I've been wanting Vernette here for years, but unless Sharp, Hossa, Bickell, Shaw, etc get off their ass and earn their paycheck, Vermette, Glencross, Sekera, or anyone else on "the list" or currently moved off of it, aren't going to put this team over the top. Lombardi gets full marks for addressing needs, filling them, and getting results. But what about teams that acquire guys & don't end up with a Cup?

Rangers got St. Louis...no Cup..at least not yet. Parisi/Suter? No Cup yet for them. Miller to St. Louis? ....Bryz to Philly? Vanek to MTL? Iginla to the Avs? Phaneuf to Leafs? Heatly all over the place, Iginla to Pittsburgh...how many ppl said "just hand them the Cup" after that deal? Brad Richards...had a Dog & Pony show in Toronto with teams lined up to make their pitch to get Brad to come there....including the Kings, who had Gretzky involved I believe to kiss his butt to come to LA. I'm sure they are thrilled that never panned out. Kovalchuk? Did he bring NJ a Cup? LA was all over him too...again, I'm sure they are happy it never happened.

Point is, lots of teams give up lots for free agents/trade deadline deals that don't end up in a Cup victory. The guys listed above were highly coveted at one point by one or more teams...sometimes it's a great fit, and sometimes it's not. Is there a player out there that puts the Hawks over the top? Without Kane, I'd say no, but Stan still needs to do whatever he can to fill needs and has Kane's Cap space to do it, but unless the core guys play a heck of a lot better than they have in 2015, putting Jesus Christ on the Wing won't help. Jmo.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and Stan is certainly not above criticism. But can we please dispense with the Stan missed out on Carter and Kesler arguments in addition to the Toews/Kane contracts crippling the team.

Carter and Kesler - if Stan acquired one of those two it would have caused cap issue in the short term and long term. In the short term we'd looking at something like losing Sharp is get Carter or Kesler. Would that have really improved the team? We could argue either way, but the difference would be minimal. In the long term it's likely that Carter or Kesler would have been gone this off season just like Sharp will be. This argument is old and been rehashed several times over, enough is enough.

Toews and Kane - can I please hear some more female doging about how we have two of the top elite forwards in their prime locked up for the long term. It's easy to say that Stan should have signed these guys for $9 - $9.5 million, but none of us were in the negotiations and know what options were available. For all we know Toews and Kane wanted $12 million and Stan got them down to $10.5. This is the cost of doing busy and having 2 superstars on the team. The only other option would have been to trade one or both of them. How would that have worked out? Anyone complaining about these contracts should remember the days when the ABC line was our top unit. So I'll say it again, to those who think Toews and Kane are paid too much - boo (frank)ing hoo, get over it.

Regarding the this trade deadline, yes Stan needs to make a move and yes his job became more difficult. But can we wait until the deadline has passed before ripping Stan apart. If Stan does nothing then he deserves whatever he gets, but until then lets show some patience.
- DarthKane

On a team loaded at wing and weak at center? Yes.

No one is ripping "Stan" apart. Has a challenge (and a cogent argument) been laid for "Stan" to step up and join the ranks of big boy GMs? Yes.

agreed, and if what Bob McKenzie was saying the other day about Toews going to management, he better!
- dsav123

Didn't see that. Details?

You're right, didn't know Yandle was 5mil+...
- SUDA88

They are both on expiring contracts so with the LTIR $ from Kane and Bickells $, it may work..

Excellent piece John...

I will be on with Boomer today at 12:30 CST talking about many of the points in your blog.

My issue is twofold...Is Petry/Vermette enough of an add to get to the 3rd round??
And....
Can Bowman at this point after Toew/Kane new deals(upcoming cap issues) take the chance to trade a 1 or 2 top Ice Hogs for basically rentals??

On Twitter@AlCimaglia
- Al

Exactly. Yes trade hogs but not for rentals.

