I think that hit he took might have rattled him a bit.
- tangent_man

great

Raffl takes some shots. But I think it's more that Vinny and Rino have 7 goals between them and they deserve the extra ice time.
- wolfhounds

Talking about icetime in the game last night?

It doesn't matter in the context of the opposition players he is going to face individually, game in and game out, which is what I'm saying. He's still going to have to play against top defenseman, and will be the focus of the opposition every game. I clearly said that if the rest of the team gets better, there will be less weight on Giroux in a previous post.
- MJL

If G is in a slump and another line is hot, you think the opposing team's top defenders are still going to focus on G?

If G is in a slump and another line is hot, you think the opposing team's top defenders are still going to focus on G?
- wolfhounds

It could change depending on the flow of a game, but game in and game out, Giroux is going to consistently face the top opposition defenders.

great
- -davies-

Hey, it ain't gospel. I could very well be talking out my ass, as usual.

Also could just be a showcase issue. Raffl ain't going anywhere.
- tangent_man

Yeah, I was being facetious. He might have gotten rattled a bit from that hit. Although wasn't there a game not long ago where Rino got more es ice time than G? The Berube way?

Zac Rinaldo had 13:03 even strength TOI. That was more than Claude Giroux, Jakub Voracek, Michael Raffl, and Vinny Lecavalier. The worst part about all of this, is that Rinaldo spent 6:02 of game time in the penalty box (while accumulating 12 penalty minutes). Through two periods, Rinaldo was second on the team in 5v5 ice time. What if he hadn’t spent the last 6 minutes of the game in the box? He could have easily finished top 3 in even strength ice time.

It's easier to shut them down as a team. It doesn't matter if Giroux plays on a good team or a bad team. Whether he's on the same line with Voracek or not. He's still going to be the focus of the opposition, and will have to play against the oppositions top checkers and defenseman. If the team becomes stronger, that will undoubtedly place less weight on Giroux, but he will still need to be the teams top player, if they're going to have success.
- MJL

Of course it matters.

If G is on a good team, or if the Flyers had two lines that were legit scoring threats, things get a bit easier for him, especially when he's in a slump as he currently is in.

Let's just say G and the 1st line is in a slump but the 2nd line is hot, where are the top defenders of opposing teams going to be focused?
- wolfhounds

I agree, it matters for sure. Plus the original post says it, "If the team becomes stronger..." then he will be on a good team and it will have made a difference. Also I disagree that Giroux "still needs to be the teams top player if they're going to have success." Someone else could develop into the teams best player or a franchise defenseman could rise up through the system, in which case Giroux might not have to be the team's best player.

Yeah, I was being facetious. He might have gotten rattled a bit from that hit. Although wasn't there a game not long ago where Rino got more es ice time than G? The Berube way?
- wolfhounds

Teacher's pet.

It could change depending on the flow of a game, but game in and game out, Giroux is going to consistently face the top opposition defenders.
- MJL

Sure, because right now there's no reason for any team to ever do anything but focus on G, even when he's slumping. But if the Flyers had a legit #2 line, deciding to focus the best defenders on G wouldn't be nearly as easy as it currently is for other teams.

I agree, it matters for sure. Plus the original post says it, "If the team becomes stronger..." then he will be on a good team and it will have made a difference. Also I disagree that Giroux "still needs to be the teams top player if they're going to have success." Someone else could develop into the teams best player or a franchise defenseman could rise up through the system, in which case Giroux might not have to be the team's best player.
- kellyblaise7

The opinion was rendered from the context of Giroux being and remaining the team's best player. Not from the context of a hypothetical situation where some other player might become the team's best player. Right or wrong, I'm assuming that Giroux will remain the team's best player for the foreseeable future.

Sure, because right now there's no reason for any team to ever do anything but focus on G, even when he's slumping. But if the Flyers had a legit #2 line, deciding to focus the best defenders on G wouldn't be nearly as easy as it currently is for other teams.
- wolfhounds

That's why Berube tried all the line juggling; just trying to make something happen on another line to alleviate the pressure on G.

