league all season with Leddy not playing a defensive role. The Hawks made the correct decision.
- paulr

in terms of shot suppression at evens, detroit is the best in the league. the islanders are ahead of thevhawks in terms of total shots against at evens.

in terms of total corsi events against at evens detroit is winning and the islanders and hawks are tied.

pretty interesting. shows how valuable kooga and smith are on the pk.

also crawford has probs been their best defénder if goals against is the metric youre going to use to measure defense but thats rather limited.

Great take JJ. My frustration.. besides the love of carbomb and Rundlad is the lack of size and physical players.

Is that Bowman or Q?

And who chose to massively over pay 51 and 29 without thinking thru the future caps?
- jjcbeme

Part of the problem is where the Hawks have been drafting. The 'data' shows that undersized players are greatly undervalued in the draft, as well as US and Euros. Tis why the Hawks have drafted only 1 Canadian (IIRC) over the past two years.

The late Eddie Gold used to cover the Blackhawks in the 60s and 70s. He told me that Esposito was traded for doing impersonations of Rocky's uncle - and it was not flattering. Wirtz came into the locker room and overheard it - and the next thing you know - Phil was traded.
- dahawks8819

Unfortunately Tommy Ivan traded an All Star left wing (Ken Hodge) and a solid center (Fred Stanfield) with Phil.

Can you image the Hawks with Mikita flanked by Hodge and Wharram/Cliff; Bobby, Espo and Chico; and Dennis Hull, Stanfield and Pappin?

Then this falls under "I could be completely wrong".


- MNHawk

The Hawks aren't planning to sign him (the guy on the PTO). The Hogs would, so the contract space wouldn't apply (unless the Hogs have a limit also and they are up against that limit).

The Hawks aren't planning to sign him (the guy on the PTO). The Hogs would, so the contract space wouldn't apply (unless the Hogs have a limit also and they are up against that limit).
- BearsnHawks

No no no. He is just the first domino to fall.

Great take JJ. My frustration.. besides the love of carbomb and Rundlad is the lack of size and physical players.

Is that Bowman or Q?

And who chose to massively over pay 51 and 29 without thinking thru the future caps?
- jjcbeme

Wasn't 51 Tallon's signing?

Wasn't 51 Tallon's signing?
- 333inthe3rd

Pretty sure he meant Crawford.

Still talking about Zus when he hasn't been on the team in a year and is somewhere in Slovokia. Sigh...
- biegs

Still can't under stand reading and context. snore..

Do yourself a favor and don't kick the bear. Especially when you have ZERO to add to any discussion.

Still talking about Zus when he hasn't been on the team in a year and is somewhere in Slovokia. Sigh...
- biegs

Still can't under stand reading and context. snore..

Do yourself a favor and don't kick the bear. Especially when you have ZERO to add to any discussion.

Ive probably watched at least 15 games of his

Ill tell you he is playing the exact same game there as he did here
- FourFeathers773

Yes, agree, except now getting top 4 minutes on one of the top performing teams in hockey. On a 40 point pace roughly. With a higher plus minus then most Hawk Dmen. Keep spewing the narrative...if it is repeated enough...it must be true.

The insanity of all this crap of Q or team protecting this guy or that guy. It is the freaking NHL not kindergarten cops. Leddy clearly has proven he can play and will only improve.

The Hawks defense has been top two all season with Oduya. The Isles defense has been at or near the bottom of the league all season with Leddy not playing a defensive role. The Hawks made the correct decision.
- paulr

Probably.

Leddy may never be Oduya defensively. However, Leddy's career arc is up and Oduya's is down. This is really about Oduya's play this season. If he played like 13 this would be no contest (other than age). Oduya still has time to get it together but right now his plummet is causing the whole d group to fall. Hammer and O are no longer the shut down pair and they are relying too much on Seabs/Keith/Hammer. Q is trying to respond by mixing the pairs. With O and Rundblad (Rosi too) being turnover machines under pressure teams can turn up the hitting on all the D men which is creating more punishment for the top guys.

Leddy is a moot issue now. Unfortunately he was the only D who could really be traded, and a trade had to be done because of the salary cap. Let's wait to see what the prospects who came the other way do before we keep harping on this deal ad nauseam.

If Oduya never got hurt, Leddy is still blocked from being a top 4 D. Because he did get hurt, the trade market for him was likely impacted. Nobody wanted Rozsival's contract. So they traded Leddy. Because they had to trade Leddy. No need to debate his upside. We didn't get value for Buff or Ladd in the end, either. Life goes on.

Leddy is a moot issue now. Unfortunately he was the only D who could really be traded, and a trade had to be done because of the salary cap. Let's wait to see what the prospects who came the other way do before we keep harping on this deal ad nauseam.

If Oduya never got hurt, Leddy is still blocked from being a top 4 D. Because he did get hurt, the trade market for him was likely impacted. Nobody wanted Rozsival's contract. So they traded Leddy. Because they had to trade Leddy. No need to debate his upside. We didn't get value for Buff or Ladd in the end, either. Life goes on.
- 333inthe3rd

Look. You are new here. This particular conversation has been going for quite some time. Its a vortex you really need to think about getting caught in.

On the bright side. If you don't like how it turns out today, wait a week or so, you will have another chance at it.

I was reading on another hockey website that Anaheim is looking for LW help. We all know Bob Murray loves big players. What about Bickell for Stoner?

damn preds winning again with another 1 goal game...every game is a one goal margin...

that team has really turned it around...they are going to be very tough in the playoffs

Nice Blog JJ, spot on.

It's easy for fans to get caught up in seeing former players succeed in other places, but sometimes hard to understand that unless the player is a true superstar, like a Kane or Toews, then they are just pieces or assets that clubs need to their advantage (real or imagined).

As you said, players like Pirri and Hayes were not bad players, they were just in a position where the Hawks coaches and management had them behind others in the organization. Their games also came with shortcomings (such as Pirri's poor defensive zone play) which either made them expendable/tradeable, or elevated others over them. Some of them have decent stat lines, but it needs to be taken into account the increased minutes and opportunities.

Realistically speaking, who do you really regret losing? Who does Pirri or Hayes replace? Forget about Skille and Olsen, they are NHL no-entities for the most part.

For all the complaining about Bickell, he is a MUCH better player than either Pirri or Hayes over 200 feet of Ice, as is Shaw. They can't and wouldn't replace Smith or Kruger on their best days, and neither would fill the role that Carcillo fills.

So all that being said, you move them for whatever you can get in return. Other teams know this, so the returns will not necessarily be high, other teams are not necessarily bending over backwards to help the Hawks. Same with Morin. Is he filling the net? I think not. You take shots on guys and hope they work out. Erikson? who knows. Maybe one of the picks you got for Pirri works out or becomes a trade chip, at this point the Hayes & Olsen for Versteeg looks like a Hawks win.
- TheTrob

You didn't ask me but there isn't one player I would regret losing if I were Bowman except Ryan Stanton. Because he could have been a #6-#7 dman here for years and they got nothing for him. The others who were forwards were not going to crack the top 6 and I never thought much of Hayes.