I understand the frustration of the Hawks not going out and signing needed pieces but I think a big reason for that is the fact the Hawks, more than any team, has more cap tied up in their core group. Toews, Kane, Keith, Sharp, Hossa, Crawford, Hjalmarsson and Seabrook take up over half the team’s cap. The Ducks don’t have the same core expenditures, LA doesn’t so they both have the flexibility to be in on another high price big name player. Because LA doesn’t have the same expensive core they can use their cap room to build team depth. If the Hawks move some bigger contracts like Sharp, Bickell, Crawford and possibly Seabrook they open up some valuable cap space to allow them to build more depth in the team but probably not to be in a position to be in on deals to add higher priced players either through trade or free agency.

I’m not so sure this about if Bowman is better or worse than another GM because he can’t add more higher priced players to the team as much as it is about the architecture of the teams in question.
- paulr

WHO, Paul, with all due respect, is responsible for the salary (at least) architecture of the Hawks today?

Excellent piece John...

I will be on with Boomer today at 12:30 CST talking about many of the points in your blog.

My issue is twofold...Is Petry/Vermette enough of an add to get to the 3rd round??
And....
Can Bowman at this point after Toew/Kane new deals(upcoming cap issues) take the chance to trade a 1 or 2 top Ice Hogs for basically rentals??

On Twitter@AlCimaglia
- Al

This is precisely what I argued in the last blog.

Everyone wants Bowman to makes moves to compete this year - again... the thought of losing a Toews/Hossa/Seabrook et all contract year is .... sad. However, with the impending cap crunch next season... can he really afford to trade players (that other teams would demand in a trade) that will be contributing minutes on the big league club next year?

That's why I'm quite interested to see where he goes this season.

agreed, and if what Bob McKenzie was saying the other day about Toews going to management, he better!
- dsav123

what was said?

Excellent write up, sir.

I'm reminded of Jerry Krause - inherited a generational player, had one good draft (Pippen and Grant) - and did nothing but fill in for about 6 years - wouldn't move picks for help (even tho his picks in all but one year were bad - ok, Kucic was pretty good), always used the salary cap as a reason for not making splashes. Because of the nature of basketball, it worked for 3 championships.

Then Jordan left for 2 years, Grant left, Jordan came back - but without a PF, more championships were problematic.

So he made the one big-splash move of getting Rodman, and 3 more championships.

Bowman needs to make some moves, or more championships are problematic. The powers that be need to decide whether they should go all in for this year, or give up on this year and start selling because of the cap - I don't know which would be best, but pick one - if it's decided that this isn't the Cup year, ok, but start the rebuild now - not next summer.

One more point: 9 of the 18 skaters have been Hawks since the first Cup - that's 6 seasons now with almost exactly the same core - the top-3 defenseman, 4 of the top6 forwards - and the same head coach - in a free-agent and capped hockey world, what is the shelf life of a core group sticking together and being effective that long with almost no turnover?

Vermette and Yandle

for

Bickell, Hartman, Pokka, McNeill, and a 1st?

or is that too much?
- SUDA88

3 things...

1) Bowman doesn't trade 1st round picks.
2) Cap situation would be worse next year
3) Vermette is a rental and Stan hasn't traded for a rental, he always trades for guys he can re-sign or at least has a chance to re-sign.

Excellent piece John...

I will be on with Boomer today at 12:30 CST talking about many of the points in your blog.

My issue is twofold...Is Petry/Vermette enough of an add to get to the 3rd round??
And....
Can Bowman at this point after Toew/Kane new deals(upcoming cap issues) take the chance to trade a 1 or 2 top Ice Hogs for basically rentals??

On Twitter@AlCimaglia
- Al

This is the dilema.

Buttttt If the Hawks dont think they are going to win they need to Sell Sharp and others . Get a head start on 2016 then.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/...RDceZs/s1600/mcguire2.jpg

Him and Pierre from the same mold[/img]

Didn't see that. Details?
- John Jaeckel

supposedly McKenzie reported that Toews went to management to express frustration...i should have said in the original post...

it was discussed in the comments of at least one of your blogs a few days ago...can't corroborate.

If what people are saying McKenzie reported...

Sorry if it came across as unclear and vague.

Excellent write up, sir.