I think the main issue in regards to "leadership" is that this is a different season for these core guys than what they are used to. of course we struggled, but we did have a shot at the playoffs, we picked up our play and we got x amount of points in the last x amount of games, then the deadline comes, and we ship out two veteran defensemen. And we all know, we are not a better club without Kimmo and Coburn. I think this was a slap in the face for Giroux. we all know how big of a competitor he is, but when your team is pulling through together and getting points, and then basically get a message from management through those trades that we aren't a playoff team, when they do have a shot, thats a kick in the balls and has to frustrate players some way. Of course, this is excluding the games against lesser teams that we lost, because i think those losses point to Berube more than our players' play. Leadership being questioned tho, i mean Giroux earned that C imo. Simmonds is a great vocal and physical leader. and Streit we all know he's a great leader, guy was also a former Captain himself.

Sure, because right now there's no reason for any team to ever do anything but focus on G, even when he's slumping. But if the Flyers had a legit #2 line, deciding to focus the best defenders on G wouldn't be nearly as easy as it currently is for other teams.
- wolfhounds

It wouldn't be nearly as easy for the opposition to do so, but that doesn't change what the Flyers need from Giroux, and what he's going to be faced with.

I am very surprised that Eddie has been so patient.....he must be on his yacht traveling
- vejim

Or in Philadelphia watching and worrying about his hockey team, as he often seems to do.

It doesn't matter in the context of the opposition players he is going to face individually, game in and game out, which is what I'm saying. He's still going to have to play against top defenseman, and will be the focus of the opposition every game. I clearly said that if the rest of the team gets better, there will be less weight on Giroux in a previous post.
- MJL

While him facing top defensive match ups each game is true, the part that cannot be accounted for is whther or not a more balanced scoring output from other lines reduces the inherent pressure that gets exacerbated on him and Vorachek and makes them grip their stick too tight and press.

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1. Make general point.
2. Argue that no one understands your point.
3. Belitte others in a non-direct yet condescending way.
4. Pat self on back.
5. Repeat step 2.
- jmatchett383

lol hes such a turd

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- mochoson

I would leave a spot on the D for a prospect. Morin and Ghost both put up strong arguments last training camp. I like the idea of G on the wing, though.

dubs

While him facing top defensive match ups each game is true, the part that cannot be accounted for is whther or not a more balanced scoring output from other lines reduces the inherent pressure that gets exacerbated on him and Vorachek and makes them grip their stick too tight and press.
- juiced

That's a good point, the pressure of having to carry the offensive load could be a cause of frustration and causing them to press. Still Giroux has the 8M contract. Comes with the territory. I don't deny that he needs help, and the team has holes. All I'm simply saying is that I think he can be better then he has been down the stretch.

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- mochoson

In my opinion, it's a bad move to put Giroux at Wing. I don't see Raffl as a full time center either.

I would leave a spot on the D for a prospect. Morin and Ghost both put up strong arguments last training camp. I like the idea of G on the wing, though.
- JAKEw1234

They can certainly try to earn playing time. Ideally? I think Morin and Ghost at least start the year in the AHL. I think Morin should spend most of the year down there, I could see Ghost splitting time. Sanheim should go back to Junior and play in the WJC, but after next season he may be ready to step right in. He might be good enough now, because IMO he should be in the AHL next year with the rest of them.

I foresee Hagg being the fist of any of these guys to see significant time. He's quitely having a pretty good 1st year on NA ice and will have the most accumulated pro experience come next training camp. Very excited about him and Cousins next year.

The opinion was rendered from the context of Giroux being and remaining the team's best player. Not from the context of a hypothetical situation where some other player might become the team's best player. Right or wrong, I'm assuming that Giroux will remain the team's best player for the foreseeable future.
- MJL

Its also hypothetical to say, "If the team becomes stronger" too. I understand you're of the opinion that Giroux needs to play consistently well for the team to have success, whether the team is as mediocre as it is now or better or worse. I agree with the sports cliche that team's best players need to consistently be their best players. But I think you began to mix your contexts up from current situation to hypotheticals. That's what caused the confusion. I think it is contradictory to say that it doesn't matter if the team is good or bad in one sentence and then say that if they were a stronger team it would promote the success of Giroux's play.

In my opinion, it's a bad move to put Giroux at Wing. I don't see Raffl as a full time center either.
- MJL

I've been impressed with Raffl at center and am at least willing to keep experimenting with him there. G is going to produce no matter where you put him IMO.

In my opinion, it's a bad move to put Giroux at Wing. I don't see Raffl as a full time center either.
- MJL

G on wing would be good to try since we have Schenn who seems to struggle on wing. They could try

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