I'm reminded of Jerry Krause - inherited a generational player, had one good draft (Pippen and Grant) - and did nothing but fill in for about 6 years - wouldn't move picks for help (even tho his picks in all but one year were bad - ok, Kucic was pretty good), always used the salary cap as a reason for not making splashes. Because of the nature of basketball, it worked for 3 championships.

Then Jordan left for 2 years, Grant left, Jordan came back - but without a PF, more championships were problematic.

So he made the one big-splash move of getting Rodman, and 3 more championships.

Bowman needs to make some moves, or more championships are problematic. The powers that be need to decide whether they should go all in for this year, or give up on this year and start selling because of the cap - I don't know which would be best, but pick one - if it's decided that this isn't the Cup year, ok, but start the rebuild now - not next summer.

One more point: 9 of the 18 skaters have been Hawks since the first Cup - that's 6 seasons now with exactly the same core 3 the top-3 defenseman, 4 of the top6 forwards - and the same head coach - in a free-agent and capped hockey world, what is the shelf life of a core group sticking together and being effective that long with almost no turnover?
- StLBravesFan

Jordan came back in the 94-95 season and played the final 17 games & post season. They won three championships in a row starting the following season.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and Stan is certainly not above criticism. But can we please dispense with the Stan missed out on Carter and Kesler arguments in addition to the Toews/Kane contracts crippling the team.

Carter and Kesler - if Stan acquired one of those two it would have caused cap issue in the short term and long term. In the short term we'd looking at something like losing Sharp is get Carter or Kesler. Would that have really improved the team? We could argue either way, but the difference would be minimal. In the long term it's likely that Carter or Kesler would have been gone this off season just like Sharp will be. This argument is old and been rehashed several times over, enough is enough.

Toews and Kane - can I please hear some more female doging about how we have two of the top elite forwards in their prime locked up for the long term. It's easy to say that Stan should have signed these guys for $9 - $9.5 million, but none of us were in the negotiations and know what options were available. For all we know Toews and Kane wanted $12 million and Stan got them down to $10.5. This is the cost of doing busy and having 2 superstars on the team. The only other option would have been to trade one or both of them. How would that have worked out? Anyone complaining about these contracts should remember the days when the ABC line was our top unit. So I'll say it again, to those who think Toews and Kane are paid too much - boo (frank)ing hoo, get over it.

Regarding the this trade deadline, yes Stan needs to make a move and yes his job became more difficult. But can we wait until the deadline has passed before ripping Stan apart. If Stan does nothing then he deserves whatever he gets, but until then lets show some patience.
- DarthKane

Further, any comment that they should have taken a discount to help win future championships doesn't understand the business. These were the two marquee stars of this current CBA, and it was their duty to every player in the league, now and in the near future, to set this now new standard of a $10+m/year deal. They never would have been "allowed" to take a discount if they wanted to.

One of the best pieces of sports journalism I've read in a long time. JJ 4 Hart!
- arps714

I'll second that. It's the best online hockey read I've ever seen.

We all want SB to succeed....we know what we need and the league all knows what we need and every general manager will try and get the best deal he can and the best general managers will fill the holes

SB has never been accused of overpaying in a deal, that's what he's always afraid of........but he does tend to overpay at contract time

Excellent piece John...

I will be on with Boomer today at 12:30 CST talking about many of the points in your blog.

My issue is twofold...Is Petry/Vermette enough of an add to get to the 3rd round??
And....
Can Bowman at this point after Toew/Kane new deals(upcoming cap issues) take the chance to trade a 1 or 2 top Ice Hogs for basically rentals??

On Twitter@AlCimaglia
- Al

Bergenheim and Tlusty went very cheap and both would have helped this team with no commitment going forward. That was a miss IMO.

Vermette - who knows what the cost is but for sure Maloney is shooting for a home run. The Hawks won't likely be the team to give him that regardless.

Excellent write up, sir.

I'm reminded of Jerry Krause - inherited a generational player, had one good draft (Pippen and Grant) - and did nothing but fill in for about 6 years - wouldn't move picks for help (even tho his picks in all but one year were bad - ok, Kucic was pretty good), always used the salary cap as a reason for not making splashes. Because of the nature of basketball, it worked for 3 championships.

Then Jordan left for 2 years, Grant left, Jordan came back - but without a PF, more championships were problematic.

So he made the one big-splash move of getting Rodman, and 3 more championships.

Bowman needs to make some moves, or more championships are problematic. The powers that be need to decide whether they should go all in for this year, or give up on this year and start selling because of the cap - I don't know which would be best, but pick one - if it's decided that this isn't the Cup year, ok, but start the rebuild now - not next summer.

One more point: 9 of the 18 skaters have been Hawks since the first Cup - that's 6 seasons now with almost exactly the same core - the top-3 defenseman, 4 of the top6 forwards - and the same head coach - in a free-agent and capped hockey world, what is the shelf life of a core group sticking together and being effective that long with almost no turnover?
- StLBravesFan

Load the gun up for one big shot seldom works in hockey....It did in 2010 but they had no real choice....It was all in by default. If it didn't work then half the team still had to go...But really no other choice because of new deals at same time for Toews/Kane/Keith.

WHO, Paul, with all due respect, is responsible for the salary (at least) architecture of the Hawks today?
- John Jaeckel

No one has been a bigger critic of StanBo than I, but he is in somewhat of a no win situation. He had to sign #19 and #88 to the deals he did. After winning the cup and the impact #29 had, there would have been an outcry if he didn't get a new deal. You can argue #50's extension but at the time, locking him up looked like the right move.

Now you can argue the amounts, but not knowing what the player was using as leverage is something only StanBo and the agent know.

Bickell should have been the one to go. Brouwer is exactly what this team needs.
- powerenforcer

To be fair, at the time, Brouwer was pretty abysmal in the playoffs and Bickell stepped up big time. Not saying I prefer Bickell, but I see why he was kept.

WOW! That was just an awesome piece thanks JJ! I am so with your analysis and conclusions. Now do us a favor and somehow get this message into into Stan's hands so that maybe he absorbs some of this. I am so tired of having an inept GM at the helm if indeed he is even at the helm.

PS - I would really like to get Stewart from BUF (someone who will hit, go to the net and get some gritty goals on a good team and who is NOT A SMURF!!) as well as Vermette and a solid defenseman (Petry) to replace Rozsival (who by subtraction alone is an addition). This will require us trading some SMURF's (Shaw, Smith...) but it gives us a fighting chance!

Excellent piece John...

I will be on with Boomer today at 12:30 CST talking about many of the points in your blog.

My issue is twofold...Is Petry/Vermette enough of an add to get to the 3rd round??
And....
Can Bowman at this point after Toew/Kane new deals(upcoming cap issues) take the chance to trade a 1 or 2 top Ice Hogs for basically rentals??

- Al

Good point Al...will be listening to today.

I agree, i don't think mortgaging the future would be the way to go. But according to most rumors, the pieces going are Raanta & Danualt/Hartman with a couple of picks.

Not what i would call mortgaging the future...AND they will rebuild a lot of that future with the returns for any combo of Sharp/Bickell/CC/Shaw this off season...

Bergenheim and Tlusty went very cheap and both would have helped this team with no commitment going forward. That was a miss IMO.

Vermette - who knows what the cost is but for sure Maloney is shooting for a home run. The Hawks won't likely be the team to give him that regardless.
- RickJ

What pisses me off about Arizona and Vermette now is that for the few years the "league" owned them, all the owners shared in the cost of that team. Now there should be some kind of discount to get any player off that team.

This is the dilema.

Buttttt If the Hawks dont think they are going to win they need to Sell Sharp and others . Get a head start on 2016 then.
- mrpaulish

Isn't that more readily accomplished around draft day though?...it just seems, that, the situation of unexpected injuries, tragedies, and future cap concerns give mngment both a reason and an excuse to not make major changes until offseason.

I wanted vermette years ago...but I agree with Al, the prospects you trade for someone like vermette are supposed to be the cheap prospects that play for us next year after vermette is gone.

Jordan came back in the 94-95 season and played the final 17 games & post season. They won three championships in a row starting the following season.

- CaptainBlackhawk

You seem to have missed my point - read further on - the second three championships (IMO) were problematic without a major move by Krause.